ES9J4 cam belt replacement

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xantiav6
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ES9J4 cam belt replacement

Post by xantiav6 »

In a few weeks my Xantia V6 will reach 80,000 miles and that seems to be the time to do the cam belt. A Citroen dealer service department, when asked the recommended mileage for this operation, replied "We don't know, are you sure it has a belt?"
I have had a couple of quotes for the belt change (not including the 80,000 mile service) and these were around £300 and around £450.
I might do the job myself, but would like to know if there are any difficult bits or special tools? Is there any write-up available on this job?
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Post by Stempy »

I've had a look at the Peugeot version of "how to change a V6 cam belt". Looks like it might take a week or two to do! I've also been quoted £400 by a Cit dealer. I'd like to have a go myself, but at present it's my only car so I wouldn't want to risk it being off the road for any length of time when I cock it up.
Jon

Post by Jon »

Rather you than me fellas!
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alan s
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Post by alan s »

I'd have a go at almost anything, but after looking at that; my head hurts...[:(][xx(][:(][xx(][|)]
Surely, there must be some procedure that has to be followed including stepped pins etc??????
I think I'll go and have a beer or two or three or....now
Alan S[}:)]
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Post by RichardW »

I think that IS the procedure - follow the numbers! Interesting it appears to involve at least 3 special tools, and removal of all 4 cam sprockets. Gulp.[:0] I have no idea what the tensioner diagram is on about though. No wonder it's a £400 job!
PS Clearly this is a Haynes SIX spanner job "Not even suitable for you local dealer" [:o)]
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JohnW
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Post by JohnW »

What CAN you say???
It seems to me that there's a lot to be said for 4 cylinder engines with one camshaft and 8 valves.
Then again, a timing chain good for 20 years or more and pushrods doesn't seem so bad an option either....
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Post by ActivaV6uk »

I'm going to do this shortly too, i have however got an engine out of a v6 i can take a picture of it and you can see what it looks like in real life. After you look at that go to your car and look at the 5-10mm of room you have to work in while doing the cam belt.
My sugested method would be to take the engine out of the botom of the car after removing the subframe then it should be easy [V]
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Post by ACTIVE8 »

Oh no [:(] That "serpentine" belt looks like a lot of hard work !
I wish you the best of luck ! [:D]
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"> Originally posted by xantiav6
In a few weeks my Xantia V6 will reach 80,000 miles and that seems to be the time to do the cam belt. A Citroen dealer service department, when asked the recommended mileage for this operation, replied "We don't know, are you sure it has a belt?"
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
It doesn't make anyone have much faith in a main dealer, when they have people with such a lack of technical knowledge, answering the phones, let alone working on a customers car !
I have been tempted to think about getting a V6 Xantia, but they don't seem to come up for sale very often.
I take it there are not that many of them about ?
The extra power that the V6 offers would be great, but that belt looks like a technical nightmare.
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Post by beezer »

Here are the instructions to go with the diagram that Jon posted.
Special Tools
Crankshaft timing pin - Citroen No.C.0187A.
Camshaft timing pins - 4 x Citroen No.C.0187B.
Timing belt retaining clip - Citroen No.C.0187J.
Camshaft sprocket holding tool - Citroen No.C.0187F.
Tensioning tool - Citroen No.C.0187E.
Tension gauge - Citroen No.4122-T (SEEM C.Tronic G2 105.5).
M8 x 1,25 x 75 mm bolt.
M8 x 1,25 x 40 mm bolt.
Removal
1. Remove:
Auxiliary drive belt.
Oil filler cap.
Upper engine cover.
2. Disconnect fuel pipes from fuel rail - XM.
3. Support engine.
4. Remove:
Engine control module (ECM) box.
RH engine mounting.
RH splash guard - XM.
Auxiliary drive belt tensioner assembly.
Timing belt upper covers [1].
Bracket [2].
Crankshaft pulley bolts [3].
Crankshaft pulley [4].
Timing belt lower cover [5].
5. Turn crankshaft clockwise to setting position.
6. Insert crankshaft timing pin [6]. Tool No.C.0187A.
7. Insert timing pins in camshaft sprockets [7]. Tool No.C.0187B.
8. Insert M8 x 1,25 x 75 mm bolt into tensioner bracket [8].
9. Tighten bolt [8]until it touches bracket [9].
10. Insert M8 x 1,25 x 40 mm bolt into tensioner bracket [10].
11. Install special tool No.C.0187E [11].
12. Tighten bolt [10]until it touches bracket [12].
13. Fully tighten bolt [10].
14. Slacken tensioner bolts [13], [14] & [15].
NOTE: DO NOT slacken bolt [16]11469.
15. Slacken bolt [8].
16. Remove timing belt.
NOTE: Mark direction of rotation on belt with chalk if belt is to be reused.
Installation
1. Ensure crankshaft timing pin located correctly [6]. Tool No.C.0187A.
2. Ensure timing pins located correctly in camshaft sprockets [7]. Tool No.C.0187B.
3. Slacken bolts of each camshaft sprocket [17].
4. Ensure camshaft sprockets turn freely.
5. Turn camshaft sprockets fully clockwise in slotted holes.
6. Tighten bolts to 5 Nm [17].
7. Slacken bolts 45° [17].
8. Tighten bolts to 10 Nm [13], [14] & [15].
9. Slacken bolts 45° [13], [14] & [15].
10. Fit timing belt to crankshaft sprocket.
11. Retain in position with special tool. Tool No.C.0187J.
12. Fit timing belt in anti-clockwise direction.
NOTE: If reusing old belt: Observe direction of rotation marks.
13. Turn each camshaft sprocket to engage in nearest belt tooth.
NOTE: Ensure bolts not at end of slotted holes in sprockets [17]11469. Angular movement of sprockets must not
be more than one tooth space [18]11469.
14. Ensure belt is taut between sprockets.
15. Remove retaining clip from timing belt. Tool No.C.0187J.
16. Attach tension gauge to belt at . Tool No.4122-T [19].
17. Tighten bolt [8]until tension gauge indicates 83±2 SEEM units.
18. Hold camshaft sprockets. Use tool No.C.0187F.
19.Tighten camshaft sprocket bolts (CA4) [17]. Tightening torque: 10 Nm.
20.Tighten camshaft sprocket bolts (CA3) [17]. Tightening torque: 10 Nm.
21.Tighten camshaft sprocket bolts (CA2) [17]. Tightening torque: 10 Nm.
22.Tighten camshaft sprocket bolts (CA1) [17]. Tightening torque: 10 Nm.
23.Tighten bolt [13]. Tightening torque: 25 Nm. 24.Tighten bolt [14]. Tightening torque: 25 Nm.
25.Tighten bolt [15]. Tightening torque: 25 Nm.
26. Remove tension gauge [19].
27. Remove timing pins from camshaft sprockets [7].
28. Remove crankshaft timing pin [6].
29.Turn crankshaft slowly 10 turns clockwise.
30.Insert timing pins in camshaft sprockets [7]. Tool No.C.0187B.
31.Insert crankshaft timing pin [6]. Tool No.C.0187A.
32.Slacken bolts of each camshaft sprocket [17].
33.Slacken bolts [13], [14] & [15].
34.Remove bolt [10].
35.Adjust position of bolt [8]until tool [11]slides freely without free play. Tool No.C.0187E.
36.Wait 2 minutes to allow automatic tensioner unit and belt to settle.
37.Check tool [11]slides freely without free play. Tool No.C.0187E.
38.Adjust if necessary.
39.Remove special tool [11].
40.Hold camshaft sprockets. Use tool No.C.0187F.
41.Tighten bolt [13]. Tightening torque: 25 Nm.
42.Tighten bolt [14]. Tightening torque: 25 Nm.
43.Tighten bolt [15]. Tightening torque: 25 Nm.
44.Tighten camshaft sprocket bolts (CA4) [17]. Tightening torque: 10 Nm.
45.Tighten camshaft sprocket bolts (CA3) [17]. Tightening torque: 10 Nm.
46.Tighten camshaft sprocket bolts (CA2) [17]. Tightening torque: 10 Nm.
47.Tighten camshaft sprocket bolts (CA1) [17]. Tightening torque: 10 Nm.
48.Remove bolt [8].
49.Remove crankshaft timing pin [6].
50.Remove timing pins [7].
51.Install components in reverse order of removal.
52.Tighten crankshaft pulley bolts [3]. Tightening torque: 25 Nm.
xantiav6
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Post by xantiav6 »

Well, I feel much better now...
I think that I am discouraged by the tools required, so it looks like a job for the specialists.
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Post by David Goddard »

I changed one without any special tools - I used drills to hold the 4 camshaft pulleys and the crankshaft pulley in place. I must say that the "old" belt was in perfect condition at 80,000. It's so wide and thick that I think it would have lasted for another 80K. The only aspect I guessed was the tensioning the belt. I took note of how tight the original one was and fitted the replacement slightly tighter. I didn't need to remove the fuel lines. Took all day!
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Post by dan.2cv »

Take heed from item 19:
Ensure mobile phone is switched on and charging for emergency assistance!!
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Post by DoubleChevron »

I reckon I'd give it a bash. For 'special tools', read "drill bits" or "allen keys".
Really it looks very complicated, but it should be quite hard to do it incorrectly when everything is locked down and pinned. Especially if the belt tensioners are automatic.
Certainly I wouldn't be fussed to start the job without a 2nd car to use as backup. Something always, always, always goes wrong. Usually very simple, but my tiny little brain needs the light of a new day to spot what's wrong (usually something blatantly obvious that I've done myself ... eg. Knocking the map sender vacum line off [:o)] ).
seeya,
Shane L.
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Post by David Goddard »

I recall I needed to dash to a local tool shop for a star type socket to help me turn a camshaft pulley slightly to help get the belt on. I bought a set so I can't recall what size was needed.
I didn't follow the method listed above. I worked on the basis that the pitch of the new belt was the same as the old one. Having fitted the belt I turned the engine over a number of times. All 5 pins went smoothly into their holes - so must have been right(?). Certainly the engine sounded just the same as before.
I may have missed something, but would only loosen the camshaft pulley bolts if there was an alighment problem after fitting the new belt.
I did use two jacks under the engine to get the o/s engine mounting lined up before bolting up.
The tensioner is the only aspect I would in retrospect think a bit more about. It's a balance between being too tight and damaging the bearings, too loose so the belt slips off. The latter is very hard to imagine happening as there are plastic shrouds over the camshaft pulleys which would stop that so I set the tensioner at mid travel.
Overall it was a satisfying job but you need some confidence!
xantiav6
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Post by xantiav6 »

Looking again at the description above, it looks do-able, but I do not understand the purpose of special tool C.0187E [11]. Is it a guage for presetting the tensioner position? is it a spanner for moving the tensioner? Is it expensive?
What is the purpose of setting the belt tensioner using the electronic setting guage with the automatic tensioner locked (if I have understood the procedure)? Is it just to stretch the belt before setting the operating point for the automatic tensioner?
I see that GSF sell the cambelt as T13123, but looking in the XM parts book, the part number changed at orga 7846 (3 May 1998). Is this the earlier or later belt, or are they interchangable?
I don't see the need for slackening the cam pulley bolts and adjusting the cam timing, unless it was wrong to start with.
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