Xantia recommendations

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Lemming
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Xantia recommendations

Post by Lemming »

I currently run an old Mercedes and petrol costs are getting the best of me.
As such I am planning to sell this and get an old turbodiesel to run around in, and the xantia size wise seems perfect. Max budget is £2500, altho I have seen a great deal of cars for less on ebay/autotrader. What sort of price should I be paying for one in reasonable condition with 100k on the clock? Are they a good buy and what expenses should I expect to see at this level of mileage?
Any information would be useful.
Thanks for your time
Phil
silverback
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Post by silverback »

A sense of humour helps.
madasafish
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Post by madasafish »

Read:http://tinyurl.com/43rwg
As far as I see you have 2 choices: buy very cheaply (£750 max)and budget £1k for clutch, radiator, suspension work.. or look for a very good one FSH for £2k.
Imo the XUD 1.9 diesel is out of date, not very economical and prone to head gasket failure after 100k miles or neglect or both. Far better to get a HDI with 100k miles and FSH.. your budget will do well.
As far as expenses, read the above article: budget 5 new spheres every 3 years £180 fitted. New camblet every 70k (£15-£200) and depreciation such that car is valueless once you have bought it. So keep for 5 years at least.
ABove all do not buy a neglected one as they are a money pit or one needing a new clutch £250 or new tyres £50 each.
Let someone else spend the money and lose it all in depreciation.
Looking at Autotrader Xantias are virtually unsellable unless dirt cheap , very good (low mileage and FSH) or both.
After a Mecedes you will find the build and design quality poor. Rest assured: it is.
Don't buy any model pre 1997: Citroen launched it with numerous failings: locks, wiring, suspension, sunroof motors, remote locking etc which only were properly sorted with the 1997 facelift.
The ride is wonderful , the steering dead and HDI does 50mpg.
The petrol cars are even worse for depreciation than the diesels . But if you can afford it a Mark2 V6 petrol would be nice but running costs are high.
Citroen dealers are best trusted with meccano sets not Xantias imo: drinking sessions in breweries come to mind...
DoubleChevron
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Post by DoubleChevron »

What part of the Xantia has poor build quality ??
From what I can see they are exceptionally well put together.
I've never had a problem with running costs on **any** citroen. Get one with Hydractive or activa suspension, the suspension works **very** well.
Every 3years you need new spheres?? You must be in a part of the world where spheres die as a past time. We have owned Citroens for nearly 20years, I have DS's, CX's, BX's, GS's and Xantias. I've probably purchased 2 new spheres in all of those years. You simply get the spheres regassed about every 5years. It costs about 7quid a sphere to regass them out here, or if you have a friend with a regassing rig, a few beers and a few hours chatting [:D]
Just change the cambelt and fluids regually and the rest will take care of itself [:)]
seeya,
Shane L.
David W
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Post by David W »

Maaf,
Thanks for linking to my (sadly neglected) site and reminding me to update that Xantia buying guide!!
There is nothing crucial to mention now that is "wrong" about the guide (written a few years ago) apart from the fact that experience has made me far happier to have ABS as my only faults with this system have been front sensors (apart from a self-inflicted ECU destruction!).
Sorry I have to take issue with several of your points.
The 1.9TD XUD engine is an absolute classic and still stands up besides other make diesels as one that was right first time. It is the ultimate in maintainable engines, particularly an earlier one with absolutely no ECU involved in its running. They are not prone to head gasket failure at 100K...it is the owners that have them at 100K who are prone to minimal maintenance and missing the early signs of coolant problems. Failing rads, heater matrix's, not bleeding after coolant loss/change, leaking water pumps, failed fan switches and stuck thermmostats. In fact all the things that will give any modern diesel grief.
The HDi engine is more powerful and economical but also noisier to some ears, also more complex in several maintenance areas. Only now are we starting to see some real problem issues with the electronics on some HDi's that are sending them into limp-home mode with seemingly no-one able to sort them easily.
As to the depreciation issue...well bought sensibly they hardly depreciate in actual terms because they should be so cheap in the first place. My own 1993 model has low miles and the most amazing history but would struggle to fetch £750 on the open market.
They do sell from Autotrader...at the right (low ) price so as a buyer you have a huge choice at any particular budget.
I would agree never to buy one without full history from a caring private owner, the neglected ones will bite you but that's not the fault of the car.
It is likely Phil will be looking at a post 1997 with his budget but in fact there is no overall difference with the issues on older vs later cars...it's just that the older cars are.... well...older!
The most important thing is to get a car at the right point in its maintenance cycle. To take the example of my own Sept'93 car it has a new clutch, driveshaft gaiters, radiator, front ABS sensors, all spheres, tyres, complete exhaust, battery, droplinks, rear discs/pads plus caliper corrosion removed... and so on. It would make a far better buy than a 1998 car at 70K just about to need all these things in the next year or two.
The ride is superb on one with good spheres, and yes the steering is a bit dead...folks do report 50mpg from the HDi wheresas I would say the 1.9XUD is nearer 45mpg.
Also true petrols are unloved on the used market.
Citroen dealers are expensive and not appropriate for any Xantia now they are a cheap car.
But I have to save the most important point to last....you said...
<<After a Mecedes you will find the build and design quality poor. Rest assured: it is.>>
Not at all, I'll explain.
I look after a couple of 1980/90s Mercedes, a 200 series and a 190E. Both are superb low mileage examples that I've known for years. The 190E is a 1.8 petrol 5sp manual and makes a very good comparison for my own Xantia because when I bought my Xantia 4.5yrs ago for the same money (just under £3K) I could have bought this 1991 190E as my Dad was selling it.
But when I considered it the Xantia diesel would do an extra 15mpg, it had the flexability of the hatchback and folding seats, the ride was far better, there was more interior room for passengers, it was a more refined cruiser, its FWD handling was more predictable in bad weather, it had more equipment...in all a far better *design* of car for a family (my use).
As to quality the Mercedes has just a couple of places starting to rust on the paintwork and underneath is has lots of unsightly superficial seam corrosion now. The Xantia has zero rust on the bodywork and is 100% free from even surface rust underneath. The Xantia engine (at near identical mileages just over 120K) actually looks as if it will outlast the Mercedes one, accepting one is diesel and the other petrol.
Don't get me wrong I like Mercedes, they feel to be built like tanks and I probably will own one sometime in the future...it's just I think in this very fair comparison of two vehicles that were the same value some 5yrs ago it is far from chalk and cheese when you get down to which is the most useable vehicle.
Sorry if this is a bit rant-ish but I look after a good few Xantias as well as other makes and have never ever seen them as bad quality.
PS: I'll update that buying guide tonight, thanks for reminding me!!
David
madasafish
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Post by madasafish »

David
My comments about quality relate more to electrics/electronics rather than body quality (which is good - I did not mention rust becuase it is largely not an issue:-)
David W
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Post by David W »

Maaf,
Fair enough, I wasn't ranting at you...more pro-Xantia!
To be fair in what I said above of course when the Mercedes sold this year (now on 3rd owner in my care) it fetched twice what my Xantia was worth at the time. It hasn't needed a new clutch or radiator but it has been far from fault free with door lock , clutch slave, water ingress, starting and heater problems.
Perhaps one really telling thing is that the new owner of the 190E liked it so much for *his* use (no family) in the first month he ran it he paid £1500 for a rather nice LPG conversion.
If Phil wants an example of the sort of Xantia he can expect for his money here is one...
It's not for sale now but my Dad runs a 1999 facelift 1.9TD hatch in smart silver with air-con. It was one company owned before him with a full history and has covered a highish (for age but otherwise fine) 80K+. It is mint and runs perfectly. In the last year he's had all spheres, tyres, radiator, cambelt and fluid changes. It's clutch is stiffening up and I would expect to replace that in the next year.
It looks a really attractive yet I would expect it to sell for under £2000 when he changes it in the next 6mths (likely), and if the eventual buyer is very lucky he will have put the clutch in before then. That car has years of reliable life left in it.
David
David W
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Post by David W »

I've updated that Xantia TD buyers guide. OK so it's biased towards the model I like best but let me know if you see any actual errors or glaring ommissions.
http://www.woollard.com.btinternet.co.u ... Buying.htm
David
madasafish
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Post by madasafish »

David
On first read (hi speed) it looks fine...
andycarter
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Post by andycarter »

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by DoubleChevron</i>

What part of the Xantia has poor build quality ??
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Minor, trivial little things like the driver's door hinges that rip their welds off occasionally[:(]
Grumble...
kafkaian
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Post by kafkaian »

To be fair, the Xantia body is easy dent. I've got two rear arch indentations from carparking felons (grrrrr) who have spoiled what is otherwise still a very nice car. However, this is probably a problem with most modern cars given designers' pressure for weight considerations etc etc. SO I would say that the Xantia is as strong or as flimsy as any other car in its class (give ot take a few exceptions), thus, I wouldn't say that general build quality is anything to worry about in a Xantia. For the money you do indeed get an exceptionally comfortable car. I only wish I'd got a diesel when I bought mine 'cause the 16V petrol is not the most frugal and certainly can suffer from flat spots.
The one complaint I do have of the Xantia is the fascia which I think is unreasonable when it comes to servicing - allied to that a pathetically designed fab blower circuit (GRRrrrrrr)
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