help 405 questions need urgent comment!!

fodtommo · Post by **fodtommo** » 09 Jul 2008, 11:19

The clutch cable broke on my early 1996 Peugeot 405 1.9td estate Quasar and synchromesh has been lost on 3rd and 4th gear. The car then failed the MOT on a few minor items and the water pump has just started leaking. The car has done 163k, and the engine is beautiful, gutsy etc and uses NO oil.

I have been offered a late 1996 405 1.9TD GLX estate with 170k new MOT and 6mnths tax with all the electrics etc not on a quasar.

I have a couple of issues with the GLX:

a) it has a lucas fuel pump - I can swap this with the bosch one on my Quasar I guess???

b) it seems to have a more gradual power band - the turbo does not kick in like it does on my quasar. Would this be because it has a CAT fitted - ive heard they are more sluggish? Also ive heard that the lucas pump is more sluggish when the boost kicks in?
Ive had loads of 1.9td engines, but never a CAT or lucas pump.

Any thoughts please as I have to pay for the new one tonight if I want it.

Post by **CitroJim** » 09 Jul 2008, 12:36

Hi and welcome to the forum

You should be able to swap the pumps. If the Bosch pump is the fully mechanical variety it'll be a relatively straight swap. The pump cradle on the engine will take either type pf pump.

You'll have to also swap the injectors and injector pipes as the Lucas and Bosch pumps have different firing orders.

Timing will have to be very accurately set.

If the Bosch pump is the electronic variety, it'll be a much more involved job and barely worth doing.

Why are you keen to swap pumps? There is nothing whatever intrinsically wrong with Lucas pumps and they're easier to fix than a Bosch.

If the later car has a cat it could well be choked. It can be bypassed as the cat is not a legal requirement for the MOT.

fodtommo · Post by **fodtommo** » 09 Jul 2008, 12:57

I want the bosch pump as I plan to buy a Bio Diesel maker with a couple of friends soon and have also heard they are much more reliable than the lucas ones in general.

I have been told that if I scribe the pump position onto the mounting bracket, then change the mounting brackets as well then the timing should be ok???? Any comments gratefully recieved on this one!

Incidentally I can buy the GLX for £350 which is the same sort of cost as repairing the Quasar with out the time implications of changing the gearbox!

Post by **CitroJim** » 09 Jul 2008, 13:20

That's a fair reason for wanting to change pumps

Lucas pumps are not happy at all on SVO but should be OK on good quality BioDiesel. The problem with Lucas pumps is lubrication to the rotor head wehn running SVO. If it's a bit thick, the rotor head receives insufficient lubrication and seizes. The same could easily happen with less than perfect Bio.

When run on diesel, a Lucas pump is as good as gold but can suffer leaks. The leaky bits are a doddle to replace whereas on a leaky Bosch, the repair is somewhat more involved.

fodtommo wrote: I have been told that if I scribe the pump position onto the mounting bracket, then change the mounting brackets as well then the timing should be ok???? Any comments gratefully recieved on this one!

If you change pump and cradle complete and scribe the pump position then timing will be very much less of an issue. I'd still be tempted to check it with a DTI just to be 100% sure though.

I have a gearbox sitting in my garage right now awaiting a rebuild because a broken clutch calble wrecked 3rd gear synchromesh!

fodtommo · Post by **fodtommo** » 09 Jul 2008, 13:49

Thanks Jim - interesting what you said about bio d.

also interesting about leaks as I could see a little liquid around the back end of the pump / under the intercooler area which looked to be blueish like diesel. dont want to be losing diesel in this day and age!

citroen7 · Post by **citroen7** » 09 Jul 2008, 18:02

hi,
i have just bought a 93 405 for its engine for my 96 executive.and it has a slight problem with a bit of crunching in 3rd so i am going to swap gear boxes while changing the engines over. if it is within your caperbilities you could do the same and while the engine is out change the water pump on your original i bought a pump on the bay of fleas for a £1

although i would have thought £350 for the other car was a bit steep but there are loads of bits to keep as spares and then weigh the rest in

r.welfare · Post by **r.welfare** » 09 Jul 2008, 19:19

I dunno, £350 for a 405 TD estate with a full MOT and 6 months' tax doesn't sound too bad to me. I gave £250 last week for a '93 Hunter (GRDT with a/c & ABS) with 7 months' ticket and 3 months' tax which has a slipping clutch and bad paint on the roof.

A waterpump for a quid is an excellent score - last time I bought one (Motaquip) it was a tenner on a Buy-It-Now. Definitely makes sense to change it at the same time.

It's a shame that the very late 405 TDs have Lucas fuel pumps - I know someone else who was "caught out" by that!

Does your spares one have a decent headlining in it? I'd be interested if it does

fodtommo · Post by **fodtommo** » 10 Jul 2008, 08:21

I bought it - and its very good! well worth £350 it is spotless and drives like my last one did @ 100k.

The pressed cardboard headlining is ok in my last one, a few marks - but nothing serious. I havnt decided what to do with it but will break it if there is enough interest! - i will list it in the for sale section. definately some good bits on it!! 4 reasonable alloys with new tyres to start!!

Post by **CitroJim** » 10 Jul 2008, 08:59

fodtommo wrote:I - i will list it in the for sale section. definately some good bits on it!! 4 reasonable alloys with new tyres to start!!

I'm still in the market for a 405. Sounds like it might just fit my needs. Don't break it just yet until you've had a chat with me! A Lucas pump and crunchy synchro is no worry to me at all...

fodtommo · Post by **fodtommo** » 11 Jul 2008, 07:48

Jim I did send you an e mail - dont know if you got it?

Post by **CitroJim** » 11 Jul 2008, 12:45

fodtommo wrote:Jim I did send you an e mail - dont know if you got it?

Hi Tom, email received and just answered. Sorry for the delay. I've been unavoidably detained away from the forum for most of the day due to work