Xantia's sudden loss of Power -- Help

tomthered · Post by **tomthered** » 26 Apr 2007, 06:48

Guys hope you can help. Was driving my Xantia 1.9TD (1996 model) froma car park last night. Went over a small speed control hump in the car park and suddenly a loss of power. The car runs but with no ooomph and takes ages to get to 30mph and no real acceleration.

My mechanic friend had a look and said might be the fuel filter with dirt in. Changed that still no joy. He says the cylinders are all working and it mustbe a fuel problem. He now reckons it must be an injector issue. When it first happened there was clouds of black smoke when I put my foot down on the pedal. I drove 6 miles to get home and it was running at idle very lumpily. I had to make the engine tick over faster than normal to ensure it did not keep cutting out at lights.

When you do try to start it it kicks over but takes a bit to come on. Anyone got any thoughts or directions it could be or is it as simple as the injectors? Could there have been dirt in the line and when I went over the bump it dislodged it blocking one or more injectors?

cheers in advance

Post by **CitroJim** » 26 Apr 2007, 07:55

Nothing too serious going on here..

The fact it happened after a hump bump suggests something has become dislodged or fallen off.

Firstly, what injection system/pump? I'll take an initial stab and say you have the electronic Bosch with EGR valve with the needle lift sensor on No.2 injector. If so then you either have a stuck lift sensor, a duff TDC sensor, a jammed open EGR valve or a massive air leak on the fuel inlet side, leakoff pipes maybe. Is the "K" (Engine Management) light coming on at all?

If you have a non-electronic pump, then it'll be most likely an air leak around either the injector leakoff pipes or the fuel inlet to the pump.

Injectors, luckily, don't suddenly fail nor get blocked. the fuel filter sees to that. The only sudden failure occurs with the needle lift sensor. Worth checking the wiring, especially as it happend going over a hump. Pumps too, rarely just give up suddenly with these kind of symptoms.

The other possibility is the ECU but it is unlikely. Again, check wiring around it, especially it's large multi-plug.

A final but unlikely cause can be seriously restricted airflow into or out of the engine, blocked air filter, intercooler, collapsed air trunking, squashed/blocked exhaust etc.

steelcityuk · Post by **steelcityuk** » 26 Apr 2007, 08:08

As mentioned above, I'd go with a air leak somewhere on the induction system due to a perished or disconnected pipe.

Steve.

tomthered · Post by **tomthered** » 26 Apr 2007, 12:31

Well guys I dont have a clue waht you're on about but I will pass the details on to my mechanic via a text, hopefully he will find it!! n Never knew there was so much to a diesel engine. Where are all these bits located?

tomthered · Post by **tomthered** » 26 Apr 2007, 13:27

He has just come back to me with the news he has checked all the mentioned items and he now thinks its the head gasket blowing between cylinders. That may tie in with the pale blue smoke I saw out of the exhaust but this was not all the time. Would that give the loss of power experienced?

Post by **Peter.N.** » 26 Apr 2007, 14:31

Two other possibilities: the cam belt could have jumped a tooth and upset the timing, that would give you poor tickover, or you could have an obstruction in the air intake - that would cause lots of black smoke. Head gaskets dont usually go suddenly - but there's always a first time.

AndersDK · Post by **AndersDK** » 26 Apr 2007, 15:30

Tom -

From your postings its indicated that your mechanic keeps suggesting costly repairs.
May be true or not. May be he wants to prepare you the best he can for a large repair bill.

Would you please get a second opinion from another garage !
Dont tell your first mechanic. Its just a precaution for your wallet.

deian · Post by **deian** » 26 Apr 2007, 16:39

I'm inclined to think like AndersDK too... let me explain why he may think you need a second opinion:

Firstly your mechanic said all your cylinders were fine, to know this he must have done a compression test, and it shows high and healthy compression...

Which contradicts his next move of suggesting the head gasket, because if the head gasket was leaking between cylinders the compression would have been low and he would have spotted it the first time round.

It sounds like he hears your desperation and he smells money. Maybe your mechanic got insulted by the suggestions you offered to him from the forum.

Citrojim is usually correct on problems/diagnosis, so I'd suggest go to another garage and speak to the mechanic about the problems suggested, this will make you sound like you know what you are talking about, and the mechanic will be less likely to fleece you.

If it happened suddenly after going over a speed bump then it point to something that has come loose, a pipe or an electrical connection.

Of course, your current mechanic could be correct, but it will cost hundreds to fix.

Good luck.

f00lzz · Post by **f00lzz** » 26 Apr 2007, 16:39

Intercooler piping may have become jolted free adjacent to the turbo... has the turbo whistle increased in volume???

tomthered · Post by **tomthered** » 26 Apr 2007, 16:56

The guy does not work, he lives nearby. He listened to the engine and said the cylinders were all working. He has not copmpression tested them. I will be going home soon and will check the suggestions then but he does not charge much anyways so I dont think its a case of smelling money.

Oh I have been told its not the version with the electronic thingy but
Will keep everyone posted on developments.

deian · Post by **deian** » 26 Apr 2007, 17:04

Thats fair enough then... a compression test would tell him a lot.

tomthered · Post by **tomthered** » 26 Apr 2007, 18:32

right just been round. It seems he has checked everything and has deduced that No 3 and No 4 cuylinders are not compressing properly. Reason he knows this is because he has released each injector nut to reduce fuel flow, and this should show a noticeable difference int he engine, it doesn't. Only time there is a difference is on No1 and No2 cylinders.

He is fairly certain there is a lack of compression and it seems to be getting worse so best to do it now. So am leaving it with him and hoping that after my 2 week holiday, that when I come back i will have a car engine that is like new.

Thanks all anyways, he has considered what everyone said but has come to the heart sinking conclusion that either the cylinder head gasket has gone, although it may just be a valve.

Post by **Peter.N.** » 26 Apr 2007, 23:35

Could be he was right then.

tomthered · Post by **tomthered** » 28 Apr 2007, 18:12

has now said its not cylinder head but defo fuel related. was talking about the fuel pump not sending fuel at the right time and a governor? inside. Either way he going to check timing as could it be possible the drive over the hump has caused a piece in a worn pump to move out of place and misfeed the fuel? He says it is emitting unburnt fuel that smells like paraffin out of the exhaust.

hopefully in 2 weeks I should have a car that works!! anyone care to comment on that reasoning?

Post by **Peter.N.** » 28 Apr 2007, 19:59

Check the timing belt, it sounds as though its running retarded.