Zx no glow pugs.

James.UK · Unread post by **James.UK** » 17 Nov 2005, 15:41

My lil ZX has finaly caused me a problem, the glowplug light on the dash doesn't light up at all, and the car fails to start..

After giving the wires going under-into the big black box near the Battery a good wiggling in case it was a bad connection the light still failed to come on.. So I cranked it over for ages, (good job I bought a new battery two weeks ago) till it practically vanished into a cloud of grey mist, but it won't start. Too cold I think, the bonnet is still covered in frost...

Have phoned the RAC for a tow into my local garage as I know nothing about elecs at all..

I will let you know what caused the problem asap....

Sl4yer · Unread post by **Sl4yer** » 17 Nov 2005, 16:30

Bugger.... Unlucky James.

I'm dreading the day I get a phone call telling me a similar thing!

James

jeremy · Unread post by **jeremy** » 17 Nov 2005, 16:49

My guess is that the glowplugs have failed. the generally fail closely and if the car has been getting progressively worse recently this is what has probably happened. they will often start reasonably well on 2, 1 perhaps and none - well!

to test, disconnect the heavy lead from them and test for continuity with a test lamp or meter. (resistance should be 0 ohms). to replace - unscrew and carefully fit new ones - by carefully I mean screw it in by hand fully before tightening to avoid crossing the thread. One of the end ones is a real pig - as a temporary measure it may function on 3.

uhn113x · Unread post by **uhn113x** » 17 Nov 2005, 17:01

Hi James
It looks as if there is something wrong with the timer if the light is not on, and the glowplugs are probably OK. Try sticking a jump lead from one of the plugs to battery positive - it should start after about 10 seconds.
Can you source a timer from a scrappy, or is anyone breaking one?

Don't chuck it away - I may be able to repair it.

Don't take it near a dealer - they will replace timer, plugs, battery and anything else they wish to train their apprentices on.

Let us know the outcome.

James.UK · Unread post by **James.UK** » 17 Nov 2005, 17:07

RAC man came in just under an hour, and diagnosed a faulty relay. said it has feed both in and out but the relay itself is not working. The relay he checked is attached to the big black box right next to the battery and alongside the wing, it is fixed to the front of said box, by a single small bolt, and it has two heavy duty looking wires bolted to it.. Hope that's clear enough to understand..

We started the car very easily with a light spray of "easystart" and I drove it to my usual garage, they are going to sort it for me in the morning..

Lesson for today.. Keep a tin of 'easystart' in the boot.

Question is, how would I spray it into the inlet pipe and turn the engine over at the same time? is there some way to short the starter from under the bonnet?

Mazda's in for it's MOT on Monday.. Should pass no probs. (touches wood) lol

.

uhn113x · Unread post by **uhn113x** » 17 Nov 2005, 17:12

James.UK wrote:RAC man came in just under an hour, and diagnosed a faulty relay. said it has feed both in and out but the relay itself is not working. The relay he checked is attached to the big black box right next to the battery and alongside the wing, it is fixed to the front of said box, by a single small bolt, and it has two heavy duty looking wires bolted to it.. Hope that's clear enough to understand..

We started the car very easily with a light spray of "easystart" and I drove it to my usual garage, they are going to sort it for me in the morning..

Lesson for today.. Keep a tin of 'easystart' in the boot.

Question is, how would I spray it into the inlet pipe and turn the engine over at the same time? is there some way to short the starter from under the bonnet?

Mazda's in for it's MOT on Monday.. Should pass no probs. (touches wood) lol
.

Hi James
As I said. They call it a relay, but the glowplug timer is quite a bit more than that.
To start it under the bonnet, you could short out the two big terminals on the starter.

James.UK · Unread post by **James.UK** » 17 Nov 2005, 17:28

Hi Jeremy, I hadn't seen your comment before my last posting, or yours either MIke.. sorry.

Well the car has always been very very easy to start

so doubt it's a glow plugs problem..

Cheers Mike, I will keep the old unit in case its ever needed, dunno quite how my tame mechanic will resolve the problem but he's normaly very reasonable and seems to have a lot of spare stuff for ZX's lying around, in fact there is a fuel pump on his bench for a turbo ZX if anyone needs one? Bosch I think.. Can ask if anyone is interested.. Fortunately both mechanics are previous ZX owners

Re shorting the starter, thanks for the info Mike..

erm, I hope it never comes in handy. lmho

.

jeremy · Unread post by **jeremy** » 17 Nov 2005, 18:57

The relay fitted to the 1.9D (and possibly the turbo) is quite interesting in its function as I think it actually turns off the plugs while the starter is operating. Our ZX 1.9D refused to operate its starter last Sunday and in my preliminary checks I asked my partner to try and operate the starter with the headlights on - and to my complete surprise they got brighter.

Think the fault is a bad connection (no1, yellow lead) in the engine loom multi-plug - which looks like being Saturday's job. Hope its snowing! and it'll have to wait another week!

jeremy

sooty · Unread post by **sooty** » 17 Nov 2005, 19:39

I replaced mine some time ago, as you say the light was not coming on and the plugs not working. They are easy enough to replace, two wires and a multiplug connection, also the fastener holding it to the car.

When its replaced you'll notice, as all relays do the same, that when the light goes out the plugs will carry on heating for awhile longer of approx 20/25secs. If you listen to the running engine when you start it from cold, after about 20secs you'll hear the engine note change to a slightly higher rev. Thats because the high current being drawn by the plugs heating has been dropped by the Relay, although the light went out just after a few secs when you turned on the ignition to start.

NiSk · Unread post by **NiSk** » 17 Nov 2005, 21:38

In general, do NOT use start-spray on a diesel!

If you have NO other option, make sure any pre-heaters, glow plugs etc. are disconnected before any attempt is made at starting.

Start spray contains a nasty solvent (ether) which does nasty things to MAFs in the air line and can cause spontaneous combustion in a diesel due to the very high compression. Not good at all, knackered bearings, no cylinder wall lubrication, you name it - it will take years off the life of a diesel, and if you ignore the warnings in paragraph 2 above it could well take your's as well!

//NiSk

fastandfurryous · Unread post by **fastandfurryous** » 17 Nov 2005, 23:17

I agree completely with NiSk here. Ether easy-start is the work of the devil and will cause all manner of damage to almost any modern engine. Personally, I wouldn't even use it on a lawnmower engine.

The glowplug timer unit on these is the same unit that has been used on EVERYTHING with an XUD in it, since 1982. If your mechanic blokey hasn't got one, then 2 minutes in a breakers will provide half-a-dozen of them for sure.

Just to be complete.... I do mean the Non-turbo engines here. Some of the later TD models had an arrangement with post-heating, and I believe the units are different on these.

Certainly the timer in my 1994 405TD is identical to the one that was fitted to my 1984 Horizon D. (and every other D/TD car I had between these models!)

James.UK · Unread post by **James.UK** » 18 Nov 2005, 02:41

Thanks for the warning about "easy start". I will use the trick Mike mentioned instead, should a similar problem ever occur in Future..

>>Try sticking a jump lead from one of the plugs to battery positive - it should start after about 10 seconds. <<

My normal routine is to get in the car, turn the ign on, then sort my seatbelt, mobile phone, etc, out before trying to start the engine, so it prob gets a bit longer for the glow plugs to work than is usually the case.

citronut · Unread post by **citronut** » 18 Nov 2005, 08:17

James.UK wrote:Hi Jeremy, I hadn't seen your comment before my last posting, or yours either MIke.. sorry.

Well the car has always been very very easy to start so doubt it's a glow plugs problem..

Cheers Mike, I will keep the old unit in case its ever needed, dunno quite how my tame mechanic will resolve the problem but he's normaly very reasonable and seems to have a lot of spare stuff for ZX's lying around, in fact there is a fuel pump on his bench for a turbo ZX if anyone needs one? Bosch I think.. Can ask if anyone is interested.. Fortunately both mechanics are previous ZX owners

Re shorting the starter, thanks for the info Mike.. erm, I hope it never comes in handy. lmho
.

if you just short the two large terminals on the starter,all that will happen is the motor will spin but wont throw the gear into mesh,the best way to cranck over from under the hood is have a length of light gauge wire long enough to go from the starter to the + on the battery,with a female blade terminal on one end which you plug onto to the blade terminal on the solanoid,then touch the other end to the plus on battery,
also you sould not use easy start to often as its no good for the engine
regards malcolm

James.UK · Unread post by **James.UK** » 18 Nov 2005, 15:25

My lil ZX is back on the road again.

The problem was dry joints in the glow plug timer relay fingy as already diagnosed by our members

They cured it by resoldering the joints inside the unit.

The light on the dashboard now shines once more.

..

Total cost was £30. Thanks for all your advice..