Xantia vs Xm

Bren · Unread post by **Bren** » 26 Aug 2007, 21:11

Hello,
I am a new member and this is my first post.I currently have a 96' Xantia TD SX estate with 112k on the clock and generally in very good condition.I am thinking of purchasing a caravan in the near future and I was wondering if a turbo diesel XM would be better suited for the job? I am of the opinion that my own vehicle is a bit long in the tooth as well as being slightly underpowered. Has anyone got any thoughts/comparisons?The idea of a more space (especially in estate form) is another factor. Any comments would be appreciated.

Sturdybloke · Unread post by **Sturdybloke** » 26 Aug 2007, 22:34

Welcome in Bren,
I cant see why your 1.9 TD wont pull a moderate sized caravan. As long as its been serviced & well looked after it should not pose any problems for it. Although the Xm has a bigger boot (ok, a lot bigger) the 2.1 XUDT engine is a bit of a pig to work on (access wize) although people who have owned Xm's be it Pet or Derv will come along and give you a fair view on the plus and negs on owning them (Peter N & andmcit are two for starters) as ive not had one, yet......

As your Xantia has only done 112K I would say that its just run in. My daily driver, a 1992 Rover 400 TD has a Citroen/Peugeot engine fitted to it - the same 1.8 Td that was fitted into the Bx/405 and a few months ago a friend wanted his caravan moving (a 2 berth) about 15 miles of various gradients. The Rover weighs about the same as a Xantia and even with the smaller 1.8 engine it pulled fine (if a little slow) with the van on the back, 40-50kg's of gear in the boot, 3/4 tank of fuel and 2 people in the car. Also how much luggage space do you really need?

All the best - Craig.

deian · Unread post by **deian** » 26 Aug 2007, 23:21

Simple answer: Yes the XM would be "better suited", the Xantia is no slouch either.

Long answer: The XM being the bigger car with the bigger engine (2.1td or even the 2.5td) will pull it better. Not just because of the engine but because it is a bigger car... wider, heavier and the spacing between the wheels is bigger, it will be more stable. All that goes without saying. I am led to believe the 2.1td in the XM may achieve a slightly better fuel economy on the longer runs mainly because of the aerodynamic design, it has a low drag co-efficient. The Xm estate is about as big as you can get in estates!

I am actually going to buy an XM myself quite soon, to replace my Xantia, don't get me wrong, there is nothing at all wrong with a Xantia in any way, the best car i've had yet (in both forms 2.1td and V6), and your 1.9td will pull a caravan quite well, but a 2.1td XM would pull it better and cheaper I think. A 2.5td XM would be interesting, but myself I will avoid that one.

The 2.1td engine may be better to work on in an XM because of the bigger engine bay. I find the V6 more spacious to work on in the Xantia than the 2.1td.

Good luck.

andmcit · Unread post by **andmcit** » 27 Aug 2007, 00:01

There's a bit of a catch-22 here for you Bren!

You say your '96 Xantia TD is a bit long in the tooth yet by that vintage
Xm's had all but fizzled out in series 2 guise so finding one, especially
a low mileage diesel isn't going to be easy. If a high mileage does worry
you on a Xantia TD, I've several nudging 250k miles and going well.

That said, an XM IS the better car for towing for the reasons outlined by
Deian. The saloon's as good as the estate having the same wheelbase and
is a fantastically sure footed tow car and I've towed some daft things using
my car transporter trailer.

I've been particularly impressed with the abilities of a non cat 2.0i saloon
Xm that comfortably towed another Xm on the trailer!! As a matter of fact, a
car that had followed me a fair distance must have been waiting for me to
stop as the guy leapt out when I was buying some fuel to ask me what engine
it had as he was very impressed with it's abilities and said his car that was
regularly used to tow a similar trailer wouldn't have managed to tow the
same load at half the speed!! He practically fell over when I told him it was
a 2.0i although it cannot be emphasised enough here the importance of
the fact it was not a cat equipped model...

Because of this I'd personally opt for a non cat early Xm model as the
electrical foibles will have long since been exorcised well in the cars' past
although a 16v or turbo that will have some extra pep performance will
come with a cat. Things to watch out for on Xm's are working sunroofs
and working automatic gearboxes as neither usually work!!

In fact any automatic Xm is a hill away from being a permanent garden
ornament anyway...

I would finish by suggesting an Xm estate although having a lot more
hanging out the rear on a standard saloon's bodyshell it will have a better
towing capacity, it will obviously have a slightly dented performance in
return for that extra weight.

Conversely, after all that's been said, I'd have the nicer looking more
distinctive Xm saloon any day even though I have got a Xm 2.1 estate;
I've actually never felt the urge to get it into daily use with a Xantia
estate handling the daily rough and tumble use with ease.

If you still fancy something different and a tad more challenging, you
could of course consider my 'Joker' card by looking at a CX 2.5 estate
- only the best estate and tow car EVER!! I own several as they're just
so goddamned fabulous!! Buy a good'un and protect it well and you'll
never be disappointed!!

Andrew

Xaccers · Unread post by **Xaccers** » 27 Aug 2007, 17:01

The 1.9TD can run on veg oil, at 100% in this current heat reducing fuel costs.
Did Citroen only fit Lucas EPIC pumps to 2.1TD Xantias or were the last few XM's downgraded with them too?

deian · Unread post by **deian** » 27 Aug 2007, 17:13

I believe the later 2.1tds were downgraded to them too.

Unread post by **Peter.N.** » 27 Aug 2007, 18:33

The 2.1 XMs only had EPIC pumps after '96 and were nearly all auto's, which I dont like, so the chances are that it will be a mechanical pump.

See my other post under 'XM buying issues'

Bren · Unread post by **Bren** » 27 Aug 2007, 19:32

Thanks for your correspondence gents - the reason I believed my own car was'nt man enough to pull a 4/5 berth caravan was based on my last two annual holiday's to devon - with 4 (admittedly large) adults, a baby and some luggage in the boot I really had to make use of the lower gears and keep the turbo spinning, especially around Dartmoor.By the way this is my first citroen, and although it's not the most refined car I have owned, it is certainly the most practical. At the moment my dad is looking for a diesel 406 and has a budget of around £2k,but my own car is lower mileage and in better condition than the one's he has viewed.

deian · Unread post by **deian** » 27 Aug 2007, 19:39

they are essentially the same car, same chassis, same engine, the suspension is different on the xantia obviously (as well as on the xm), which give it a better ride and better to tow a caravan (it will self level and keep the front on the ground, lower to hook the caravan up, but on the other hand this may not help the resale value, which makes them excellent to buy, but not to sell.

I'd always go for a Citroen over peugoet, they are 'nicer' more individual cars in my opinion.

f00lzz · Unread post by **f00lzz** » 31 Aug 2007, 19:26

The XM 2.5TD Estate was Tow Car of the year!!!

Unread post by **Peter.N.** » 31 Aug 2007, 21:36

Nice car - pity about the access!.

andmcit · Unread post by **andmcit** » 31 Aug 2007, 21:49

Does anyone fancy a healthy legal Xm 2.5td EXCLUSIVE saloon in black!?
A good pal's now decided he doesn't need his...

Andrew

fourwheelsteer · Unread post by **fourwheelsteer** » 03 Sep 2007, 19:22

Just out of curiosity, how much?

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 03 Sep 2007, 22:10

Bren wrote:Thanks for your correspondence gents - the reason I believed my own car was'nt man enough to pull a 4/5 berth caravan was based on my last two annual holiday's to devon - with 4 (admittedly large) adults, a baby and some luggage in the boot I really had to make use of the lower gears and keep the turbo spinning, especially around Dartmoor.

Hi Bren,

I tow an Ace Marauder 400 with my very elderly 187,000 mile TD with absolutely no problems at all. We've just returned from the West Country with it and knowing that part of the world well, I think any towcar would need use made of the lower gears

It is somewhat challanging territory when towing. It never fails to amaze me just how willing and capable the old 1.9TD is when presented with a heavy load on the back especially when it's a full family holiday and the kids insist on taking bikes, telly, games consoles and enough clothes to open a shop. SWMBO packs everything imaginable. Good job the caravan has a kitchen sink or she'd take that too

At the moment my dad is looking for a diesel 406

If he wants to tow with it, go for the Citroen. The suspension is brilliant when towing and really comes into its own. Suspension-wise, you don't know the 'van is on the back. I used to tow with a 405TD and in comparason it was rubbish. The rear suspension was way too soft and bottomed out so easily I had to remove the jockey wheel to give adequate clearance under the A frame. No such problems with the Xantia. I've never towed with a 406 so it may be better than the 405 but it is unlikely to be as capable as a hydropneumatic Citroen.