Which XM?

deian · Post by **deian** » 09 Aug 2007, 17:57

Hi,

Further to the post of a 'which xantia' I have recently been toying around at the idea of an XM. So I will now ask... which one?

I'm kinda thinking 2.5td? or maybe the 2.1td, I really don't care about speed as such, but I would like some overtaking power from time to time. The main issues are reliability and running cost. I know they can be reliable cars despite what people say. No idea what will happen to the V6 at the moment, I may keep it for fun, or sell it, but it'll be hard to let go.

I just want something bigger (preferably with a towbar). I've seen the 2.5 on ebay.

What's the 2.0 and 2.0t like? as compared to the 2.1 and the 2.5 (overall picture).

Thanks

Post by **CitroJim** » 10 Aug 2007, 07:31

Hi Dei,

I can only comment on the 2.0L CT as it's the same engine as in the Activa.

It is a great engine! Lots of low-down grunt and plenty of power for an overtaking squirt

They are thirsty though

and, if you are contemplating towing I'd say it would be even thirstier. 25mpg is about the top when running round town although on a run (solo) they're not bad if you resist using the performance although that can be hard

Using it for towing, I'd be a little worried about cooling. They run very hot and the cooling system (to me, as fitted to a Xantia) seems a bit marginal. The engine suffers terribly from heat-soak due, I think, to there being a lot of metal in the block. The block is very thick, especially around the cylinders.

Having said that though, the engine is incredibly tough and reliable and will go on and on with good maintenance. It's a very simple engine, just being a normal 8V XU with a turbo stuck on it. An engine to enjoy

Post by **RichardW** » 10 Aug 2007, 09:32

The 2.1 is considered by many afficionados to be the best incarnation of the XUD series, and should make reasonable progress / economy in the XM. The 2.5 is a development on an older engine I think (the one that was in the CX?) - it's not that much more powerful, but is a right shoehorn job even under the XM's bonnet. There are multiple radiators, and even then I've heard cooling is marginal when working it hard (eg towing!). Add in that's it's not the common, and there's the potential for big troubles. But then you did buy a 3.0V6 Xantia, so you're prepared for that 8)

The 2.0 ought to go OK and not be too bad on the go-go juice - it's 135BHP or something. The 2.0T is only 150BHP but should be more relaxing to drive as it's tuned to give constatn torque, and therefore nice low down grunt and pulling power - jsut like a diesel then, without the fuel efficiency advantage

Autoboxes are a known weak point, with 120k being about the useful life...

andmcit · Post by **andmcit** » 10 Aug 2007, 13:12

For my sins I've a good many Xm 2.0i's which I'm going to have to thin out,
but I think they're great to drive - stating the obvious of course that they're
still going because they're not automatics!!

The 2.0i 8v is easy/comfortable to drive and even as a saloon, tows my
car transporter trailer carrying another car effortlessly. One of my favorite
Xm's was a series 1.5 2.0i that covered vast mileages with ease and was
the most reliable car that I'd ever had. It even withstood a prat pulling out
in front of me on a roundabout where I T-boned them. I picked up a broken
headlight surround panel, a broken headlight glass and a dent on the bonnet
where their mirror bounced off...

That was right up until it caught fire on a dual carriageway after I'd just
brimmed the tank. Policeman stopped me from trying to put the fire out
myself and let it burn...

Still not sure to this day what caused it - think it was a split fuel feed pipe
onto the top of the engine or an oil leak on the manifold.

If you want a lazier Xm use the 2.0i CT but the economy edge only works
when you DON'T use the turbo. It'll be better in daily use over the 2.0i 8v
if you tame the sprinting about though. Never owned a 16v 2.0i though!!

Andrew

Post by **Peter.N.** » 10 Aug 2007, 15:06

My personal choice is the 2.1 td manual estate. The 2.1 diesel is an almost bomb proof engine and although not very easy to work on it doesn't very often need it. Expect to have to replace the head gasket at around 150 k but it should then be good for another 150k providing you change the oil regularly, I do mine every 5k.

The 2.5 diesel is a nice engine but extremely difficult to work on and getting difficult to get spares for, there are plenty for the 2.1.

I wouldn't have a petrol one purely on the economy front. I do about 20k per year, although I am retired, and the 2.1 manual will do 50+ mpg driven with a little restraint on long journeys. The power is quite adequate for me, it will go up almost any hill in top gear, that's all I want, in fact the engine is so flexible that you rarely have to change gear at all!

The estate version is huge, possibly the biggest estate car on the road

Avoid auto's unless you know they have been properly serviced. Apart from being inefficient, failure will write the car off.

deian · Post by **deian** » 10 Aug 2007, 16:59

I've had a 2.1 xantia before, but wondering how the 2.1 xm is against that? I quite fancy a 2.0turbo, how would that be against my v6 xantia in fuel economy?

Post by **Peter.N.** » 10 Aug 2007, 17:16

The 2.1 in the XM seems to give a better fuel consumption than the 1.9 Xantia but you will know what you got from the Xantia and the XM shouldn't be a lot different. I dont have much experiecne of the petrol versions as a I havn't run a petrol car for at least 20 years! From what I have read I think you should get an average of around 30 mpg from the 2 litre turbo, and again you will know what the V6 does. The 2.1 td should give you an average of 40 mpg or more, depending on where and how you drive it. I live in a rural area and dont generally drive hard and my average is in excess of 40 mpg. I prefer the diesel for sheer drivability, its a lazy car to drive, you dont have to 'work it' but you will know that from your 2.1 td experience. The XM is supremely comfortable and roomy, they are probably the main advantages over the Xantia.

All the above figures are for manual cars, for auto's knock of about 20%.

andmcit · Post by **andmcit** » 10 Aug 2007, 18:08

Whilst few 5 seater big saloons will match an Xm V6 24v (I realise it's
not like there aren't a few though...) the 2.0i TurboCT is a very sprightly,
OK - rapid car, that doesn't actually feel any slower in daily use compared
with it. In my experiences with various Xm's and Xantiae the turbo engine
makes a better job of things in an Xm bodyshell rather than an Activa
with the same engine - must be different ratios?

As far as economy is concerned, the Xm v6 24v isn't, an Activa isn't,
and I've been pleasantly surprised with the TurboCT Xm which isn't
miles away from the non turbo 2.0i 8v in either Xm OR Xantia bodyshell.

If I go down the LPG route which I'm seriously pondering on, it'd be an
Xm 2.0 TurboCT although I'm quite taken with the 15v Xantia which I feel
shades the turbo set up and would like to try the 16v engine in an Xm
saloon.

I'm really mad now missing a 130quid LPG s2 Xm 16v manual on ebay
a short while ago...

deian · Post by **deian** » 10 Aug 2007, 19:57

andmcit wrote: If I go down the LPG route which I'm seriously pondering on, it'd be an
Xm 2.0 TurboCT although I'm quite taken with the 15v Xantia which I feel
shades the turbo set up and would like to try the 16v engine in an Xm
saloon.

That 15v Xantia? is that the 5 cylinder version?

andmcit · Post by **andmcit** » 10 Aug 2007, 20:50

Deliberate mistake!!

Checking to see if anyone is actually reading my ramblings!!

I had a 4.5 valve 2.0i Xm last week when the timing belt tensioner's
bearing ran itself out and collapsed too....

Maybe I should add to my earlier comment elsewhere listing things to watch
that a tensioner change is necessary on the XU 2.0 engines as well
as the belt itself!! It looked fine last year when I fitted a new belt.

Andrew

steelcityuk · Post by **steelcityuk** » 15 Aug 2007, 13:24

In the space of just over a year I've gone from a Xantia HDi 110 to a XM 2.1 TD EPIC then the current XM 2.5. The 2.1 seemed far more spritely than the HDi but the gearing was different. The current 2.5 doesn't seem any more powerful than the 2.1 so I'm assuming something's wrong (injectors are next on the list). The 2.5 is heavier on fuel than the 2.1 but this is easily off set by using SVO now that the law has changed.

The 2.5 estate is big and seems to handle like a big car unlike my 2.1 which was very nimble to drive and had a very comfy ride.

Steve.

Post by **Peter.N.** » 15 Aug 2007, 22:22

The body is the same on both, unless your 2.1 was a hatchback. Must be the extra engine weight.

lolingram · Post by **lolingram** » 16 Aug 2007, 11:05

NOT if the Lucas EPIC pump goes AWOL.... in comparison the 1.9 XUD is in a different class with no hydraulic lifters to worry about. Getting the cyl head off in situ is the task of a Houdini!

The inj. pump aspect alone puts me right off. I have owned 3 Citroens with the 12V lump, and the first one blew its head gasket at 128K (all 3 went to the breakers) so bombproof it ain't, but it is extremely fuel efficient as well as nice to drive - drags the heavy XM around a treat.

My personal choice is the 2.1 td manual estate. The 2.1 diesel is an almost bomb proof engine

Post by **Peter.N.** » 16 Aug 2007, 11:47

Mmm unfortunate! I am on my fifth XM 2.1 td in about 12 years, all mechanical injection I must add. The last one I sold had covered nearly 300k all original except the head gasket. The present one 168k, new gasket at 120k almost faultless since. The hydraulic tappets are getting a bit noisey sometimes but I have a new set purchased on ebay for not very much money, which I will fit next time I change the cambelt. Never had a pump problem. The head gasket will need changing around 150k but it will then go on to do another 150k, in fact the laminted steel gasket I fitted looks as though it will last forever. Lack of antifreeze will bring about premature gasket failure and it should be changed every two years.

fourwheelsteer · Post by **fourwheelsteer** » 16 Aug 2007, 19:36

Stop going on about XMs

I'd love an XM and I've promised myself one, one day.. Hang the expense and complexity and make mine a V6 auto hatchback.

For those of you with manual XMs, how do you cope with the parking brake?