Xantia drives like a mattress!

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Martin Shorthose
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Joined: 06 Nov 2002, 21:56
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Xantia drives like a mattress!

Post by Martin Shorthose »

Hi Guys,
For the past two weeks I have been suffering from really hard rear suspension on my R-reg Xantia 1.9TD and joined this forum to try and explain what was up.
Having established that this is caused by duff rear spheres, I took the car to the local garage (who do quite a bit of Citroen work) for their opinion - which was that the rear spheres were duff.
Great! They did the job on Saturday and I was looking forward to having that "Flying Carpet" ride back.
Unfortunately, it now drives like a flying mattress - whereas before it was like the springs had gone, now its like the shocks have gone!
Pulling away from a standstill, the rear of the car drops significantly and while it rides bumps in the road fairly well, any lumps or undulations set the car bouncing alarmingly.
I can't decide whether it is the front or the rear which is misbehaving - its like the old Austin 1300 with Hydrolastic suspension; when you push down on the front, the rear goes up!
Could this be a symptom of air in the system which needs bleeding or has having new rear spheres highlighted the need for new front ones?
The car is going back to the garage anyway - I can't cope with the sea-sickness! - but if this is the symptom of an obvious problem, then I would be grateful if someone could let me know.
Ta!
Martin
mbunting
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Post by mbunting »

I would have thought air in the system was a little unlikeley, especially with the back brakes being linked to the suspension.
Is the ride like this when the rear is empty ? How about loading up the boot ?
The trouble is, having supposedly good spheres may now highlight other problems which were being masked.
When was the last time you changed the LHM ?
What about tyre pressures - are these ok ?
One remote possibility is that the garrage have put the wrong spec spheres on ?
I'm sure a few others have some more ideas, this would be what I would check first though.
Dip a bit of VERY CLEAN rag into the LHM tank - what colour is the fluid ? It should be bright green. When I got my car, it was a dark brown colour - not good.
Martin Shorthose
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Post by Martin Shorthose »

Thanks for such a prompt response!
It's difficult to tell whether the back brakes do much on a Xantia anyway since the bias seems very much towards the front - even the handbrake works on the front of course.
I am using as a comparison, the state of the car about three weeks ago before the suspension first hardened up but yes, this is with the back of the car empty.
Tyre pressures are fine and the symptoms are most definitely suspension oriented - I would need half inflated tractor tyres to make it bounce like this!
It could indeed be that I need to replace the LHM fluid, but again, it was fine three weeks ago.
The possibility of wrong spheres is not that remote - I don't know exactly how good this garage is on specific models. I know they sell a few Xantias and XMs second hand and that they seem to know how to put poorly ones right for potential customers.
Any other suggestions?
Martin
mbunting
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Post by mbunting »

You're right in saying there doesn't appear to be much breaking effort at the back. The back suspension and the brakes are linked in such a way as to make the effort dependant on the suspension load.
Basically, the more stuff in the boot / back of the car, or towing a caravan, the greater the rear breaking effort.
I would bleed the rear brakes to make sure there is no air, failing that, and assuming good LHM, I would suggest the wrong spheres ?
Mat.
Niek
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Post by Niek »

Hi,
The damping of the suspension as well as the actual suspension are both provided by the spheres. The sphere has a little hole in it through which the LHM flows in and out of the sphere. This hole acts like a damper. The spheres vary in volume, pressure and damper hole size. You need to be absolutely sure that you have the right spheres or the suspension won't work the way it's supposed to.
Goodluck,
Niek.
alexx
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Post by alexx »

I agree with Niek, but I must slightly correct his explanation. That little central hole is not of much importance, as there are 8 bigger holes under the small plates around it, which opens under pressure (4 for compression, 4 holes for extension). There are many types of rear spheres, all with similar central hole about 1.1 mm (in case of non-hydractive suspension), but the damping is different. Check the part number, stamped on spheres.
Niek
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Post by Niek »

hmmm
I really should take a sphere off my car someday <img src=icon_smile.gif border=0 align=middle> it's just that I haven't had any problems with them yet.
Thanks for the extra info.
Niek.
hisdec
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Post by hisdec »

Have you checked out the rear middle sphere? It's likely that if this is depressurised then you would be effectively running on the outer two spheres - nice and bouncy - and the middle of the car would not be 'held up'. My 95 XM estate is awaiting replacement/regassing of the two as I have had the four outer spheres done. ON the XM it's fairly simple to identify - the 'wallowing' almost disappears when in sport mode - as this isolates the fornt and rear middle spheres and works on the four outer ones only, making the car corner far flatter.
The rear of the car used to bang over humps and bumps like yours - now it floats rather too well, so I'm looing forward to getting the middle spheres done. Trouble is, they are a bit of a sod to get to where as the outer spheres are a piece of cake to do by comparison. Also the middle spheres are under pressure from the system so you'd have to bleed the system first if you were going to do it yourself - not much fun and nearly impossible if you don't happen to have a ramp handy. If you're getting them recharged then get them to do both the front and rear. I think the front is easier to get to than the back but don't pay too much labour charge for it - it's not exactly rocket science to do the job.
Finally, did they use the old seals for the new spheres? An old sphere seal can make the car 'drop' a few seconds after 'takeoff' and even when you switch off the engine.
Good luck!
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