Starting Problem

[SteveG]

Howdy folks and Happy New Year to one and all.

I'm experiencing an annoying problem with the Xantia. Normally it starts very easily, hot or cold, especially with the new battery fitted. If, however, I sit with the engine off but the ignition on - say listening to the radio - for a while then it won't start again. The engine turns over but it doesn't fire up

I'm not talking about being stationary for long periods; anything more than even two or three minutes is enough. To get Vera to start I have to switch off the ignition completely for about 30 to 45 seconds after which she starts normally again.

Does anyone have any idea on this?

[Peter.N.]

The first thing that comes to mind is a sticky stop solonoid in the pump, if that is, its a mechanical pump. Does it have an ECU or a key pad? Otherwise it could be air getting into the fuel system somewhere, although that only usually causes problems after stopping for sometime, unless you are parked facing uphill. Or it could possibly a faulty contact on the ignition switch, does the ignition light come on when it wont start? if it has a key pad, does that behave normally?

[steelcityuk]

My 405TD did the same thing, I put it down to the time out on the glowplugs. I found that unless the engine had just been stopped and was up to temperature it needed the plugs. HDi's don't.

Steve.

[np]

Hi Steve.Sorry to here about your problems .I`m having problems already & mine is only 3 yrs old! .
Anyway,it could be as Peter says as when i had it the stop solonoid would sometimes play up,i.e not starting like it is now & sometimes not switching off when you turned the ing key off.I used to spray some wd40 on it which used to work.
Cheers,Neil.

[np]

By the way,mech pump,no ecu.

[SteveG]

The first thing that comes to mind is a sticky stop solonoid in the pump, if that is, its a mechanical pump. Does it have an ECU or a key pad? Otherwise it could be air getting into the fuel system somewhere, although that only usually causes problems after stopping for sometime, unless you are parked facing uphill. Or it could possibly a faulty contact on the ignition switch, does the ignition light come on when it wont start? if it has a key pad, does that behave normally?

Hi Peter. It has a mechanical pump but I'm not sure how a sticky solenoid would manifest itself in this way. I would expect starting problems all the time id that were faulty - this is only ever after being stationary with the ignition on for a few minutes. Also I discounted air in the fuel line as I would expect the same problem in the mornings when it's been parked overnight, wouldn't I?

The car has a keypad and this appears to be working normally, although how to test it I don't know. When it won't start everything else is exactly as I would expect it to be - all dash lights function correctly.

It's a bit of a brain teaser. Keep the ideas coming

[SteveG]

My 405TD did the same thing, I put it down to the time out on the glowplugs. I found that unless the engine had just been stopped and was up to temperature it needed the plugs. HDi's don't.

Steve.

HI Steve, this was my first thought too but surely these engines don't need the glow plugs to operate when they're fully at working temperature?

[SteveG]

Hi Steve.Sorry to here about your problems .I`m having problems already & mine is only 3 yrs old! .
Anyway,it could be as Peter says as when i had it the stop solonoid would sometimes play up,i.e not starting like it is now & sometimes not switching off when you turned the ing key off.I used to spray some wd40 on it which used to work.
Cheers,Neil.

Morning Neil, more trouble from this bag-of-nails you sold me - only kidding

I'd kinda discounted the solenoid as this is the only scenario where the car doesn't start and (from my experience of solenoid problems on an older Discovery) would have expected random non-starting problems if it were faulty. I'll give it a squirt of the magic stuff anyway and see if that helps

[Peter.N.]

If it has a key pad I dont think you can get to the solonoid as I believe its buried in the pump, which makes fault finding very difficult as you cant get to the solonoid connection, but it certainly sounds as though the solonoid valve is not opening. Have you tried turning the ignition on and off several times?

[Stewart(oily)]

All of the TD motors that I have owned seem to need glowplugs to start every time, even when well up to temp and only stopped for a minute, at first I thought it was a problem but now I think its a characteristic, in contrast non turbo ones will start straight away without waiting for the orange light even after standing for a few hours!, you are probably fooling the cold start relay, later Xants seem to have this controlled by the ECU as the timing of the glow plug light is far shorter with a warm engine, older ones seem to have the same timing regardless of temperature.
Stewart

[stevenlizuk]

Just a thought, although you might have checked this already.

Are the battery terminals tight?

I had problems with starting a while back and I traced it back to a loose negative terminal on the battery. Once tightened there was no more problem.

Fingers crossed it is as simple as that.

Cheers

Steve

[BonceChops]

The engine turns over but it doesn't fire up

Have you tried turning key off then trying to start it again?

[steelcityuk]

I know that a TD has a lower compression ratio than a normally aspirated diesel so that could be why they need plugs to start even when hot. Also age and mileage seem to effect them slightly in so much as even with new plugs a couple of extra seconds on a cold morning makes the startup much cleaner. Still a great engine for it's time. My old 405GTX TD (now the wifes) is still lovely to drive and the engine is still as sweet as ever, still it's only got 92K on the clock.

Steve.

[SteveG]

Have you tried turning key off then trying to start it again?

Yes, but that doesn't work. I have to wait at least 30 seconds before turning the ignition on again to get her to start. Which got me to wondering if there was an electrical component/unit somewhere that maybe is overheating but the circuit diagram in the HBOL doesn't throw up any likely culprits.

[SteveG]

Just a thought, although you might have checked this already.

Are the battery terminals tight?

Fingers crossed it is as simple as that.

Cheers

Steve

Hi Steve, this problem pre-dates me fitting the new battery. In fact I thought it might have been a battery problem ~ generally down on AH, being drained by listening to the radio whilst not charging and, therefore, needing a few seconds to recover before starting. The terminals are good and tight and liberally coated in copper-slip to prevent corrosion.