F/N/S wheelarch LHM leaking - from where?

MikeT · Unread post by **MikeT** » 11 Jul 2007, 16:20

After first drive of the day, car was parked for appx two hours and I saw a wet patch under the f/n/s wing but thought it was the usual air con water dripping. It isn't. It's LHM fluid I think and it's dripping quite heavily but can't see from where exactly without getting it up in the air.

Can anyone determine the cause from these photos? I'm guessing it's coming from the pipe that enters the lower part of the strut as it seems to be the highest & wettest point.

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 11 Jul 2007, 16:34

To me Mike,

That looks like the strut leakage return pipe is leaking at the strut.

A very simple and cheap job to fix. GSF have replacment at £.9.25 each Part. No. N43404.

It may just need the clip reapplying (it may have popped off) but the pipe and foot do perish.

MikeT · Unread post by **MikeT** » 11 Jul 2007, 17:18

Hi Jim,
I'm not being lazy, I'm trying to get as much insight as possible before I take the car off the road and fully inspect it as I can't easily get parts after and I don't want to buy anything I won't be needing.

The Haynes BOL claims I need to cut the clip to remove it, is this necessary? It also states I'll need a new "seal" as well but service.citroen don't show any seal. (are the hose and foot seperate items?)

They call the clip an "adjust collar" so I'm guessing it can be adjusted?
Thanks, Mike

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 11 Jul 2007, 17:35

No worries Mike

I fully understand and that is how I end up with a few spares in stock by buying everything and finding I don't yet need half of it

A scattergun appraoch you might say!

The foot and pipe are integral. I'd give it a good clean up and see if you can see a crack or split from where it is leaking. A bit of insulating taple will do as a temporary fix as the pressure here is very low. I'd expect any leak to be occurring on the junction of the pipe and foot.

The stainless steel band is a clip and could be reused at a push as it works on the same principle as the clips on the rubber LHM pipes and radiator hoses. If the clip cannot be reused then a stout cable tie shoud do a good job. You may even be able to use a Jubilee clip for it. Don't do it up too tightly though as the foot is very soft and liable to distort and leak more if the band is pulled really tight.

Unfortunately the GSF one does not come with a new band.

The other thing to check is that the return line the pipe connects to is not blocked and resulting in a build up of pressure in the return line causing the leak. You should be able to check this by attaching a suitable length of tube and blowing up it.

MikeT · Unread post by **MikeT** » 11 Jul 2007, 17:59

If I pull the foot out will I loose all my LHM fluid, all that is in the strut/sphere or only what's left in the pipe?

I'm experienced with those metal clips now, should be a doddle to undo without cutting it and I like the idea of using a tie-wrap as a back-up - dead cheap

I wonder if the foot could be repaired with a bicycle puncture repair kit... assuming it's the cause of the leak and until I can get a replacement.

If I have the foot disconnected, would it be possible to test the return pipe for blockages by blowing up it instead?

Out of curiousity, how would this pipe get blocked in the first place, and if it is, what's the implications for the rest of the system?

AndersDK · Unread post by **AndersDK** » 11 Jul 2007, 18:18

MikeT wrote:If I pull the foot out will I loose all my LHM fluid, all that is in the strut/sphere or only what's left in the pipe?

No - only whats in the piping upwards to the reservoir

I'm experienced with those metal clips now, should be a doddle to undo without cutting it and I like the idea of using a tie-wrap as a back-up - dead cheap

I wonder if the foot could be repaired with a bicycle puncture repair kit... assuming it's the cause of the leak and until I can get a replacement.

not the same rubber type the repair solution bonds to. I really doubt it will be worth the effort.

If I have the foot disconnected, would it be possible to test the return pipe for blockages by blowing up it instead?

Yes - but careful - no 8bars here from your airline

. Use a bike hand/foot pump.

Out of curiousity, how would this pipe get blocked in the first place, and if it is, what's the implications for the rest of the system?

Dont think its a pipe blockage in the first place. That would be my first case then. It can happen during other repairs, where the pipe is clamped between 2 components.
My bet is a simple crack/detoriation of the rubber foot on the cylinder.

This type of problem is to my experience rather common as single problems in the hydraulics. The rest of the rubber piping may still have several years of service life left. They dont come all at one time anyway. Some will outlast the car no problem. Others may go brittle over a winter or summer period.
Its the kind of repair job you do during testing of the car - when everything else is in known good order.

MikeT · Unread post by **MikeT** » 11 Jul 2007, 18:39

AndersDK wrote:My bet is a simple crack/detoriation of the rubber foot on the cylinder.

So it's a new hose then

MikeT · Unread post by **MikeT** » 11 Jul 2007, 20:35

citrojim wrote:The other thing to check is that the return line the pipe connects to is not blocked and resulting in a build up of pressure in the return line causing the leak. You should be able to check this by attaching a suitable length of tube and blowing up it.

I was wondering, it was only recently that I fixed the front height corrector arm. In other words, in the few months I've owned this car, it's the first time I've had front correction for any length of time.

Another relevance is there has always been something keeping part of the wheel arch liner damp. With other jobs to do, I've only given it a cursory glance and never traced the cause.

You may have hit the nail right on the head here regarding a blockage, Jim. If so, I might not have to buy anything

Mandrake · Unread post by **Mandrake** » 11 Jul 2007, 20:46

MikeT wrote:

Hi Mike,

The routing of that leakage pipe is incorrect - it should go vertically upwards from the strut and curve to the right (in that photo) not the other way around, as shown in the photo. (The loop should be the other way around)

It's possible that the leakage returns are left and right handed (not 100% sure) so they curve in the right direction - so if they (or the struts) have ever been replaced it could be the wrong handed one.

Because its the wrong way around its bending at a sharp angle at the base of the pipe where it attaches to the strut, and due to the strut moving up and down it will be bending back and forth, and probably will have cracked at that point.

Make sure the new one is routed properly so there is no strain on the pipe by the clamp.

As the suspension goes right up and down the pipe should "roll" near the middle of the curve, it shouldn't bend sharply at the base.

Regards,
Simon

MikeT · Unread post by **MikeT** » 11 Jul 2007, 21:07

Mandrake wrote:The routing of that leakage pipe is incorrect...Regards,
Simon

Well that doesn't surprise me about this car. Thanks very much Simon and well spotted. [Thanks again to this forum allowing me to post pictures].

Hopefully, kinking is the only reason it's leaking though the pipe has probably suffered too much abuse already.

I thought this could give me the opportunity to bash Haynes' economising use of "refitting is a reversal of removal" but it isn't the case for this pipe.

AndersDK · Unread post by **AndersDK** » 11 Jul 2007, 21:27

95 050 399 LEAK BACK HOSE - approx £6 + vat
same part left & right.
Simon is right. The hose is supposed to follow the strut up and then curve down against the chassis stud where mounted.

There is no indications of any retainer to keep the hose in the curved position - on the Citroen service schematic. But I believe any standard camping type rubber band may do the trick.

MikeT · Unread post by **MikeT** » 11 Jul 2007, 21:58

AndersDK wrote:95 050 399 LEAK BACK HOSE - approx £6 + vat
same part left & right

How approx is that price AndersDK? Seems main dealer may be the cheaper option, which is handy as they're not far from me. Thanks

AndersDK · Unread post by **AndersDK** » 11 Jul 2007, 22:26

"translated" from some 69DKK ex vat.

Cant get prices up in £'s once I've registered as a danish resident

Only display language can be changed at will.

MikeT · Unread post by **MikeT** » 11 Jul 2007, 22:48

I don't know my way around service.citroen very well. When I click a part I find it gets added to my basket so I always backtrack at that point. I'm guessing I can safely continue and discover the price.

Let's find out....

MikeT · Unread post by **MikeT** » 12 Jul 2007, 17:43

The pipe had split at the foot end, that's why it appeared to be routed wrongly. I bought a new one from Citroen parts for £10 and used three tie-wraps as I couldn't retighten the original clip.

What bothers me about this design is there are no locators!

There's the strut with a hole and you have to guess where to fit the pipe foot over this hole and hope it doesn't move when you clip it in place. Apart from the clip, there's nothing to stop it being moved out of place given enough force.

Anyway, job is done and so far there's no leak from it. Thanks for your support everyone.

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F/N/S wheelarch LHM leaking - from where?

F/N/S wheelarch LHM leaking - from where?

Re: F/N/S wheelarch LHM leaking - from where?

Re: F/N/S wheelarch LHM leaking - from where?