STOP and (!) light

aljohnso · Post by **aljohnso** » 26 Sep 2005, 18:35

I have a P reg Xantia 1.9TD and recently the stop and (!) light have been coming on together. It gives the helpful advice in the manual that I stop immediately and call a citroen dealer.
It looks to me (and given that it's a citroen) like an electrical problem.
The lights are coming on at the same time and flickering/staying on/going off completely randomly (independant of revs/lights/braking/speed/gear etc etc). If it is electrics where should I start?
I also know that the hydraulic pump is leaking very slightly but then the lights should come on and stay on, or go on at low revs right?
cheers
Al.

Ciaran · Post by **Ciaran** » 26 Sep 2005, 18:52

STOP together with (!) generally means a hydraulic pressure problem.
Whats the LHM level like ? Is the car rising Ok ? Does the light come on if you push the brakes and steer, or steer while the car is rising, for instance ?
On my XM, both of those were always on at startup, however they would flicker and gradually go out as the car lifted. Generally, they should not be on unless theres a problem.

aljohnso · Post by **aljohnso** » 26 Sep 2005, 19:18

level is ok - maybe borderline too full. Car rises ok. Lights seem to come on randomly with no logic to steering/brakes revs etc. I had assumed however that flickering was more likely to be electrical but if that's the way it shows itself as a hydraulic problem then maybe it's the pump.

Clogzz · Post by **Clogzz** » 26 Sep 2005, 20:23

Won't be the pump.
If you lose pressure, the steering gets heavy.
The fluid level indicator must be checked with the engine running and the car set to 'high'.

aljohnso · Post by **aljohnso** » 26 Sep 2005, 20:46

k, didn't realise that with the fluid level - will check tonight
thanks
Al.

oilyspanner · Post by **oilyspanner** » 26 Sep 2005, 21:58

Dont take any notice of the floating indicator, these are prone to sticking at the top! dont ask how I know! stick a finger in! if it comes out oily you probably have enough LHM
Stewart

citronut · Post by **citronut** » 26 Sep 2005, 23:45

they normaly only get stuck up the top when there is excesive fluid in the tank,the way the float works its near imposible for it to get stuck
regards maolcolm

Homer · Post by **Homer** » 27 Sep 2005, 01:14

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by aljohnso

I also know that the hydraulic pump is leaking very slightly but then the lights should come on and stay on, or go on at low revs right?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
No because the accumulator sphere provides backup pressure.
It could be this which has gone though.

Mandrake · Post by **Mandrake** » 27 Sep 2005, 01:55

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by aljohnso

I have a P reg Xantia 1.9TD and recently the stop and (!) light have been coming on together. It gives the helpful advice in the manual that I stop immediately and call a citroen dealer.
It looks to me (and given that it's a citroen) like an electrical problem.
The lights are coming on at the same time and flickering/staying on/going off completely randomly (independant of revs/lights/braking/speed/gear etc etc). If it is electrics where should I start?
I also know that the hydraulic pump is leaking very slightly but then the lights should come on and stay on, or go on at low revs right?
cheers
Al.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Where is it leaking ? If it has an output side leak it may have an intake side leak as well drawing in air.
There are two things that can cause that light to go on (both sensors are wired in parallel) - low oil level in the tank as measured by the float sensor which has a copper disc and a pair of contacts.
The other is the high pressure switch (located in the safety valve in the main high pressure supply line) which comes on when the regulator pressure is below approximately 100 bars. (Normal operating pressure is 170 bars)
First thing to check is the float level - and just to be sure you're checking it correctly, you are setting the suspension to full height with the engine idling and waiting for it to fully lift before taking the reading right ?
To try and seperate which sensor is giving the fault indication you could temporarily disconnect the wires to the float level sensor and take a short (!) drive and see whether the flickering persists. If it does you know the problem lies in the high pressure side, and if the pressure is dropping enough to trigger the stop light during driving you have a serious problem.
Next thing I would try is to check for signs of a leak causing the pump to suck in air - set the suspension to low, open the 12mm bleed screw on the regulator, and while the engine idles, peer through the top of the LHM tank filler with a torch and look for signs of bubbling or frothing. If you can see either chances are good that the intake to the pump has an air leak. Not seeing bubbles is not conclusive that there ISNT a leak however.
Regards,
Simon

Post by **c.morewood** » 27 Sep 2005, 12:12

I have to agree with oilyspanner on this one... your first check should be the LHM level. Don't take any notice of the float.. i had the same symptoms for 6 months... took it to 2 different citroen main dealers and they couldn't find a fault.. thought it was electrical...eventually took the car to an independant small garage.. ex citroen mechanic..and he found the fault straight away..low LHM and a stuck float... and from then on he does all my servicing.
Chris

citronut · Post by **citronut** » 28 Sep 2005, 02:32

level check as you have said but with car on level ground
regards malcolmOriginally posted by Mandrake

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by aljohnso

I have a P reg Xantia 1.9TD and recently the stop and (!) light have been coming on together. It gives the helpful advice in the manual that I stop immediately and call a citroen dealer.
It looks to me (and given that it's a citroen) like an electrical problem.
The lights are coming on at the same time and flickering/staying on/going off completely randomly (independant of revs/lights/braking/speed/gear etc etc). If it is electrics where should I start?
I also know that the hydraulic pump is leaking very slightly but then the lights should come on and stay on, or go on at low revs right?
cheers
Al.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Where is it leaking ? If it has an output side leak it may have an intake side leak as well drawing in air.
There are two things that can cause that light to go on (both sensors are wired in parallel) - low oil level in the tank as measured by the float sensor which has a copper disc and a pair of contacts.
The other is the high pressure switch (located in the safety valve in the main high pressure supply line) which comes on when the regulator pressure is below approximately 100 bars. (Normal operating pressure is 170 bars)
First thing to check is the float level - and just to be sure you're checking it correctly, you are setting the suspension to full height with the engine idling and waiting for it to fully lift before taking the reading right ?
To try and seperate which sensor is giving the fault indication you could temporarily disconnect the wires to the float level sensor and take a short (!) drive and see whether the flickering persists. If it does you know the problem lies in the high pressure side, and if the pressure is dropping enough to trigger the stop light during driving you have a serious problem.
Next thing I would try is to check for signs of a leak causing the pump to suck in air - set the suspension to low, open the 12mm bleed screw on the regulator, and while the engine idles, peer through the top of the LHM tank filler with a torch and look for signs of bubbling or frothing. If you can see either chances are good that the intake to the pump has an air leak. Not seeing bubbles is not conclusive that there ISNT a leak however.
Regards,
Simon
[/quote]