Xantia F. lower-arm bushes – Puller help please!

sbraud · Unread post by **sbraud** » 17 Aug 2006, 13:26

Hi guys,

Under car with F wheel off and drop link disconnected looking for extra movement within suspension. Pushing and pulling (in, out, left & right) by hand, on hub I noticed a slight movement within lower-arm bush. It wasn’t an alarming amount of movement, but only force used was both hands, without the normal load and force it would be under on the road at speed.

I appreciate there should be some movement here but how much and what force needed? This is the not usual up and down movement of arm but more left to right.

She’s a ’95 on original bushes so if they’re on the way out it’s probably not surprising…

Cheers
Steve

bernie · Unread post by **bernie** » 17 Aug 2006, 14:32

Hi Steve

My Xantia would do ' a slight sideways shuffle' when driving over warning rumble strips at mini roundabouts.

I checked my lower arm bushes and found slight perceivable play much like you have. They were original bushes and had just passed the MOT.

I replaced all 4 bushes and the steering became more direct and less wooly.

Well worth doing

AndersDK · Unread post by **AndersDK** » 17 Aug 2006, 14:42

Take a crowbar at least 0.5m long. Clamp it such you have at least 0.3m free end measured from center of swivel joint to force applied point on the end of the crowbar.
Using a dynamometer apply horizontal force of 50mDA. Then using a micrometer gauge check that the rubber in the control arm bushes does not compress more than 0.5mm at the point where it compresses most.
This is true for both directions of applied force.

Is that what you need ? (nobody will test it that way

)

Translated to DIY language :
With car's weight on wheels, rear wheels blocked by wooden blocks etc., try move the car by applying rotational force on the wheel.
Check that the wheel does not move unduly - except for some movement felt as hard rubber is compressed.

Note : the MOT tester will never remove the wheel and try bend the control arm to judge rubber detoriation in the bushings.
He will do a test using a crowbar and judge the movement in the bushings.
With his trained eye he can immediately see if its too much or within normal limits.

"His trained eye" can not be translated to any firm rule.
Please note the first paragraphs using a crowbar and micrometer gauge are a joke 8)

sbraud · Unread post by **sbraud** » 17 Aug 2006, 20:00

Thanks bernie. Steering is getting woolly… defiantly not as sharp as it once was. Was it much of a job to get old bushes out

Anders: I seem to have mislaid my dynamometer and haven’t seen that darn micrometer in ages… So I’ll just have to slum it and go down the DIY route.

Cheers gents

Steve

citronut · Unread post by **citronut** » 17 Aug 2006, 20:23

if you can feel any movment by hand you bushes need replacing as this will put your front wheels out of track and wear tyres,if you run the flat of your hand around both inside and outside edges of you tyres,one edge at a time,you will feel the blocks of tread raised on the front end of the blocks,this dose indicate iregular tyre wear and points to them running out of true,hense towing in or out
regards malcolm

bernie · Unread post by **bernie** » 17 Aug 2006, 20:30

sbraud wrote: Was it much of a job to get old bushes out

Yes

Cut/drill the rubber out first (you could burn but would be anti social) then using a hacksaw cut lenghtways to get the outer sleeve removed.

When fitting the rear remember to orientate them as you will not be able to move them once pressed in

citronut · Unread post by **citronut** » 18 Aug 2006, 08:18

0r you could either buy a f**d cortina type bush removal/refitting tool,which i have had for many years,i use this on many differant cars,or make yourself a tool with a length of threaded rod,a couple of nuts to fit the thread,a length of tube the right size for the bush to fit inside but not tight,and somthing like a socket just under the size of the bush O/D,and bongo you have a bush removal/refitting tool
regards malcolm

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 18 Aug 2006, 17:50

bernie wrote:
sbraud wrote: Was it much of a job to get old bushes out

Yes

Cut/drill the rubber out first (you could burn but would be anti social) then using a hacksaw cut lenghtways to get the outer sleeve removed.

When fitting the rear remember to orientate them as you will not be able to move them once pressed in

Don't burn them out. They can explode (or at least 205 GTi ones can anyway)

and go off like a little bomb. Something to do with the rubber compound boiling and expanding under pressure until something gives...

Rostami · Unread post by **Rostami** » 18 Aug 2006, 20:43

Just one issue:

The bushes must ony be firmly bolted once the car is on the floor again. Most mechanics do not take this into account, i.e., they tighten the bushes when the car is "on air". This is nasty because the bushed will be under great strain when supporting the weight of the car.

citronut · Unread post by **citronut** » 18 Aug 2006, 21:13

yep just do the bolst up till they just touch,the put the weight of the car on its wheels then finaly fully tighten the bolts,this way the bushes are sitting at the corect line once you have finnished
regards malcolm

sbraud · Unread post by **sbraud** » 21 Aug 2006, 07:48

Thanks again guys.

Looks like I’ve found another under-the-car job.

Just what I need to keep the summer rain off my head.

I’ll let you know how I get on.

Cheers
Steve

sbraud · Unread post by **sbraud** » 26 Sep 2006, 07:25

OK I’m about to get parts to do this job. One thing I’m not sure of though. What size of bush puller do I need for Xantia lower arm front bush? Does it have to be a bush puller or will some other type of puller work

Steep learning curve in the world of pullers – No gags please

Cheers
Steve

citronut · Unread post by **citronut** » 26 Sep 2006, 13:41

as i said in earlyer reply the F**RD CORTINA void bush tool works for me,i have had it for years and use it on many diferant bushes,i would think you can still buy one from a good motor factors,or if your good at making special tools,get a short length of tube just the right diamiter for the bush to slide through without binding,you can check this once you have got the new bushes,a length of threaded stud and nuts to fit,about 4 times the length of the bush and some heavy large whashers to fit the stud then you have a puller
regards malcolm

jgra1 · Unread post by **jgra1** » 26 Sep 2006, 16:41

for an extra few quid by a new lower arm?

i have done many of the rearmost bushes by going to a local garage and giving them £5 for their press.. but the front one is harder..
a whole lower arm is only 30-40£ and has all new bushes and lower ball joint?

John

citronut · Unread post by **citronut** » 26 Sep 2006, 20:32

lower swivel dose not come with new BX arms as the swivel is not part of the arm,as it is on saxos and the like
regadrds malcolm