Cooling fans not working

MikeT · Unread post by **MikeT** » 15 Jan 2009, 13:22

Hi Jim,

EDITED: RP:07859 CJ 1 0018 XUD9TE 16th May 1998

I do know it's had a new radiator in the past (which is date stamped about '04 I think) so some things around the area would have been disturbed/disconnected and judging from the amount of fasteners and bits "left off" from previous jobs indicates at least one careless mechanic has been here before me

so I'm wondering what's behind the relay sockets?

Thanks in advance for the diags.

addo · Unread post by **addo** » 15 Jan 2009, 21:56

OK, everybody order spare keys for Mike's car!

I shouldn't have read this topic the other night. No prizes for guessing what's now eventuated...

Although I will try the Aussie fix of rebrushing the fans first.

Cheers, Adam.

MikeT · Unread post by **MikeT** » 16 Jan 2009, 09:32

addo · Unread post by **addo** » 16 Jan 2009, 10:43

I'll throw in my two bob's worth of fan issues - warning, amateur diagnosis!

A squealy O/S fan eventually refused to operate, causing a dead short that cooked its relay (in my case, the upper right of the trio, with green socket). Total failure was evidenced by the "pulsing" of one fan at high speed, above normal temperature operation (up to 100°) and a motor stumble every time it tried to operate the dead fan - lights dimmed and the idle faltered for a second.

Looking back, I believe the first failure symptoms (other than a squeal) occurred a few weeks back. The car occasionally stumbled slightly when cruising at small throttle openings - I took it as the coil packs beginning to break down.

Fix for the time being, was to swap in a used fan motor (X1, but they fit the same) and a replacement relay with 30A piggyback fuse built in. I cleaned the relay socket's blackened terminal with W&D paper folded into a stiff "stick". Blew about a kilogram of dead locusts out the radiator/condensor area, too!

In a nutshell, my fix:
1. Swap dead motor out
2. Clean relay socket
3. Fit new relay with inbuilt fuse

Out of curiosity, how dear are the new fan motors in the UK?

Regards, Adam

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 16 Jan 2009, 11:40

MikeT wrote:BUMP

OUCH

MikeT · Unread post by **MikeT** » 17 Jan 2009, 17:39

citrojim wrote:
MikeT wrote:BUMP
OUCH

You know, don't you Jim.

Unread post by **myglaren** » 17 Jan 2009, 17:53

addo wrote:I'll throw in my two bob's worth of fan issues - warning, amateur diagnosis!

A squealy O/S fan eventually refused to operate, causing a dead short that cooked its relay (in my case, the upper right of the trio, with green socket). Total failure was evidenced by the "pulsing" of one fan at high speed, above normal temperature operation (up to 100°) and a motor stumble every time it tried to operate the dead fan - lights dimmed and the idle faltered for a second.

Looking back, I believe the first failure symptoms (other than a squeal) occurred a few weeks back. The car occasionally stumbled slightly when cruising at small throttle openings - I took it as the coil packs beginning to break down.

Fix for the time being, was to swap in a used fan motor (X1, but they fit the same) and a replacement relay with 30A piggyback fuse built in. I cleaned the relay socket's blackened terminal with W&D paper folded into a stiff "stick". Blew about a kilogram of dead locusts out the radiator/condensor area, too!

In a nutshell, my fix:
1. Swap dead motor out
2. Clean relay socket
3. Fit new relay with inbuilt fuse

Out of curiosity, how dear are the new fan motors in the UK?

Regards, Adam

Couldn't find a motor on its own but the fan assemblies are around £100

addo · Unread post by **addo** » 17 Jan 2009, 22:07

Cool! (Sorry, couldn't help myself...

)

Here the fan assembly (motor and blade) retails around $700 ex-dealer. At one quarter that, I can see why you'd fit a new one rather than rebuild!

The motor itself bears the brand "ECM" and a designation B9. I haven't yet found any description or manufacturer links, but my French is well below average for a car forum like this.

Regards, Adam.

MikeT · Unread post by **MikeT** » 18 Jan 2009, 14:49

citrojim wrote:
MikeT wrote: considering we're not 100% sure the given wiring diagrams are that of my car?
Mike, what's the RP number of your car? With that I can then post up the right applicable diagrams.

RP:07859 CJ 1 0018

What's the best way to find the missing feed if I don't know where the wires originate from?

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 18 Jan 2009, 15:29

MikeT wrote: What's the best way to find the missing feed if I don't know where the wires originate from?

Hi Mike,

The diagrams I posted on page one of this thread are the correct ones for your car according to the RP number. Have a look at the harness and location diagrams. The harness diagram will tell you which harness carries which wires and the location diagram will tell you physically where they are on the car.

addo · Unread post by **addo** » 18 Jan 2009, 21:46

I downloaded those diagrams and found them immensely useful. It's a nice simple arrangement (if one assumes the Bitron unit to be 100% functional).

One thing I wondered about for the Bitron. Does the output which triggers the crossover and secondary relays, and also feeds the diagnostic port, have a signal waveform superimposed on it - or does the diagnostic unit simply look for 12V at that pin?

Thanks, Adam.

MikeT · Unread post by **MikeT** » 19 Jan 2009, 10:21

citrojim wrote:The diagrams I posted on page one of this thread are the correct ones for your car according to the RP number. Have a look at the harness and location diagrams. The harness diagram will tell you which harness carries which wires and the location diagram will tell you physically where they are on the car.

Okay, thanks for confirming that Jim.
I can't seem to print the pics properly, getting just a portion of one page per sheet of A4 and selecting the "4 per page" print setting doesn't sort it either. I have to work off my screen for now.

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 19 Jan 2009, 10:40

MikeT wrote: I can't seem to print the pics properly, getting just a portion of one page per sheet of A4 and selecting the "4 per page" print setting doesn't sort it either. I have to work off my screen for now.

Save them as jpegs Mike and use the Windows built in picture viewer to view and print them. It will resize them for printing and offer you several options. Beware one of the full-page print options will crop the edges

If you try to print direct from your browser, they will end up printing wrongly as they're big to start with...

addo · Unread post by **addo** » 19 Jan 2009, 11:20

Mike, If you do click on the link to get the picture showing - assuming Windows XP - select Print Preview from the lefthand dropdown menu (headed File).

The image will appear on your screen - there's a little picture of a cog in the upper screen menu pictures which is for page setup; in that you can nominate the paper size (A4 works for me) and adjust the margins if required (not needed here).

On the right hand side is an options box with your chosen scaling - select "Shrink to Fit". Each time you modify stuff, the Print Preview should change slightly. Once you see it all as per the actual screen view, select the Print icon (lefthandmost one), and progress to printing.

Regards, Adam.

MikeT · Unread post by **MikeT** » 19 Jan 2009, 12:13

Ideally, with my poor eyesight

, I wanted to print them full size so they scaled across several sheets so resisted the shrink to fit option but now I've tried it, it still didn't print completely. However, downloading them and printing via XP Picture Viewer Print Wizard worked ok, thanks.