Why did Citroën offer more automatic choice ?

Citroenmad · Unread post by **Citroenmad** » 12 Mar 2011, 23:41

Id like to try a 2.1TD auto, no doubt quite a good combination, id also like to see how much the auto blunts its performance. I know the 2.0 16 in manual and auto were quite far apart in terms of acceleration.

Ah yes, there are a good number of 2.2HDi C5s with a automatic box, often quite easy to find in a high spec too, Exclusive with leather or Exclusive SE which added a few more toys.

Yep, Citroen have the EGS and Senso-drive - basically the same thing, a manual gearbox with an automated operating and clutch.

Our Peugeot is a Senso-drive (or 2-Tronic in Peugeot speak) mated to a 110bhp 1.6 16v petrol engine.

Luke, your right, there is no 'creep' to those gearboxes. As they are a manual box with a clutch any kind of creep would be the car riding the clutch, in effect. If you try and make it hold on a hill with the accelerator, it does it for a split second and then the drive cuts out. Hill starts need to be done with than handbrake or being quick with the accelerator. Though as there is a very slight delay in the take up its easier to use the handbrake.

When you start the car its in automatic mode, you need to press the button to make it a manual change. Once the car is started you then press the brake and engage first gear, by either using the up flappy paddle or pushing the gear lever straight forward (it then springs back to the neutral position, where it always stays). Then off you go, it will change gear in auto mode. The gear changes can be a bit slow, though I have got used to it a bit I still find them annoying - though so much better than a Smart Cars!

It has a similar kick down function to normal autos and you can change up or down with the paddles if you wish, it then restores to auto mode once your done. Gear changes are at sensible times, it doesnt over rev when it doesnt need to. Obviously if your pressing on the gears are held for longer.

In manual mode you can either change gear by the gear lever, which you push backwards for down and upwards for gear up. You can also use the paddles behind the steering wheel. I find if you ease off the accelerator when changing gear you can get the changes almost imperceivable and they are faster too. If your in a high gear and come to s atop, the car automatically changes down the box. You can change up in steps too.

Reverse is found by moving the gear lever to the right and back, it then engages reverse and returns to its natural position of the gear stick being in neutral. 1St, N and R can only be found when the foot brake is depressed. You can leave it in gear if you want to park on a hill with it in first, you just turn the car off without engaging neutral, which id done by knocking the gear lever to the right. You can also make it set off in 2nd gear for slippery conditions, just by putting it into manual mode and selecting 2nd.

This 1.6 petrol is low geared, but thats the nature of the car and box and not the senso-drive.

Various up dates were available for the Senso-drive boxes, which sped up change times and improved gear changes.

They are quite efficient gearboxes, they dont seem to effect MPG in the way normal auto boxes do, in fact some of the models fitted with Senso-drive or EGS actually better the MPG of the manual. In the case of the 1.6HDi 110 C4 hatchback it has better emissions than the manual and so puts it in the cheaper tax class of £30 per year, with 62MPG combined over the 60 of the manual. Same with our 1007, its quite economical for a heavy car with a 1.6 engine and an auto box. I guess its a straight drive clutch and the gear changes can be sensible, which accounts for the MPG.

The EGS gearbox is quite popular in the C4 Picasso, its optional on the 1.6HDi 110 and standard on the 2.0HDi 138 - which does not have a manual gearbox available. Its quite good in the C4 Pic as you get a column mounted gear lever (almost DS Like!) which leaves the centre console free for a little storage area/fridge.

In a way it over comes some issues i dont like about autos, mainly the lack of control in gear changes, especially with older boxes like the Xm which has to do 42mph to get into top. I like the fact you can tell it when to change if you like.

Its a doddle around town, but when needing to park up close to something it can be a pain, as the clutch is almost on or off your either not moving, rolling the opposite direction you want to go or going quite quickly towards something. No control as with a manuals clutch or a normal auto which you can hold on the brake. You do soon get used to it and learn how to get the best from the box and how best to make it creep up to something.

EGS is the same principal, Ive not driven an EGS, but i have been in one as a passenger, the gear changes seemed slower and more drawn out in that than the senso-drive. If accelerating they seem to pause for a while when the select the gear and then go again, doesnt make for the smoothest of drives. The senso-drive is similar but doesnt seem quite as paused.

robert_e_smart · Unread post by **robert_e_smart** » 12 Mar 2011, 23:59

Basically, a regular automatic is better then. I find it so easy to move cars about the yard without having to get into them fully! let the left foot do all. And really handy to get the autos onto ramps etc.

addo · Unread post by **addo** » 13 Mar 2011, 00:14

I still find the idea of an AL4 Activa slightly scary.

The 3-2 kickdown lurch could - if encountered mid hard cornering - put you seriously offline.

Citroenmad · Unread post by **Citroenmad** » 13 Mar 2011, 00:18

Robert: Yes, well, possibly, it has its advantages but also its disadvantages too.

Mainly the control you get when wanting to change gears and the fact performance and MPG are not effected in the same ways that an auto does.

Then again the creep feature is missing and the changes can be too drawn out.

Im still open to the EGS idea, but i think id choose a fully automatic box over one if I had to swap from a manual.

lexi · Unread post by **lexi** » 14 Mar 2011, 20:13

Having two Honda autos at the time I did not hold much hope for a 95 ZX 1.9d auto that I bought my daughter. Actually I was so surprised....it was a lovely box and she did many miles with it. As seamless a change as I can remember.

2 or 3 changes with good old red DEXRON 11 and that was all I did to it.