Sinker xantia scrap or keep, bosch fuel pump issues...

[PhilGreaves]

thanks for that malcolm..ouch..at the price though. Still half and half about whether or not we're keeping the damn thing. So cant really justify that sort of money right now....unless we do keep the infernal thing...but yes if we break it you get dibs on the aforementioned hydraulic parts

How do you always get the parts and prices so quick? I used to be registered on citroens own part network thingy, but i lost the website address. Shame really, as i guess my garage is still registered. I got given it by my local dealer- he got sick of me asking "i dont suppose that such and such is stil available?"...

Anyway Graham has found his, he thinks its working- is dry anyway. Didnt mention cost but will post it to me. Hang on i said i cant fit it myself...so he's asking a mutual local friend for help. Cant see the guy going for it but hey ho he owes me a favour as i still havent sat in his belphegor..

b.t.w breifly on the xantia replcement front:
-Kias (C'eed, Rio, Venga) great engines, crap seats, average to bad rides.
-C3 picasso...judder judder...questionable quality on VTR+ trim
-Xsara picasso....surprisingly good
- Ford C max 2008 Surprising as usually i find cars wallowy or juddery, yet this juddered over bumps and wallowed over undulations. God knows how they managed it- mustve been all that US Gov funding?
-Audi A3 130 TDi Sport 2002 .boring...shifts..but boring..and the worst traction control ever
-Renualt modus..brilliant..but wierd driving position
-Citroen C4 (new shape)...my favourite so far...
-Citroen C3..described as adequate..i dont like the clutch

And thats all of the xantia replacements to date so far..as you can see by the above verdicts its not really a surprise that we've still got the xantia! Mind havent been in a 'electric hydraulic cdc' vauxhall yet. All of the above lack the ride and the road holding of the xantia so bit of a quadry really.

thanks
Phil
p.s jim tee hee, once again mechanic disagrrees with you; rekons you'll never really be able to get the oil off the old one well enough to glue it. Mind i guess i can try after ive got it off and cleaned it. What would you use to clean it

http://8gt.ru/citroen/xantia/html/3_3_18.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; rather interesting site b.t.w peeps.....

[citronut]

yes its still available just a new homepage

http://service.citroen.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

hover over the bottom right were its say Français (France) and a pop up box will appear, select country you wish to use,
then enter your login details top left click connection, then hover over free service's and click the first option

[citronut]

p.s jim tee hee, once again mechanic disagrrees with you; rekons you'll never really be able to get the oil off the old one well enough to glue it. Mind i guess i can try after ive got it off and cleaned it. What would you use to clean it

i would blast it with carb cleaner then blow with compressed air,

i would also seek a new mechanic if he cant work that one out for him self

[Xaccers]

I successfully glued cassy's without a problem

[PhilGreaves]

i would also seek a new mechanic if he cant work that one out for him self

when are you opening your northern branch malcolm? To be fair my dads just said he's struggled to glue models together with the stuff so i can see why its a pain, not to mention its still in situ..and covered in diesel..oil...

Dont have carb cleaner..im thinking lighter fluid as it works on plastic models...

Thanks for the citroen garage link...think my accounts still intact too. I originally got given the link by my friend at the local dealer as he got sick of me asking what parts were available.

anyway the 'subcontractor' is busy...apparently organising some big event..again....and i havent got the part yet. So looks like glueing in situ it is....not ideal. Before anyone points it out no im not taking apart the last functioning/mot'd car in the household...Besides i have a 'cunning plan' .....should be interesting... Just hoping the thing survives until we find a replacement car, 'we've' settled on the picasso now....(oi quit laughing ). Typical really id found the prefect one and it got dismissed and now it turns out we really shouldve bought it.

Reminds me talking of XMs i found that brochure for you jim...and the spare (£5 any takers?! Delivery to rallys next year...) and did anybody spot the rarest xm ever at the icccr? Cant remember what it as called*...Its in my photo album...

Thanks (update soon)

Phil
*multimedia....(knew id remember)
P.S new golf..pants...polos not bad though...

[PhilGreaves]

right think i got it fixed....all on my own last saturday- friend busy organising stuff and mechanics gone to bordeaux...so no spare. So far its working fine. But i still want to get it checked just to make sure.

If you have the same problem then heres an idiot's guide to fixing it without removing the part.

Anyway to fix the filter house seal leak thingy, you will need;
-An old sock (with no holes in the toes)
-lighter fluid
-evo stick Super Fix Versatile Hit tech putty- in six pieces (available from homebase under 'Glues')
-lighter fluid (can form, from supermarkets, newsagents etc)
-Possibly someone left handed

Right then clearly make sure you've got the above before you begin work and remember the car will be unroadworthy for a while so make sure its parked in such a way as will require no movement during the work/drying time.

First carefully move the fuel pipe slightly to the left away from the filter housing making sure it doesn't scrape on anything (the pipe may pop out of the plastic clip dont worry about that).

Second put the sock on your hand (left works best). After completing the obligatory sock puppet routine ( what av we got here then a leak, dr sock will soon have you fixed etc), use the sock to clear deisel and oil from both the seal area (i.e within the hole around the white circular thing) and around the filter housing itself- at least the part facing the engine block, especially the nozzle. Repeat this step with a clean bit of sock and some lighter fluid. Repeat this step again with a clean bit of sock- lighter fluid may itself leave a thin film of oil. The area should now be totally clean which of course it needs to be to allow the putty to stick and create an air tight seal.

Third take a piece of putty out of the packet and begin to knead it to mix the hardener in. Bear in mind you ideally need it to retain a roughly circular shape bigger than the appature as ideally you need a flange to fix to the housing side wall. Fit putty by applying pressure to the centre of the putty centre to fix it to the white plastic of the thermostat heater thingy. Then of course make it air tight by crimping it down to the outside of the filter housing wall itself. i'll try to uplaod a photo later.

Four ignore the 10 minute claims. Firstly you are out doors in colder temperatures and it will be under pressure. And do you really want to risk it? Hour later itll be dry. Ideally at this point you should pime the system again as theyll still be some air left in (between your new putty seal and the old seal). Then itll start fine. Alternatively if you havent considered ( ) the air still trapped in the system dont worry about it as old xud will take care of that..within no time your xantia will be starting again just like it did when it had 33k on the clock.

Cost £5.00 for the putty and £1 ommat for lighter fluid if you have none in so total cost <£7.
Time: <10 mins + drying time.

Next week how to fix hydraulics with a hammer and some bluetack (joke... we're out of blue tack.. )

Though i may have to do something regarding the inner wings....

thanks
Phil (the author of all idiot guides from now on!)

[CitroJim]

Excellent work Phil

Good tip about using lighter fluid - it's an excellent solvent and cleaner...

I'm looking forward to your next guide

[PhilGreaves]

Excellent work Phil

Good tip about using lighter fluid - it's an excellent solvent and cleaner...

I'm looking forward to your next guide

last one guide from me im afraid. Cars dead

Went in for a service (to Ray Calvert Bradford), although it has been knocking. I suspected cv joints but far far worse...

Full list of items:
-O/S/F bottom ball joint
-n/s/f Bottom ball joint
-Pressure regulator Valve
-N/S/Inner sill (apparently paper thin on the join)
-Rear height corrector
-Rear suspension pipe
-n/s/r suspension pipe
-steering wheel rack leak/wear
-Rear exhaust box has two holes in
-N/s wish bone rear bush (?hard to read handwriting)
-o/s hand brake cable
-n/s/f flexy insecure
-starter motor faulty (no doubt due to that fuel air ingression)
-Wiper blades (Ray is rather thorough..)

Rather hilariously this means its been condemed by three different mechanics in 5 years...a record?

As much as i hate myself for scrapping it..it really is out of my hands. Im still unemployed (no fault of my own either!!) and even my dads having some national assesment for work/benefits looked into which has made the timing of the xantia all the worse. If it had just been the ball joints and wishbones no probs but all that hydraulic stuff and the bill.....<whistles>...

We arent going to scrap it just yet has tax so mum want to hold off to x rally: maybe we'll make it?! or maybe whetherby as its closer!

sigh i always thoguht that sinkers were indestructable. All of us (except dad) are a bit upset about it really. I know it may seem silly to some but we've had that car since 1997/33k..its now 2013 with 186k.Its seen alot too, the old gent who owned it for the first three years has died i think, and the garage where we bought it from closed a few years ago, so it outlived that too. And theres a note from John Greaves* who has also died (hmm people do seem to die after coming into contact with it!!!). . At least i got it to the icccr for 20 years of the xantia : free mystery prize for those that know why it was 20 years of the xantia last year in 2012 rather than this year- as stated in this months xantia column (rough location required too, to prevent wiki from being used!!)

Guess i'll have to phone nigel to ask about removing certain parts (badges grill..dashboard so i could buy a french one and convert to RHD?! lol)

I'll put up some photos especially of my repair for future reference. Yes it does still start! LOL..but you cant use epoxy on the new faults!

Sorry its not better news guys.. long live the sinker xantia (if you have one- are there any more left??!). Still maintain they were the best...and i'll let you know the funeral arrangements in due course...

If i may some things ive learned with the xantia sinker:
-the abs game is fun (trying to knock the abs light off by going over bumps at certain angles/speeds)
-There never is water in the fuel..although the xantia always tell you there is
- Airbags arent required (not where the steering wheel column goes in a xantia anyway!! see ncap video)
-The radiator isnt necessary as its actually citroens last aircooled car
-"Hydraulics are complicated, the pumps go and cost the earth to repalce" well pump still working fine actually and apart from the above leaks and a few brake pipes we've never had any problems.
-spheres last forever as theres no stupid vauxhall inspired antisink
-no car is as quiet, comftable, smooth riding or has the same roadholding (though i suppose its the same for all xantias). Trust me on this i've testdriven a lot of cars recently! Anybody saying otherwise has a screw loose! lol
-with no cat or electrics the xantia is fast at overtaking with an instant throw back response and you cant tell the difference between 90mph or 70mph...well it was in Germany...
-nothings better having passed your test in a renault clio dci70 than driving a 1.9TD engine well exept making range rovers pull over (arrghh young kid in old battered car!!) Actually stictly speaking the xantia was the first car i ever drove. Anyway your all bored and i should make that phonecall...

thanks

Phil
P.S sorry for the private message this morning jim- may not have sent properly if it did disregard as obviously no need for advice now. As car caput....as you can probably guess jim i want to know if bosch/the Germans made those wishbones!!

*no relation...sorry long running joke between me and john. Funny thing is about john, i know exactly what he'd say about the xantia now: "wouldnt happen on a bx..great cars them better than the replacement. Have you considered buying one??." But if you took a c5.."wouldnt happen on a xantia great cars..etc.

[CitroJim]

Oh that's a shame Phil but that is quite a considerable list to consider. Mind you, taken bit by bit it's not too bad at all really. Bar the welding there's nothing that you can't do in slow and gentle stages and most of what you need can be got second-hand. I'll bet Paul (Citroenxm) can supply almost all you need at a low cost.

Pleiades can do the pipes and they won't be too bad to do..

That list just looks bad when looked as a complete list... It's a bit like eating an elephant. Easy if you do it in small chunks...

Sorry to hear the unemployment continues

Hope your search for a replacement brings forth results and that it's not quite the end for your Xantia Still 20 years of faithful service is not bad is it? How many of the Xantia's contemporaries do you still see running around? When was the last time you saw a Fraud Sierra or a Vauxhall Chavalier for instance?

[citronut]

Phill are you sure all of that list is actually required, sound to me they were trying to take your money, or didn't want to work on the car and thought if they give you a huge list requiring attention you wouldn't bother,

what is actually wrong with the rear height corrector and regulator,
most of that list is not difficult to sort

[citroenxm]

Ive a GENUINE white sinker sitting around on an L plate waiting for me to decide what to do with it...

Its generally OK, needs a bit of recomissioning... but the bad bit is the rear NEAR side panel as a serious rot issue along the crease line..

But 3 owners from new, recent spheres all round... NO advisoiries on the last MOT last year.. Needs attention to the Pressure regulator/FDV (It all works, but has an over frequent tick/click when pumping up.. Like a flat accumilator but faster) but it could be a flat accumilator..

The other issue is a fuel drainage problem!

One day.... one day. Putting an N reg TD SX in for mot this/next week.. see what comes back on that. Hopefully nothing or some advisories with any luck.

[Northern_Mike]

Excellent work Phil

Good tip about using lighter fluid - it's an excellent solvent and cleaner...

I'm looking forward to your next guide

last one guide from me im afraid. Cars dead

Went in for a service (to Ray Calvert Bradford), although it has been knocking. I suspected cv joints but far far worse...

Full list of items:
-O/S/F bottom ball joint
-n/s/f Bottom ball joint
-Pressure regulator Valve
-N/S/Inner sill (apparently paper thin on the join)
-Rear height corrector
-Rear suspension pipe
-n/s/r suspension pipe
-steering wheel rack leak/wear
-Rear exhaust box has two holes in
-N/s wish bone rear bush (?hard to read handwriting)
-o/s hand brake cable
-n/s/f flexy insecure
-starter motor faulty (no doubt due to that fuel air ingression)
-Wiper blades (Ray is rather thorough..)

Rather hilariously this means its been condemed by three different mechanics in 5 years...a record? .

Ah, but has it ever been condemned by the MOT man. Take it to an MOT man who doesn't do repairs and have it tested. If it's got problems such as those above, he'll pick them up.

I'd bet my Subaru that half of them aren't on there. Sounds like a bit of a "let's make some money" list to be honest.

That said, most of those jobs you can do yourself and learn a bit. I reckon not much more than £100 worth of parts and some elbow grease would have it up and running again. Unless the height corrector is actually leaking, I believe it can just be cleaned and lubed, and that will be done. The most expensive bit is likely to be the rear box, but you can pick one up for £30 or so and self-fit. Not sure how much Pleiades would make the pipes up for, but a couple of days work will have all that done for not a lot.

Or, you could scrap it - my bro used rewardrecycling and got £192 for one recently, add that £100 or so to it and buy another slightly later TD.. but you won't know it's faults and it won't have the sentimental value.

[PhilGreaves]

Answering in order....

Ahh yes jim it may not be too bad but the parents are dead set against it. And wont damn well listen as anyone who's met them will tell you. lol got told off by nigel wild yesterday for it not being serviced..because they wouldnt listen. Although it had a new clutch feul pump etc fitted just prior to the icccr its had nothing since or in the prior 12 months to that date.So really...what do we expect?!

Ahh yes appyling for more stuff today so you never know. Did get a temp job over xmas which was nice. Last time i saw a mundaneo it was petrol and m reg so close and the entire rear quarter was riddled with rust as were the doors and weld joins on the sills. The xantia is only going where it got hit or where the paints come off. Havent seen a chavalier for years actually...though there is another sinker xantia around here..

Hello malcolm..The ball joints and wishbones are required immdeiately. They wouldnt accept any money for checking the car over. They said they would do the work if we really wanted it to but id have to persuade ray first as in his opinion it wasnt worth doing. So bearing that in mind and ive seen no bad reports of ray/the garage i dont see why i shouldnt believe him.

Well citronut a fair question. The rear suspension pipes are leaking (havent seen it myself but ive got no ramp). The height corrector has been 'sticky' on start up for three years now..never stuck though. Pressure regualtor/accumulator has now been dripping for three winters. Cant see the steering rack fault however last few months a hissing sound can be heard when you go apst a 1/4 turn. Could this be just the ram then?

If its not that difficult to sort do you want me to drive down to you then malcolm ?! (your somewhere down south..right??!) let you have a go with it? Actually it is still insured and i have breakdown.....nothing better to do some would say...

Paul are you trying to sell me another xantia?! id love one but as you learned from the icccr in your 'brief' conversation my mum wants something smaller. Like Jim said parts could be useful.

Hi 'northern mike' (how northern are you?!).. no but i think ray does mots. I know that last year Graham morton wasnt happy about moting it again last year just prior to the icccr as he thought we should get rid...but i insisted on taking it to the icccr. No one was intersted in it anyway...Though i take your point no advisories last time means either a 'slack' mot or some very fast failures.

erm i have no knowledge whatsoever or equipment...or space its under the carport at the moment. Yes you are right about height correctors.

Thats one of the key (logical reasons) besides all the sentimental stuff as soon as i heard the hiss for example on the steering i thought "never done that before..". Not sure id touch another unless it was a club/forum member. (no offence)

So i dont know what to do. Was going to take it to Graham Mortons but he's still away and he didnt like the xantia anyway, and its started snowing which means the road to his garage will be closed again...which was the reason for going to Ray's in the first place!

Just trying to think now should i scrap it. Ask a friend for a favour (he could check it out..)

-If the entire steering rack needs repalcing is there any point in doing the suspension work? I mean would you have to remove that to remove the steering rack.

Just sort of thinking then it would be (reasonably) mobile and i could go to the xrally and maybe some of you could look it over? Or impose even further and drive somewhere else to get one of you to look over? Or drive to malcolms Then at least id feel like we've done all we can. Or is that just a waste of more money?!

Had a look over myself agree with most of it except cant really see the rust (does say inner wing) so maybe i need a ramp? Again get my friend to look it over...

If in worst case scenario all the faults are accurate..and istarted to do it myself (incluing replacing some pipes) is there sufficent info on here to guide me? including what tools i need? (im assuming this is what we are talking about " onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)

Worst thing is my father is practically jumping for joy at his german H reg Audi being the last one standing.....smug g...

thanks
Phil
P.S look on he bright side its a good day (for the xantia) to die

[PhilGreaves]

Hi guys

Well ive been busy recently clearing the snow and prior to that helping my mum with car buying. (shes now bought a c3 HDi1.6 Exclusive 09) for a modern car (ncap,cheap tax disc etc) its very good...as a car generally....

Anyway the xantia is still here. I was told to phone the scrap man and i simply replied "you broke it. im not scrapping it"....and its still here. So with some better weather i thought i should actually look at the hydraulics/underneath.

The underneath isnt half as bad as i expected. No rust/rot mainly restricted to rear door jamb/quarter panels i.e the upper body. Underneath only one of the jacking points is showing problems. Light surface corrosion on the subframe/front suspension and rather heavier corrosion on the rear arms. Both are solid however. Im hoping to 'create' a pit to help me inspect the underneath a bit more. Also the plastic trim in the wheel arches etc is being held on with plastic ties etc...

Now as some of you may remember this is a sinker xantia L reg/1994. So it should have an FDV?

-i cant really see the FDV and i cant make heads or tails from the pump over the number/type of pipe weather its meant to have one??
-The pressure regulator seems to be leaking from directly underneath. I think as i havent been able to look whilst runing. also the LHM thats leaking out appears to be almost fresh/new rather than old lhm from bottom of the tank/the system.anyway ive taken some photos.

Ive circled something on the photo as im not sure its correct. The arrow indicates where i think the leak is coming from...


The rest of the photos (inc showing the pump pipes are here: ) http://s738.photobucket.com/user/Citroe ... 20problems" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
-also on the steering issue. At the mo i cant see anything wrong with the steering but i do remember recently it making a funny hissing noise if i went over a quarter turn on the steering? Coincidence or noteworthy as its never done it before. Im unable to find out from either manuals information about the ram on the steering rack? (could this be the cause of the funny noise and possibly small leak?). Is there a link/thread on here??


Anyway heres some photos on the links always grateful for any comments. At the mo ill have to be quick as internets playing up.

Should be at the national in the C3.

thanks
Phil
p.S despite being standing through snow at ice for two months the xantia started first time..tee hee..look on my dads face..lol

[citronut]

Phill
the FDV on a sinker XANT is exactly the same place as on a BX, immediately above the regulator,