Oil Change using Suction or Extractor

jmd · Post by **jmd** » 03 Aug 2008, 01:28

Changed the oil today in my sons C5. by removing the dipstick & inserting the tube of my oil extractor down where the dipstick should be. The extractor tube seemed to have reached the bottom of the sump 1 to 1.5 inches lower than the end of the dipstick. When I again inserted the dipstick in the engine I found no trace of oil. On refilling only 2.5 Ltrs of oil brought the level up to full. Needles to say I resorted to the old method of draining the sump. Anybody have any experience of using extractors on a C5. A friend of mine ( a professional machanic ) swears by extractors, but as he says himself, he has not done the job on a C5. Extractor seems to work O.K on my Xantia

lexi · Post by **lexi** » 03 Aug 2008, 09:48

I honestly feel that draining the sump while hot conventionally is a more thorough job. I have used an extractor where needs be.......but it is a compromise ie no sump plugs or inboard engine in a boat.

uncle buck · Post by **uncle buck** » 03 Aug 2008, 22:52

I'm with lexi on this one...I like to remove the sump plug & do the job the old fashioned way, then you know all the old oil is out.

Oil extractors have only become popular because a lot of vehicles now have under trays that have to be removed to gain access to the sump, so extracting the oil saves work & time.

Ross_K · Post by **Ross_K** » 04 Aug 2008, 01:06

jmd wrote:A friend of mine ( a professional machanic ) swears by extractors, but as he says himself, he has not done the job on a C5. Extractor seems to work O.K on my Xantia

Call me cynical but... 8)

I'll bet mechanics swear by them alright. They save them time and the need to get their hands dirty.

Makes you wonder where else they cut corners.

Say, for argument's sake, you took your car to one of these "professionals" for an oil change and he could only get 2.5 litres out using the extractor, do you think he would:
a) bung another 2.5 litres of fresh oil in and bill you for 5 litres of fresh oil and a hour's labour.
b) realise the error of his ways and pull the sump plug in order to do the job correctly.

My guess is probably a)

mooseshaver · Post by **mooseshaver** » 04 Aug 2008, 08:57

Ross_K wrote:
jmd wrote: Say, for argument's sake, you took your car to one of these "professionals" for an oil change and he could only get 2.5 litres out using the extractor, do you think he would:
a) bung another 2.5 litres of fresh oil in and bill you for 5 litres of fresh oil and a hour's labour.
b) realise the error of his ways and pull the sump plug in order to do the job correctly.

My guess is probably a)

Whenever my C5 goes for a service, its always overfilled on oil so its too high on the dipstick and then the in-car oil guage shows error. I guess thats what they might be doing with mine. Just topping it up without getting it all out?

JohnD · Post by **JohnD** » 04 Aug 2008, 09:46

[quote="uncle buck"]

Oil extractors have only become popular because a lot of vehicles now have under trays that have to be removed to gain access to the sump,quote]

My now departed Xantia had an undertray fitted but it had a little trap door just under the sump plug. It was a brilliant idea. No need to take off the undertray. Our Xsara's tray needs to come off - not too difficult - in fact easy compared with the C5's. I agree with others - oil extractors are a lazy man's way of doing an oil change.

uncle buck · Post by **uncle buck** » 04 Aug 2008, 10:51

Yeah I have seen the "Sump Trap doors" which as you say are a great idea so you don't have to remove the full under tray....unfortunately as you are aware most manufactures are now making the under trays in one piece which means they need to be removed in order to access the sump plug

....Just another hurdle in the way of the DIY mechanic

I would have thought it crucial to remove all of the old oil from an engine especially with the service intervals increasing, I don't agree with 20,000 mile service intervals anyway, but with only approx 2.5 litres of fresh oil every service...well that's just silly.

jgra1 · Post by **jgra1** » 04 Aug 2008, 11:01

I wonder... It would be quite easy to add a trap door?

John

Ross_K · Post by **Ross_K** » 04 Aug 2008, 12:23

Two minutes with a Dremel should do it

jmd · Post by **jmd** » 04 Aug 2008, 21:56

Thanks Gentlemen. I agree with your comments regarding the undertray, not so difficulr to remove - but a nightmare to replace. In fairness to my friend the " professional machanic" I do think he was referring to VWs, as he did say he had no experience of Cit's. I was in his shed one night and he was changing the oil in a Jetta, the owner was present and he stated "that (extractor) will not remove all the oil". After letting the extractor do it's job he removed the bung from the sump, and only about 250 Mls of oil came through. It seems the extractor will not remove all old oil from the C5s. Next time (soon) when I change the oil in my Xantia, I will use the extractor first, and then see what happens after removing the bung in the sump. Definately a no go in future with the C5. As regards the Dremel on the undertray. Keep well to the rear when cutting the piece out, as the bung is facing towards the rear of the car, at the back of the sump.

Ross_K · Post by **Ross_K** » 04 Aug 2008, 23:28

The finger wasn't being pointed at any "professional" in particular. 8)

As you say yourself, they don't work on C5's or Jettas - how many other cars are they not worth using on?

I was talking to my aunt today who was telling me she had her Hyundai Getz in for an oil change at the local dealer yesterday. €120 in total - €45

for 5 litres of oil (even though the engine holds just over 4 litres), €10 for oil disposal, €12 for an oil filter

and €60 for labour to top it all off.

When a garage can charge money like that for a simple oil change i can see the emphasis being put on getting as many customers through the workshop as possible rather than doing the job properly...

They should be called wallet extractors rather than oil extractors.

Xaccers · Post by **Xaccers** » 05 Aug 2008, 00:51

on the subject of garages cutting corners, it's done all the time.
someone I know actually lost his job for cutting too many corners though (after getting loads of bonuses for being a fast worker though!) at a local expensive 4x4 dealership.
If the book says a job takes 6 hours, that's what they'll charge the customer (or sometimes more I guess), even if it only took 4 hours.
Repeat that time saving a couple of times and you can get in an extra job and so more money for the garage.

jmd · Post by **jmd** » 05 Aug 2008, 17:20

Agreed completely. They are not going to remove that cursed under-tray, with its consequent difficulties of re-fitting. Wonder if the under-tray really has any function. My Xantia lost its under-tray 100.000 Mls ago, and it didn't do it any harm .

Xaccers · Post by **Xaccers** » 05 Aug 2008, 17:56

jmd wrote:Agreed completely. They are not going to remove that cursed under-tray, with its consequent difficulties of re-fitting. Wonder if the under-tray really has any function. My Xantia lost its under-tray 100.000 Mls ago, and it didn't do it any harm .

When my old N reg hatchback lost it's, the speedo started behaving!

Kowalski · Post by **Kowalski** » 07 Aug 2008, 23:07

When you take the sump plug out of the sump the oil obviously runs out. When the oil rushes out it carries with it the things that sank to the bottom of the sump, i.e. sludge. An extractor with a small diameter hose can't suck the oil as quickly and wont shift sludge as effectively. Its all a question of whether you want all of your oil replacing or not and whether you mind the sludge being left in your sump or not. Sludge is not good!

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Oil Change using Suction or Extractor

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