Lower wishbone bushes C5 / Xantia

cachaciero · Post by **cachaciero** » 14 Oct 2009, 17:33

On the C5 the lower rear wishbone bush is or should be a force fit onto the wishbone, Citroen recommend the use of a tool which sets the correct angular relationship between the bush and arm during the fitting operation, this is so that the bush is correctly torqued when the suspension is at correct ride height, presumably under these conditions there is close to zero "wind up" of the bush.
The Xantia while different in detail is very similar with similar Citroen tool set.

Question: does have anybody have a procedure to fit these bushes accurately without Citroens setting rig?

Cachaciero

Post by **CitroJim** » 14 Oct 2009, 18:19

I have always carefully noted the position of the old bush before removing it and then putting the new bush on in the same position. It's not hard to do, just check and mark the angle the flat piece makes relative to the wishbone.

I do believe, although I've never seen it, that OEM bushes have an alignment mark which corresponds with a dot punched on the end of the wishbone.

You're right about them being set in a specific position to prevent excessive wind-up or pre-load on them when the suspension is at normal ride height.

cachaciero · Post by **cachaciero** » 14 Oct 2009, 18:58

Hi Jim

Nice one, thanks for that, it has set the grey matter of on a different path to the one it was on:-)
I guess that I could use a steel straight edge clamped on the flat part of the old bush to scribe a line on the shaft then when fitting the new one it's only a question of clamping the straight edge on the new bush and aligning to the mark on the shaft.
Can the new bushes be driven on using an appropriate bit of tube and a hammer, and as importantly can the old ones be driven of the same way or would it be better to cobble up some kind of extractor / puller.

Cachaciero

andmcit · Post by **andmcit** » 14 Oct 2009, 20:12

The parallel pictured below must be within 8mm:

Andrew

citronut · Post by **citronut** » 14 Oct 2009, 21:03

after breaking/removeing the main outter part, i cut the old inner sleave off with a cutting disc on an angale grinder, but be very carefull not to cut into the spigot/post,

then i use an apropriate deap socket and a club hammer to drift the new one back on

regards malcolm

Post by **CitroJim** » 14 Oct 2009, 21:28

I use your method to replace them Malcolm but for me any cutting implement near the wishbone is risky. A nick could result in a stress-riser and one broken wishbone.

I've used a blunt cold chisel and club hammer to tap the bush off. Well, perhaps "tap" is the wrong word, eh Gareth?

A better word would be wallop!

andmcit · Post by **andmcit** » 14 Oct 2009, 21:39

When grinding off the old inner bush sleeve you can just tell from the heat
pattern on the fresh face of the cut area where you're "thinning" down to
the original inner boss on the wishbone end.

I see nobody has dared even utter a word on the horrid little sh!t that is the
front mushroom bush! A Devil of a job to remove - I did discover grinding the
widest end shoulder off the heat transfer dropped the middle out when the
rubber gave up! Takes some getting out that's for sure and you'll need
a handy vice/press and big socket to press the new one in.

Andrew

Post by **CitroJim** » 14 Oct 2009, 22:04

andmcit wrote: I see nobody has dared even utter a word on the horrid little sh!t that is thefront mushroom bush! A Devil of a job to remove

You're not wrong there Andrew

A press is a real necessity for those...

A shame a press is very little use for removing a P bush but it's OK for replacing one though... Actually better than hammering it on. I hate hammering any bush or bearing if I can help it but when doing the job away from home it's necessary as a press is not exactly portable...

cachaciero · Post by **cachaciero** » 14 Oct 2009, 22:25

[quote="andmcit"]

I see nobody has dared even utter a word on the horrid little sh!t that is the
front mushroom bush! A Devil of a job to remove - I did discover grinding the
widest end shoulder off the heat transfer dropped the middle out when the
rubber gave up! Takes some getting out that's for sure and you'll need
a handy vice/press and big socket to press the new one in. Takes some
getting out that's for sure and you'll need a handy vice/press and big
socket to press the new one in.

Andrew

Gulp! and I thought looking at the drgs that the front one would be dead easy!

Cachaciero

andmcit · Post by **andmcit** » 14 Oct 2009, 22:49

cachaciero wrote:
andmcit wrote:
I see nobody has dared even utter a word on the horrid little sh!t that is the
front mushroom bush! A Devil of a job to remove - I did discover grinding the
widest end shoulder off the heat transfer dropped the middle out when the
rubber gave up! Takes some getting out that's for sure and you'll need
a handy vice/press and big socket to press the new one in. Takes some
getting out that's for sure and you'll need a handy vice/press and big
socket to press the new one in.

Andrew

Gulp! and I thought looking at the drgs that the front one would be dead easy!

Cachaciero

The flashbacks for the job were quite harrowing so that'd be the reason
for my losing the plot in my last post!

The perils of cut and paste!

Andrew

cachaciero · Post by **cachaciero** » 14 Oct 2009, 22:56

Sounds like some cobbled up pullers might be useful, anybody got any dimensioned drgs of the bushes?
Would it not be possible to use a three leg puller with a split collar behind the bush to pull the rear one off ?

For the front one I thought a suitable sized length of threaded rod through the bush into a length of tubing couple of suitable sized washers and then screw the bush out into the tube but this does depend on the flange of the bush being smaller in diameter than the diameter of the metal it is going into. Certainly can't see why a length of threaded rod and some washers couldn't be used to press the new one in.

Just re-visited the CIt docs for this and that's exactly what they use. In fact looking closer I now see that what I have just worked out for myself is pretty much the way that Citroen do it albeit disguised in a jig.

Cachaciero

andmcit · Post by **andmcit** » 14 Oct 2009, 23:14

I like neat clean (and quiet!!) engineering solutions if possible - I'd be
very surprised if a threaded rod and some nuts and washers will do the
job adequately but am quite happy to be proven wrong.

A decent vice and some big sockets got the new smaller front bush on
without too much problem but the torque needed in closing the vice
was immense. Please take some piccies of the job - I can see why folk
appear to wimp out and buy arms off ebay with the bushes already on
from new!

Andrew

XantiaMan · Post by **XantiaMan** » 14 Oct 2009, 23:30

CitroJim wrote:I use your method to replace them Malcolm but for me any cutting implement near the wishbone is risky. A nick could result in a stress-riser and one broken wishbone.

I've used a blunt cold chisel and club hammer to tap the bush off. Well, perhaps "tap" is the wrong word, eh Gareth? A better word would be wallop!

Nout wrong with walloping a bush just wear protection... (for your feet

)

citronut · Post by **citronut** » 15 Oct 2009, 09:11

Andrew wrote
"I can see why folk
appear to wimp out and buy arms off ebay with the bushes already on
from new!"

as you have mentioned it Andrew i have a brand new genuine OE front wishbone for and ACTIVA cant remember which side without digging it out, but it is for sale

regards malcolm

cachaciero · Post by **cachaciero** » 15 Oct 2009, 10:04

andmcit wrote:=
I can see why folk
appear to wimp out and buy arms off ebay with the bushes already on
from new!

Andrew

Yes so can I

probably the only thing stopping me is unspoken questions about quality of such items.

Cachaciero