Right, I have a BX 17TZD J reg, 180k miles, in need of an MOT. Needs Welding (which im gonna tackle this weekend) and the wipers changing, and a few bulbs... My question is, all the sensor lights in the dash come on and off intermittantly. That is the ABS, The brake pad wear sensor, the coolant level sensor, and the LHM fluid level sesor (ie more or less all lights which will mean it will fail the mot). Now I have tested the alternator with one of those battery/alternator testers, and its saying its overcharging. When you rev the car, it goes back to normal, before idling then overcharging again. Also, when you rev the car, all the sensor lights go out... Has anyone had a similar problem, and if so do you think its the alternator? Cheers
Simon
A Very poorly BX
Moderator: RichardW
Dont rely too much on fancy testers. Mostly they will confuse the non-professional user [:)]
Instead use a simple & cheap hobby voltmeter/multimeter.
When engine (and alternator) is stopped the battery pole voltage should be some 13.5V right after stop, then slowly descending to some 12.8V
While running, the battery pole voltage should be some 14V, slightly increasing with rev'ed engine.
I strongly recommand you test out the circuits involved with the sensor lamps.
Exactly the lamps you have on are the most likely problem areas :
1) either the LHM level is low or the <font color="red"><i>pressure</i></font id="red"> is too low (less than 100bar)
2) The coolant level sensor <font color="red"><i>wiring</i></font id="red"> is prone to pack up. Check the wiring (ignition on, engine stopped) by unplugging the senor plug. This should lit the coolant warning constantly. Then short out the 2 terminals in the (cable-)plug. Now the warning must be out. On some models a low <font color="red"><i>engine oil</i></font id="red"> pressure/level may lit the coolant level warning. You have the oil pressure warning ignition on, engine stopped ?
3) Cables in the front wheelarches for the pad wear warning are prone to shear/chafe/shortcircuit. Very common problem.
4) the ABS light is most likely caused by a bad sensor/sensor cabling in either of 4 wheel arches. The most wellknown MOT devil for BX/Xantia with ABS.
Finally the cable harness from engine compartment to cabin may be chafed at the firewall, causing false earth circuits to the mentioned warning lights.
Note that all the common warning lights are feeded a +12V inside instrument, and the remote earth circuit then lit the lamp.
Instead use a simple & cheap hobby voltmeter/multimeter.
When engine (and alternator) is stopped the battery pole voltage should be some 13.5V right after stop, then slowly descending to some 12.8V
While running, the battery pole voltage should be some 14V, slightly increasing with rev'ed engine.
I strongly recommand you test out the circuits involved with the sensor lamps.
Exactly the lamps you have on are the most likely problem areas :
1) either the LHM level is low or the <font color="red"><i>pressure</i></font id="red"> is too low (less than 100bar)
2) The coolant level sensor <font color="red"><i>wiring</i></font id="red"> is prone to pack up. Check the wiring (ignition on, engine stopped) by unplugging the senor plug. This should lit the coolant warning constantly. Then short out the 2 terminals in the (cable-)plug. Now the warning must be out. On some models a low <font color="red"><i>engine oil</i></font id="red"> pressure/level may lit the coolant level warning. You have the oil pressure warning ignition on, engine stopped ?
3) Cables in the front wheelarches for the pad wear warning are prone to shear/chafe/shortcircuit. Very common problem.
4) the ABS light is most likely caused by a bad sensor/sensor cabling in either of 4 wheel arches. The most wellknown MOT devil for BX/Xantia with ABS.
Finally the cable harness from engine compartment to cabin may be chafed at the firewall, causing false earth circuits to the mentioned warning lights.
Note that all the common warning lights are feeded a +12V inside instrument, and the remote earth circuit then lit the lamp.
Well im gonna have a look today, I did check the brake pad wear wiring, and couldnt find any faults. As for the others, il have a look. The gadget I used was a simple thing, with about 5 leds on it, tells you what percentage charge is in battery, and wether or not the alternator is working. Cheers for the advice so far, il let you all know how it goes.
Simon
Simon
wilkobob - Anders has given you the usual level-headed advice. Just a couple of other points:
In the Tips and Tricks section of the citroenz forum there's a guide by Bob Smith to interpreting and acting on BX warning lights.
Do the lights just come on at low revs? Do they do so all the time or only some of the time?
.... and a couple of other points which may be less relevant:
If the LHM level light is coming on, but only when you go round right-hand bends, it's sure to be a low LHM level. Low lhm pressure, possibly caused by a worn pump, will show itself up with warning lights that take a long time to go off on start-up/raise-up and then "flicker off" gradually.
Brake pad wear lights can come on in wet weather.
In the Tips and Tricks section of the citroenz forum there's a guide by Bob Smith to interpreting and acting on BX warning lights.
Do the lights just come on at low revs? Do they do so all the time or only some of the time?
.... and a couple of other points which may be less relevant:
If the LHM level light is coming on, but only when you go round right-hand bends, it's sure to be a low LHM level. Low lhm pressure, possibly caused by a worn pump, will show itself up with warning lights that take a long time to go off on start-up/raise-up and then "flicker off" gradually.
Brake pad wear lights can come on in wet weather.
The lights only come on at low revs, wether the car is moving or not. The car has been stood for a while (apart from me taking it down the road and back to make sure its still running!) and has had the problem a while. I was going to look into some of the problems today, however its blowing a gale outside and its raining, so il have a look when it all stops. Thanks for the advice everyone
In addition to this: i moved the car today round off our field and onto the driveway (i was gonna do the welding, but too windy) and i didnt get the abs light, i didnt get lhm light, i only got water level and brake pad warning... after 2 mins the water one went off and just left me with brakes, which when reved, went off.... its confusing me something silly now (only difference with today is the fact the battery was flat when I went to start it, so was jump started)
In addition to this: i moved the car today round off our field and onto the driveway (i was gonna do the welding, but too windy) and i didnt get the abs light, i didnt get lhm light, i only got water level and brake pad warning... after 2 mins the water one went off and just left me with brakes, which when reved, went off.... its confusing me something silly now (only difference with today is the fact the battery was flat when I went to start it, so was jump started)
The water level warning light switching off after about 2 mins as the engine gets warm can be that the water level is just a bit below the right level. Id try to measure the level with dipstick or tape if no dipstick present in your rad, or Id just add some 0.5 l of distilled water or antifreeze. This was what I did several times and 0.5 l is just enough to get rid of the warning light (I do not have the dipstick in my rad and the steel tape is not always around).
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oilyspanner
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Well, I havent had time to look any further so far, may get a chance this week, although I have other problems at the moment... Someone rear ended my car today, on the face of it not too much damage... but when you look closely : Rear bumper cracked, tow bar bent, boot floor pan bent, boot lid cracked (and wont shut properly) and a light cluster is broken. Before I washed it all down, it didnt even look like there was any damage. Since the ZX is the car im using, im affraid its taking priority to have it fixed (hopefully at no cost to me and lost of cost to the t**t who did it - im glad his nissan terrano came off worse, its front ends a right mess). Il keep you posted when I get chance to roll round underneath the BX. Cheers for help so far... BTW - you may be right about the water level, it did seem a bit down
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">boot floor pan bent<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
If you can persuade his insurance to pay for repairing it, get the boot floor done professionally - probably the best bit of tinworm prevention you can do on a BX hatch. Isn't the Terrano one of those 4x4-ish things - you'd think they'd be tougher than a BX (but then looks do deceive).
If you can persuade his insurance to pay for repairing it, get the boot floor done professionally - probably the best bit of tinworm prevention you can do on a BX hatch. Isn't the Terrano one of those 4x4-ish things - you'd think they'd be tougher than a BX (but then looks do deceive).
Just to correct people, its my ZX ive had the accident in, the BX is off road due to no MoT, which when I get chance will get put back on the road.... Sorry for any confusion (although ive had a bang on the head... lol)
When im free again il carry on work on the BX (I was doing it this week, but ive got things like taking car to get estimates etc to do first, then im back at uni!) Il look over the BX at the weekend I think, and this time do the welding.
When im free again il carry on work on the BX (I was doing it this week, but ive got things like taking car to get estimates etc to do first, then im back at uni!) Il look over the BX at the weekend I think, and this time do the welding.
Well ive given up. Went underneath to weld inner wheel arches today, all went well. Jacked vehicle up to weld sub frame, and there was a pop and a hissing sound... not good me thinks. Put car back on floor again, not sure what had happened. After looking round to find its all looking ok, I jack it back up again, and support on 2 axel stands. Drip... Drip... Drip... Theres LHM p*ssing out all over the floor.. even better. So I investigated it, and found theres 2 pipes gone. Whilst I was down there, I also found that the bottom hose has a hole in it, and is weeping. So.. Ive given up. Cant be bothered anymore, not worth repairing.
If anyone located in north nottinghamshire would like a BX, with no brakes and no suspension (until the leak is fixed).. Its here, make me an offer and get it off my drive.
The car is a 1991 J registeresd BX 17TZD. Has done 180 odd thousand miles, starts ok. Its got 3 ok tyres and one like new. has a full set of ZX temptation wheel trims on it (must be worth a couple of quid!!!) err its got a spoiler front and back, err and electric windows all round that work (wow), an electric mirror (also working) and an elecric sun roof. Front fog lamps were broke, so I bought some replacements that dont fit (could be made to fit was my idea). Theres no raido in it as I removed it for security (since its been stood a while) and has since been lost (great security). Has working remote central locking. Needs a new iginition barrel, as this one is dicky, err.... and then I suppose if you are going to use it, it could do with an MoT...
Il put some photos up if anyone is interested.
Dont want much for it, just got to get it out of the way now.
(For those of you who are now complaining that this isnt in the "for sale and wanted" section, il put it there now.
My email is wilkobob(at)hotmail(dot)com, il reply ASAP. Car will probably need to be trailered away since its losing LHM all over the floor.
If you are interested, get me before Sunday morning, as if its still here im scrapping it. (may also be interested in breaking it for spares, but let me know sooner rather than later)
If anyone located in north nottinghamshire would like a BX, with no brakes and no suspension (until the leak is fixed).. Its here, make me an offer and get it off my drive.
The car is a 1991 J registeresd BX 17TZD. Has done 180 odd thousand miles, starts ok. Its got 3 ok tyres and one like new. has a full set of ZX temptation wheel trims on it (must be worth a couple of quid!!!) err its got a spoiler front and back, err and electric windows all round that work (wow), an electric mirror (also working) and an elecric sun roof. Front fog lamps were broke, so I bought some replacements that dont fit (could be made to fit was my idea). Theres no raido in it as I removed it for security (since its been stood a while) and has since been lost (great security). Has working remote central locking. Needs a new iginition barrel, as this one is dicky, err.... and then I suppose if you are going to use it, it could do with an MoT...
Il put some photos up if anyone is interested.
Dont want much for it, just got to get it out of the way now.
(For those of you who are now complaining that this isnt in the "for sale and wanted" section, il put it there now.
My email is wilkobob(at)hotmail(dot)com, il reply ASAP. Car will probably need to be trailered away since its losing LHM all over the floor.
If you are interested, get me before Sunday morning, as if its still here im scrapping it. (may also be interested in breaking it for spares, but let me know sooner rather than later)
For those of us dedicated/wedded to the BX who might be interested, could I just ask a couple of questions, wilkobob?
(1) When you say "inner wheelarches" are you talking front or back wheels? I suspect front.......if you did venture inside the rear wheel arches then the front-rear brake/suspension pipes would undoubtedly wilt under the heat of a welder.
(2) Is the lhm pissage (a hydropneumatic Citroen technical term) coming from metal pipes or from rubber ones, and from where? There's an outside chance that the rubber return pipes from the front struts could have failed under flexing caused by the front wheels dropping an unaccustomed distance, in which case I'd expect there to be plenty of lhm around the inside of the affected front wheel(s), which would have come out on dropping the car back down. This is a cheap repair, and pretty easy IF you remove the complete front strut to replace the double-headed return pipes (one each side).
(3) Bottom hose = radiator to waterpump hose?
Did you know Jon's on the lookout for a sound 1.7TD head as a mercy mission for a BX owner down under, where this engine is rarer then rocking-horse poo? If the head's unfried and not banana-shaped he may have a use for it, not that I'd like to speak on his behalf ........
(1) When you say "inner wheelarches" are you talking front or back wheels? I suspect front.......if you did venture inside the rear wheel arches then the front-rear brake/suspension pipes would undoubtedly wilt under the heat of a welder.
(2) Is the lhm pissage (a hydropneumatic Citroen technical term) coming from metal pipes or from rubber ones, and from where? There's an outside chance that the rubber return pipes from the front struts could have failed under flexing caused by the front wheels dropping an unaccustomed distance, in which case I'd expect there to be plenty of lhm around the inside of the affected front wheel(s), which would have come out on dropping the car back down. This is a cheap repair, and pretty easy IF you remove the complete front strut to replace the double-headed return pipes (one each side).
(3) Bottom hose = radiator to waterpump hose?
Did you know Jon's on the lookout for a sound 1.7TD head as a mercy mission for a BX owner down under, where this engine is rarer then rocking-horse poo? If the head's unfried and not banana-shaped he may have a use for it, not that I'd like to speak on his behalf ........
Inner wheel arches, I mean front, and its no where near the hydraullic pipework.
The "pissage" is from infront of the middle silencer (I think near the height corrector, although I might be wrong). Since the car went splat to the floor, and I have no means of getting it back in the air, I cant tell exactly where the fluid is leaking, but its bad, cuz it emptied the system in a matter of minutes.
And the bottom hose is the one you say, which I replaced last year. (probably my fault for not antifreezing it up enough)
As for the engine, it fires up first time, and does not burn much oil, and doesnt use water, so im assuming the head is fine.
Car is located in North Nottinghamshire. If interested email me wilkobob(at)hotmail(dot)com
Simon
The "pissage" is from infront of the middle silencer (I think near the height corrector, although I might be wrong). Since the car went splat to the floor, and I have no means of getting it back in the air, I cant tell exactly where the fluid is leaking, but its bad, cuz it emptied the system in a matter of minutes.
And the bottom hose is the one you say, which I replaced last year. (probably my fault for not antifreezing it up enough)
As for the engine, it fires up first time, and does not burn much oil, and doesnt use water, so im assuming the head is fine.
Car is located in North Nottinghamshire. If interested email me wilkobob(at)hotmail(dot)com
Simon
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DoubleChevron
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<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by wilkobob</i>
The lights only come on at low revs, wether the car is moving or not. The car has been stood for a while (apart from me taking it down the road and back to make sure its still running!) and has had the problem a while. I was going to look into some of the problems today, however its blowing a gale outside and its raining, so il have a look when it all stops. Thanks for the advice everyone
In addition to this: i moved the car today round off our field and onto the driveway (i was gonna do the welding, but too windy) and i didnt get the abs light, i didnt get lhm light, i only got water level and brake pad warning... after 2 mins the water one went off and just left me with brakes, which when reved, went off.... its confusing me something silly now (only difference with today is the fact the battery was flat when I went to start it, so was jump started)
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Hmm,
if your coolant light is going out after the engine has run for a couple of minutes, this just means you coolant level is slightly low. You see as coolant/water heats it also expands ... So raises the coolant level to the level where the warning light is turned off.
Brake pads ... Dumb question ... There not worn are they ?? Sometimes the pad can be slightly wider than the disk so it looks like the pad is brand new, however if you pull the pads out they are actually completely worn out, but have a 'lip' at the top of them.
LHM light ... Leave the car on low. does it flash now ?? (no ??)
--move the height lever to 'high'. Has the light started flashing as the car gains heigh ?? Yes ?? This means your LHM level is low.
You probably know this already but you check the LHM level with the car on 'high', if the indicator shows 'full'. Try tapping the indicator with your finger, it may suddenly drop showing you have nowhere near enough LHM in the reseviour.
good luck
Shane L.
The lights only come on at low revs, wether the car is moving or not. The car has been stood for a while (apart from me taking it down the road and back to make sure its still running!) and has had the problem a while. I was going to look into some of the problems today, however its blowing a gale outside and its raining, so il have a look when it all stops. Thanks for the advice everyone
In addition to this: i moved the car today round off our field and onto the driveway (i was gonna do the welding, but too windy) and i didnt get the abs light, i didnt get lhm light, i only got water level and brake pad warning... after 2 mins the water one went off and just left me with brakes, which when reved, went off.... its confusing me something silly now (only difference with today is the fact the battery was flat when I went to start it, so was jump started)
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Hmm,
if your coolant light is going out after the engine has run for a couple of minutes, this just means you coolant level is slightly low. You see as coolant/water heats it also expands ... So raises the coolant level to the level where the warning light is turned off.
Brake pads ... Dumb question ... There not worn are they ?? Sometimes the pad can be slightly wider than the disk so it looks like the pad is brand new, however if you pull the pads out they are actually completely worn out, but have a 'lip' at the top of them.
LHM light ... Leave the car on low. does it flash now ?? (no ??)
--move the height lever to 'high'. Has the light started flashing as the car gains heigh ?? Yes ?? This means your LHM level is low.
You probably know this already but you check the LHM level with the car on 'high', if the indicator shows 'full'. Try tapping the indicator with your finger, it may suddenly drop showing you have nowhere near enough LHM in the reseviour.
good luck
Shane L.