My crunchy 2nd gear

Bren · Unread post by **Bren** » 12 Jul 2009, 12:57

Why does it get worse when the engine/ box is hot? I was hoping that it may be clutch drag but it only does this when 2nd gear is engaged. Syncro/ baulk rings maybe? It does'nt give me any trouble from cold.

Gear oil has been changed and replaced with correct stuff, although it does leak, I am worried that it has been run low in the past (before I purchased it - I am a very conscientious owner).

I start a new job in a couple of weeks and I won't have the opportunity to mess about getting the box replaced.

As always, your view are appreciated.

Unread post by **Peter.N.** » 12 Jul 2009, 23:19

Strange because synchro problems usually improve as the gearbox warms up. If you can put it in and out of gear with the engine running and clutch fully depressed without it crunching, its the gearbox

dieseldoggy · Unread post by **dieseldoggy** » 13 Jul 2009, 11:55

could be clutch drag when warmed up or oil is thicker when cold so don't always get it to crunch.2nd gets about the most wear on way up the box weak spot if memory serves me right? If you can't sort out for a while? why don't you just double declutch? for those that don't know! clutch down out of gear clutch up push down into gear then release and away you go... then going back down! sim just have to blip throttle to get near engine speed. idea is to match load on both sides so meshes easy.
If you're realy good you can go up and down without using clutch at all!

Unread post by **Old-Guy** » 13 Jul 2009, 16:25

In this family, it's called double de-crunch! I do it out of habit when changing down.

Unread post by **myglaren** » 13 Jul 2009, 18:19

Could it have an incorrect grade of oil in?
Some of the boxes HAVE to have I believe 75/80W but on oil changes a lot of people, garages included, think that 90W is fine - it isn't!

falling-out-with-my-car · 15 Jul 2009, 11:26

I agree 75/80w is what you need but I always had a similar problem with second gear getting hard to mesh when the engine was hot now I add wynns transmission lubricant to every gear oil change it claims to seal leaks as well and costs about a fiver for a tube to treat 2 litres of oil which is more than enough when the xantia box holds 1.9 litres of oil from empty, at oil change if the box has not been fully drained over night you only need about 1.8litres of gear oil Including the addative mixed in.

it might also pay to wrap some PTFE tape (from a plumbing shop) around the thread of the gearbox drain bolt before reinserting it into the bottom of the box this helps to prevent any oil running throught the threads.

I also use this on the engine sump nut.

the wynns addative seems to improve gear change quite a bit. I found that the box wines a lot without the extra addative, mixed into the oil before it is put into the box.

after completely destroying a BX box once I decided to use some extra addative in my xantia.

its good stuff and gearchange is always smooth. hot or cold

regards nigel.

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 15 Jul 2009, 12:06

Whilst Wynns might help, the root problem here is a worn synchro cone. They are incredibly weak in the BE3, being made of soft allot, and any running on wrong or low oil will wear them badly. Also, if the car has ever suffered a clutch clip failure and the 'box has been forced into second, that'll cause the synchro to wear for certain.

It's not fatal and the 'box will soldier on for donkeys like it. Do as Guy suggests and learn double-declutching until time and finances allow the 'box to be either overhauled (not difficult) or replaced.

Unread post by **Peter.N.** » 15 Jul 2009, 12:09

As has been mentioned, 2nd gear is the most likely to suffer from synchro failure, so if the other gears are OK that's probably the problem. Learn to 'double declutch' you had to do it on the cars I used to drive, they didn't have synchro on Ist.