Bio Diesel in a C5

[KP]

The biggest issue with BioD is when the temps start to drop. Loads of people will try and take the cheap method of mixing in Petrol to thin it out. Better to buy Winterizer tbh.

Also be wary of vehicles that have done loads of miles and tanks of fuel before using it. If any diesel has sat in a tank long enough then there exists the chance for stuff to grow in it like in marine tanks and the like. Biocide is good for this but again some use petrol to the same effect.

If the BioD is well made it should be fine. I've ran it in my dads a few times and the only thing he notices is that it takes a bit more cranking in the morning. I put this down to the fact that it seems very cold where the car sits at my folks but mixing in some normal diesel of 10litres or more a tank does the trick. Its only cold starts that are affected as the fuel will quickly start to warm up. HDi's have fuel coolers for a reason. They dont have a bypass fitted though which is a bit silly for colder climates.

I run my RR on the same stuff and have done for 20,000miles + and it seems fine on it. The biggest problem i had was the intank pump died. Partially due to age and partially due to the bio cleaning the system out and 7years of gunk getting sucked in. When it was replaced the tank was brand new kind of clean inside

An inline fuel filter helps as its easier to replace or just have a spare new one on board and the right tool to open the filter top if it starts to gum up(noted to mostly happen on older XUD's and the like running veg that gums up with the cold temps) and a ziploc bag to store the old one in till you bin it, though keeping it is good as it can replace kindling quite well

As said above, the older XUD's will run on almost anything, even old engine oil to a certain extent. I ran 2 old ones on SVO from costco or bookers. even filled up in their car parks sometimes using an old watering container

[melkig]

Still around 80ppl at Costco

Is that still Palm oil though? It'll struggle as the temps drop...

Just as a FYI here, theres a guy over in Oldham who has got over 1000 litres of rapeseed going at 70ppl at the moment:-
http://www.vegetableoildiesel.co.uk/for ... ?tid=34428" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I bought some last week and it's good quality stuff

[Xaccers]

Still around 80ppl at Costco

Is that still Palm oil though? It'll struggle as the temps drop...

Just as a FYI here, theres a guy over in Oldham who has got over 1000 litres of rapeseed going at 70ppl at the moment:-
http://www.vegetableoildiesel.co.uk/for ... ?tid=34428" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I bought some last week and it's good quality stuff

Costco stuff is GM Soy/Rapeseed. It's fine in the Winter, although if there's snow about I add a little derv.

[Xaccers]

Rapeseed is a little bit thicker than sunflower but not much.
Definitely check the fuel filter, and the mesh on the sender under the back seat.

Wouldn't it be awful to find out the Farmfoods LA Diner stuff is recycled veg!

[melkig]

Filters or tank strainer probably.

I'm on 100% filtered WVO with 5% petrol in an XUD Xantia with no issues.
First sign of filters needed changing are a surging idle.

You might also be starting to get air pulled in to the fuel lines. Check the line from the fuel filter housing to the pump for any air bubbles (that line should be transparent..mine is anyway)

[Technoprat]

a complete nutter!

That would be me ...

A poor example of creative editing; cachaciero did not express
that sentiment as written, it was an option, as in:

** ... you have to have a fair pair of balls to stand against the herd, or supreme
** confidence in your own knowledge and ability's OR........ be a complete nutter!

chap say's he knows what he's doing

That's extremely debatable.

The only debatable matters here are your prior knowledge of me,
my life, my work, or other sundry predilections

One would have to think long and hard about shoving something
like chip fat through a set of extremely precise nozzles ...

I have. Probably around 200 hours

>> I would bet any amount of money that it'll stop working very, very shortly.

Don't hold your breath.

Smeg/.(Egos pricked by appointment.)

'My name is Smegymandias; Look upon my Works ye Mighty and despair !'

[melkig]

Well ... tank strained checked and clean as a whistle. Fuel filter a bit dirty, changed anyway and things are a bit better but car still surging. Where would I be Luke to get some clear tube, what's best to use? Nay as well see what's coming through, if its air bubbled then that could be it.

Here for example:-

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CLEAR-PVC-TUB ... 534&_uhb=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

You'll need some jubilee clips as well, but check the line between the filter and the pump isn't already transparent before you go to the bother.

If the surging gets better goes away if you thin the fuel with petrol, then it's pointing more towards air being pulled into the system.

[Technoprat]

The idle does get better after a couple if minutes but you can still feel it surging.

One of my XUD engines always had an uneven idle on Gloop, like a really cammy petrol engine;
sort-of rump-rump-rump. It was a mechanical pump, various internal springs 'n things,
I guess it could be thrown by viscous fuel. You could bump it to 15% and see if it goes away.

The addition of 10% U/L will reduce the viscosity of veg at room temperature from 10-12 times
to around 2.5 times that of standard diesel fuel. Don't waste your time using dino for blending
unless you're going at least 50/50, and even at Costco prices that's a borderline saving.

When you get to larger doses you need to do the maths more accurately; don't want to teach
you to suck eggs, but, for example, a 20% blend will be 8L oil and 2L unleaded - the addition
will not be 20% of 8L.

Smeg/.

[Technoprat]

So you're saying to use u/l and not derv as a mixing agent.
Presumable this is purely down to cost of derv or are there other good reasons for using unleaded?

It's a complex business; you need to do time on the veggie forums.

The first diesel engine ran on peanut oil. If you study older literature from Merc
and others they recommended adding UP TO 30% petrol to avoid waxing in cold
climates. Obviously we have moved on, but the principle of burning an amount of
petrol in a diesel engine has been defined. No doubt someone will weigh in with
incisive observations about detonation curves, combustion temperatures, or the
effects of Cetane or somesuch; like I said, do some time on the veggie forums.

Basically, the whole plot hinges on viscosity. Lucas vane pumps failed in the old days
due to 'thickness' of the liquid tearing up the pump. Rotaries aren't so bad, and that
includes HDI pumps, but straight veggie is a no-no. Out of Dino, U/L and Kerosine,
the gas works best both in terms of amounts required and cost.

The aim is to approach the viscosity of Dino. Diluting with Dino is clearly an ongoing
diminishing returns situation, an inverse relationship of viscosity vs cost ... plus, you
can use mis-fuel drain-downs from a friendly garage. Historically, due to the nature of
nozzles and orifices, drain-downs are usually 80-85% petrol. You can be specific about
this (if you're obsessive) by measuring the weight of a litre of the mix, petrol is about
0.73 - 0.74 kg and Dino 0.82 - 0.95. There's no chemical interaction or product so you
can compute the amount of U/L per litre in the mix, the last lot I looked at was 0.780.
Get a figure for your local Dino pure to take out the latitude in the above Wiki figures.

But unless you're pushing the edge on an HDI that precision isn't important - 5, 10, 15%
is neither here or there, so the proportions are not significant. When you want an HDI
to start on a really cold morning you have to get a bit more serious with the amounts.

Smeg/.

[melkig]

Thanks.

The idle does get better after a couple if minutes but you can still feel it surging. Is the tube in that link the right size 8mm? If so I'll give it a go ...

I went for 10mm to the fuel filter, then 8mm between fuel filter and pump. You'll need good quality jubilee clips though as the standard line between filter and pump is a bit smaller (6mm at a guess)

As the replies above, UL is *much* better at reducing viscosity. It acts as a solvent to break the chains of molecules:-
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/wiki/Introd ... els_Diesel_(BBD" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)#The_common_method_of_Blending_Biofuels_Diesel

Try adding 10% to a small amount of your veg oil in a clear container and see what happens..

[Technoprat]

http://www.biopowered.co.uk/wiki/Introd ... esel_(BBD)
Entry: The_common_method_of_Blending_Biofuels_Diesel

With the usual caveat that ALL Wiki pages can be written by people just like
you and me - potentially 'complete nutters' - this is a very useful page.

However - I am obliged to note from familiarity with the research
that some of the content is not empirically derived.

Smeg/.

[qprdude]

Wish I had the money to experiment. It's OK saying "he knows what he's doing" but can he afford a new lump when the S hits the F?
Worst that goes into my 2.2 HDI is Tesco or Morrison diesel.

[dragon]

its down to quality of bio
my 2.2hdi ran 10k on my own bio with dpf in place without a hicup
i took my dpf off and it ran same,good as gold
in winter ran without a problem,bio was winterized
but i make sure my bio is tip top,i spend some money on final polishing of bio and filtration
there is lot of owners running hdi,cdti etc on bio,but its down to one think the quality of it

[Technoprat]

its down to quality of bio
but i make sure my bio is tip top,i spend some money
on final polishing of bio and filtration ... its down to
one thing the quality of it

I understand the processes you're using; doesn't it end up
being quite close to the cost of diesel, even if you start
with Waste Vegetable Oil ?

And all that polishing ... what do you do with the final,
beautifully prepared product ? What happens to it ?

You set fire to it. Blow it up . . .

Smeg/.

[Technoprat]

Wish I had the money to experiment.
It's OK saying "he knows what he's doing" but can he afford
a new lump when the S hits the F?

You're worrying too much. What can possibly cause the death
of an engine ? The pump might (conceivably) fail, (the usual
claim), but 30,000 miles on WVO didn't give rise to any failure
of my F*** TDCI common-rail engine . . .

Why do you think HM Customs and Excise finally relented and
made an official tax-free allowance of 2500 litres of veg per
year for all and anyone to use ? So the streets would become
littered with dead vehicles . . . ?

No. It's because they recognise vegetable oil as a valid fuel . . .

Smeg/.