Xantia Activa expert needed!

Activamadness · Post by **Activamadness** » 31 May 2008, 09:44

I wonder if anyone who is completely au fait with the activa, would give my car the once over, and tell me what it needs to bring the suspension back to its former glory!
I am in Staffordshire, and obviously can travel
Any help would be much appreciated
Jon

Quackers · Post by **Quackers** » 31 May 2008, 09:48

I've had to do this with 2 of my Activa's, so i've got use to what a not working Activa feels like (and still do with my current one

, nearly sorted!) .

I'm happy to meet up if you want since we are both in same county. What part of staffordshire you in?

DickieG · Post by **DickieG** » 31 May 2008, 11:45

I'd be happy to give it the once over (I'll also plug it into my Lexia to read all the ECU's) but I'm quite a distance from you (M40 J1).

KevMayer · Post by **KevMayer** » 31 May 2008, 15:35

The suspension on my Activa needs some work. I purchased it off ebay a couple of weeks ago. It's a 1998 S reg but a mk1 not a facelift mk2.

The strut spheres front and back are fairly new (oct '05) but my rear is very stiff and bouncy. I've probably got a flat rear hydractive centre sphere, so, no comfort (soft) mode. Either that or my rear hydractive electrovalve has packed up and won't switch on (open to bring in the 3rd sphere).

The front end seems to stay in soft mode all the time because when I do the front end push down it is soft imediately after doors closed and stays soft after the 30 second electovalve time out (rear is hard and still hard after 30 secs). Maybe the front hydractive electrovalve is stuck open, or, the wrong spheres were fitted to the front struts (maybe the front spheres from a none hydractive Xantia). I've got to check the part numbers. It says on these spheres 08-08-06 with SS140 below.

My plan to remedy these issues is to:-

1. Replace all the remainder spheres (including the front struts if they're incorrect).

2. Check ride heights. Clean and Grease the height correctors front and rear.

3. Clean and grease the roll control corrector. Check the control rods and corner bushes for wear.

4. Drain the sytem, clean the filters, and fill with Hydraflush and run on this for say 1500 miles. Re drain, clean filters again and then fill with LHM.

5. Try the diode pack to assist the electrovalves in switching off (freewheel diodes to dissipate stored inductive energy in the coils)

6. If electrovalves not working then try Mandrake's strip down and clean procedure. If this doesn't work I'll look for some valves from a reclaim yard.

Hopefully this won't cost much and will restore the suspension to it's original.

cheers, Kev

DickieG · Post by **DickieG** » 31 May 2008, 16:58

Kev,

You can carry out a basic test on the Hydractive by opening a door with the engine off and listening for the Hydractive blocks switching on (a buzzing under the bonnet/rear axle). You can also try the 'push on the wing' test to see whether the comfort sphere's are flat, when a door is open the suspension should be softer etc.

Bear in mind that should your ECU have any faults stored in it (I've yet to find one clear) then you can only get the faults cleared by using a Lexia /Proxia/ELIT dealer diagnstic tool. The EEPROM memory keeps them in its memory forever otherwise and depending on what fault is logged the suspension will either work from a preset default setting or remain in firm mode.

If anyone is too far from me to bring the car in person for a fault code reading, you could post the Hydractive ECU to me for the faults to be read and cleared. If this is of interest then send me a PM.

Post by **CitroJim** » 31 May 2008, 17:52

DickieG wrote: If anyone is too far from me to bring the car in person for a fault code reading..

You know Richard, both the known Lexias in forum hands are located rather too close to each other

We need more to be obtained and have them spread around the country..

In the near future, I'll be making very regular journeys to South Somerset and back for an extended period. Anyone who lives near to my route (it can vary) are welcome to contact me for a fault reading in exchange for a nice cup of tea, a piece of cake, a natter and a journey break.

If anyone can get hold of a duff Lexia, I may be able to fix it for you.

KevMayer · Post by **KevMayer** » 02 Jun 2008, 21:11

DickieG,

Thanks for your very generous offer.

I've had a play tonight and can hear the electrovalves buzzing, clicking and got some change between hard and soft mode, although, not exactly as expected. So, maybe the suspension ECU hasn't totally locked out yet, but, I appreciate your offer and now have another option if needed.

The Activa is going to Westroen on Wednesday to have 6 spheres changed (all but the 4 strut spheres which were changed recently) so, I'll see how it is when all the spheres are healthy.

cheers, Kev

Mandrake · Post by **Mandrake** » 03 Jun 2008, 11:34

DickieG wrote:Kev,
Bear in mind that should your ECU have any faults stored in it (I've yet to find one clear) then you can only get the faults cleared by using a Lexia /Proxia/ELIT dealer diagnstic tool. The EEPROM memory keeps them in its memory forever otherwise and depending on what fault is logged the suspension will either work from a preset default setting or remain in firm mode.

I think you'll find that although the faults are logged forever, (until cleared by the diagnostic tool) that doesn't mean that it assumes the fault exists forever - when the fault is fixed and the power is turned off and on, normal operation will resume - it won't just assume that sensor is dead until reset.

The problem with this is if a number of faults come and go in the life of the car and are repaired without it being cleared, the log could be full of faults that are no longer there and are clouding the issue of an actual fault

(Making the first fault reading session somewhat worthless - until it has been cleared, and then driven long enough to record a fresh fault)

Regards,
Simon

KevMayer · Post by **KevMayer** » 14 Jun 2008, 21:12

Progress so far with my Activa,

I've drained the suspension, cleaned the filters and filled with Hydraflush.

I took it for a spin and it was so bouncy I hadto turn back almost immediatly.

I set it on normal height and engine on tickover, then I cracked the bleed valve 5 secs, then closed for 30 and repeated this 3 times to get the air out of the suspension followed by 4 rounds of citaerobics. Another test drive revealed it was still too bouncy.

I got my soldering iron out and a pack of 1N4006 diodes and fitted them between three grey cores 7720, 7723 and 7730 and earth.

Took it for a test drive and it was as smooth as a smooth thing. It felt very nice. Just like it should.

The only problem I have is that the front end remains very soft when you do the bounce test. I suspect the front strut spheres are the wrong ones, or the electrovalve is stuck open (possibly a soft return spring in the electrovalve ?), or the piston in the control block which connects the front hydractive sphere is staying open.

I've read in the Citroen Guide (http://www.tramontana.co.hu/citroen/guide/guide.php) that the piston can remain open under certain conditions, quote

'The electro-valve 5 is energized when the suspension is in
its soft mode, hence, the default electrical position is hard.
However, due to the indirect coupling between this valve
and the isolation piston 2 inside the control block, the hydraulics
can stay in either position for extended periods of
time with the electric valve disconnected, depending on the
pressure differences between the strut and the main circuits.
If the main suspension circuit has nominal pressure,
the system stays in hard mode with the electric valve off or
disconnected.'

I wonder if this is what I'm getting?

Otherwise, does anyone recognise the coding on my front strut spheres. It's 08-08-06 and SS140. The first part is probably the date because the bill in the Activa's history is for Sept 06. So, what does SS140 refer to ?

cheers, Kev

Post by **CitroJim** » 14 Jun 2008, 21:37

Excellent work Kev

The front spheres do seem wrong. I've just looked at mine and the have SP162 written on them along with a big "XT" and "Activa". Someone may have popped some other spheres on from a non-hydractive Xantia to try to make the front a bit more comfy not realising the fault lay with the electrovalves.

I've never known mine to ever stay in soft mode. Every bounce test I've done, and I do them frequently, always results in it switching to hard mode but then, if the front spheres are non-hydractive, you may not feel it.

I see what the Citroen Technical Guide is saying but I think you'd need a very poor accumulator, a duff security valve or a big internal leak to prevent the electrovalve from shuttling across and leaving the suspension in soft mode. looking at the diagrams in the Technical Guide it looks like any stored pressure in the hydractive centre sphere will assist in shuttling the valve across to hard mode. As soon as main circuit pressure falls, the pressure in the centre hydractive sphere will start to push the hydractive piston down (Item 2 on the diagram on page 30) and in doing so, will force LHM down the return line (coloured blue) and behind the electrovalve piston and thus helping to move to the right and into hard mode.

KevMayer · Post by **KevMayer** » 14 Jun 2008, 22:09

Thanks for your answer citrojim.

I think the best thing to do is to get to GSF and buy some Activa front strut spheres. Then I'll know they're right.

cheers, Kev

andmcit · Post by **andmcit** » 14 Jun 2008, 22:20

Thing is - they list them at GSF but tell me they don't sell them any more...

Try these guys though I've never bought from them myself and they too
may list but not sell them either:

http://www.aepdirect.com/citroen-part.aspx

Andrew

Post by **CitroJim** » 14 Jun 2008, 22:26

Martin at Pleiades should be able to do you some spheres Kev.

Mandrake · Post by **Mandrake** » 15 Jun 2008, 01:40

KevMayer wrote: I've read in the Citroen Guide (http://www.tramontana.co.hu/citroen/guide/guide.php) that the piston can remain open under certain conditions, quote

'The electro-valve 5 is energized when the suspension is in
its soft mode, hence, the default electrical position is hard.
However, due to the indirect coupling between this valve
and the isolation piston 2 inside the control block, the hydraulics
can stay in either position for extended periods of
time with the electric valve disconnected, depending on the
pressure differences between the strut and the main circuits.
If the main suspension circuit has nominal pressure,
the system stays in hard mode with the electric valve off or
disconnected.'

I wonder if this is what I'm getting?

I would have to disagree with that quote from the Citroen guide quite emphatically - yes, it's possible for the Hydractive block to to remain in the "hard" mode despite the electrovalve being energized - if there is not enough pressure available from the main pressure regulator, quite correct, and a common occurance when the engine is not running.

However the reverse is not possible - it's impossible for the block to stay stuck in the "soft" mode with the electrovalve disconnected (or non-energised) - because no system pressure is required to effect a change from soft to hard - it is the suspension pressure that pushes it in that direction.

The only thing that might cause it to stay stuck in one mode or the other is if there was a serious fault with the slide valve in the block or the electrovalve.

Regards,
Simon

KevMayer · Post by **KevMayer** » 21 Jun 2008, 21:19

I've sorted my soft front end.

I purchased some Activa front Spheres from AEP and when fitted, the front end changes from soft to hard on the bounce test just like it should.

The previous owner must have fitted non-hydractive front spheres.

cheers, Kev