1.9td questions

[citroenxm]

Those turbos feature whats called an "internal" wastegate. The actuator arm is inside the unit. Its still pressure sensor controlled.. you can see the pipe just under it.. waste gate opening - or closing - can still be adjusted by the nut and allen head screw on the end.. in picture above to the left.

Ive had both units on a the viriety of xantias ive had and one was on a 1995 M reg xantia.. both units common as each other but both mate to the exhaust manifold identically so both units are interchangeable. . By both I mean these tripple K units a d the garret t2 (s I think were used)

[citroenxm]

Jim..

these manifolds and egr setups were fitted from around 1997 end of s1 xantias to end of xud life..

[CitroJim]

Jim..

these manifolds and egr setups were fitted from around 1997 end of s1 xantias to end of xud life..

Thanks Paul, it's just the manifold looked somehow different to how I remember them...

But then again it's been a long time since I've seen one now....

[citroenxm]

You know what.. ive just looked at the manifold piccie again.. I notice the turbo outlet is facing downwards.. meaning the turbo compressor house is roatated compared to the xantia. Where xantia outputs are upwards.. this one appears to have the intercooler pipe going under the engine like hdi 110s setup... interesting!!.

However. The turbo and manifolds were still also fittex to xantias but the turbo to Intercooler pipe on xantias as we know was a plastic one and stupidly they removed the interconnecting pipe and made it one pice and it was BOLTED to the turbo.. making pipe removal incredibly hard .. anyway.. im brabbleing on now thats a different story and topic to this...

[xsaras4ever]

Hello all.

Yep , done some research too and it was fitted to Xantias and Peugeot 306.

Probably the reason it looks different is because the Boxer van has its exhaust on the opposite side to what the cars have, so you have turbo on the left and exhaust pipe on the right.

Will remove the EGR to see if its stuck, though we have seen other pictures of these EGR valves and none of them show a spring.

The turbo has no play in the rotor if you wiggle it by hand, and a little if you gently wiggle with a pliers.

Any ideas on how to check (or remove) that wastegate setup to see if it functions ?

Have any of you rebuilt a turbo with one of those £40 kits from eBay ?

BTW: we have a 1.8i 16v petrol engine from a ZX that we are breaking.

If any of you want some parts, you can have them free if you are down our way, or for the cost of postage.
It blew a head gasket, but still started and ran ok, but pumped water out of the rad.

Cheers to all.

[xsaras4ever]

Just took off the EGR - its not stuck !!!

[xsaras4ever]

Not relishing the thought of trying to take off that wastegate to see if its stuck !!!

So its not the EGR, which must surely point to worn piston oil control rings or the turbo.

Will pop the head of the original engine to look at the pistons.

The engine smoked terribly (black sooty) and it pushed smoke and oil down the breather pipe onto the starter and most of the engine. In fact when you sat in the drivers seat for more than 30secs, you got gassed from through the dashboard.

The turbo was mank with oil.

Is it plausible to say that if the wastegate was stuck on the turbo would turn all the time and would probably create too much pressure inside the engine at low revs. This pressure would have to escape and goes out wherever it can, taking oil with it.

Any suggestions greatly appreciated as we have a head gasket set and clutch kit on order and will be assembling things next weekend, but dont want to refit everything to the replacement engine and still end up with the same problem.

We have a Garrett Turbo from our old ZX, but the outlet exhaust pipe from the KKK will not go onto it. At a push we could make up an extra piece of pipe to link the shorter Garrett outlet onto the Van exhaust.

One worry though is that the Garrett Turbo sat idle for 6 years and was seized. With some WD40 the rotor freed off and now turns by hand but has a little sqeak sqeak noise - might disappear when hot and oily....

Has anyone here ever taken apart one of those wastegates on the KKK turbo ?

[ekjdm14]

If the wastegate was indeed stuck it wouldn't affect low revs, no. The wastegate only comes into play on a turbo once the engine is under load & it starts to create boost. It's function is to just open at a preset pressure, which diverts exhaust gases away from the turbine & stops it making too much boost. If it was stuck open you'd get no boost, stuck closed & you'd have an engine that ran like a champion, made excellent power and a turbo that lasted about a month...

I'm thinking you could be right on the worn rings/bores idea, or maybe just stuck rings.

For what it's worth I would never fit a turbo that had been seized without at least stripping & checking things out, much less if it was squeaking. I've not used a cheap ebay kit but if the turbine & impeller have not clipped the housings then you should be ok just replacing the bearings & seals (be aware that the nut holding the impeller onto the shaft loosens in the direction of rotation, so if the impeller spins clockwise the nut undoes clockwise too.) Also it's a good idea to mark the relative positions of the impeller & turbine wheels so they go back on the shaft in the same place to keep the balance as close as possible to how it should be. (I mark both wheels relative to their housings to get them as close as possible if I ever strip a turbo core)

[xsaras4ever]

Ok , thanks for that - will have to chew that one over and think it through - it would be nice to think its the rings coz it saves us having to fiddle with the wastegate.

We see you have a ZX 1.9td.
Here in France they are known as "l'incassable" , meaning the unbreakable.

We have had a few Zx estates, fabulous, and we secretly miss them.

This weekend our neighbour drove his into a ditch for a distance of about 30 metres. A neighbour towed it out with a tractor.
Just a broken wing mirror. It started up and they drove it home.

[ekjdm14]

yep they are good old cars, although ours has seen a few years of rough treatment & neglect when we bought it so we're working through catching up on maintenance but it's always got us back to "base", even when the wishbone snapped (we think due to previous owner ramming a kerb) it was driveable, albeit with very careful inputs to clutch & brakes!

[citroenxm]

Sadly In the uk.. the zx is not good... they like most uk cars suffer rot.. in the outer cills and around front subframe mounts..

I was all out of xud td engines.. then decided to keep an L reg 1994 xantia td and engine stock is back up to two.

i dont think ive ever heard of worn rings unless the unit really has been neglected and rarely had an oil change from owners..

tough the xud is as long as oil services are obide by.. and flowed stricktly..

[ekjdm14]

Yeh I guess we're lucky with our ZX as it's not got any major rot, in fact the only bit of corrosion I've hunted down is just at the stage where taking back to bare metal, treating & repainting will save it, on the offside inner wing. the underpinnings are solid & clean to a surprising degree. The fluids/filters etc side of maintenance seems to have been kept up looking at the paperwork, just things that should have been done like worn drop links, leaking wheel cylinders/excessive handbrake travel & dodgy PO driving resulting in incorrect front bumper/tracking out/wishbone failure/dented wing etc... Overall though its survived it's few years in the doldrums very well since the dealer history stamps stopped around '09/75k miles, and now it's well on the road to the next 90,000 miles and beyond.

I agree it's unlikely for rings to wear unless it's been severely abused/neglected, & again the turbo would be first to suffer if that were true but it could have had a glow plug break up & snap a ring/score cylinder (seen it before, albeit not on an XU), crap dropped down the hole on glow plug change, or maybe just stuck rings from standing a long time. (the more I think on it the more that theory seems to pop into my head!)

[xsaras4ever]

Our last ZX did 550k, thats km, so about 350k miles.

It was still running like a clock when we sold it. But it was the humble 1.9d, which for longevity is the one to go for.
No power = no stress on the components.

Back to the Boxer engine. We will pop the head off and give a look, but agree that ring damage is rare.

We have a plan in our head - fit the original kkk turbo on our replacement engine and see what happens. If it is not good, have a go at fitting our Garrett and making an adapter to mate the exhaust onto the van. This way, if we repair the KKK turbo, or find another from a boxer - we can easily fit it because we have made no permanent modification.

[xsaras4ever]

Hello to all.

Been busy putting together the replacement engine on this van - almost there.

We have contacted the previous owner and he said it smoked like hell and lost power under revs - particularly when going up hills.

He was not particularly mechanically minded - so part of that problem would be the almost knackered clutch.

However, if we do put it all back together and find it still behaves the same, we are going in after the turbo.

While as we previously mentioned we can modify the Garrett turbo, it would be easier and faster to fit a KKK.

Can you nice people confirm that if we get an old Pug 306 or citroen Xantia unit that we can basically turn them upside down and fit them to our manifold and then fit the cast-iron boxer exhaust outlet to the unit to therefore re-create the original setup ?

While we can google image it, a photo and advice from someone who knows what they are talking about is way more re-assuring.

Also , the key symbol was lit and some "expert" mechanic had bypassed the immobiliser with bright purple wiring under the bonnet.

Our injection pump appears to have 2 stop solenoids. One at the back of the pump as is common, and another low down at the front of the pump over near the timing cover. One purple wire to each and one purple wire to the starter solenoid.
The procedure was - ignition on - new dashboard switch on for 10 seconds - dashboard switch off - start engine. Sounds more like a glow-plug procedure. We need to investigate further but suggestions in advance would be helpful.

Thanks Again.

[CitroJim]

I can't comment on the turbo interchangeability but I can advise on the apparent 2nd Stop solenoid on the pump.

The one low down at the front is the cold advance actuator and is there to advance the timing a little to assist with cold starts and cold running. It is often actuated from a contact set on the top of the pump that is connected to the fast idle lever.

The engine will start and run without it being connected. It is really effective only when the brass monkeys are going hypothermic... In normal temperatures it doesn't make a lot of difference.