overfilled c5 gearbox please help

VertVega · Unread post by **VertVega** » 24 Nov 2008, 17:46

Hi axford, In case you don't have the chance to get/add a picture I have a C5 gearbox picture here.
Using Xantia gearbox as a reference I have added two colored circles.
Gearbox oil filling hole would be the one which is marked with BLUE color and the draining with RED color.

axford · Unread post by **axford** » 24 Nov 2008, 18:20

I removed the drain plug from underneath somewhere -it was a round bolt with a square hole inside so i was happy it was the correct one.I poured the new oil into the box via the speedo.
If your going to tell me I ,ve done something stupid please tell me slowly as you are making me very worried.
OK just tell me - I,ve buggered the whole thing up havn't I.
My wife was right - should have just paid the money and got it done properly.
Now I'm going for a pint so that I can read your next good news to come .
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! [/u][/b]

axford · Unread post by **axford** » 24 Nov 2008, 18:30

It must go into the box if i pour it into the speedo sensor hole mustn't it,surely it must. I am in a total flat spin now.I have examined the bottom of the jug with the baileys in and it has a layer of metal particles.
It's absolutely knackered - I 'm so utterly pissed off.

axford · Unread post by **axford** » 24 Nov 2008, 18:36

I thought c5 gear boxes had no refilling hole as they are filled for life.This all started when i renewed the cv boot and pulled the axle out in case anyone is wondering why i touched it in the first place , which I wish i hadn't.In fact I wish i had a different car .in fact I wish i had never heard of citroen .
How am I going to get to work tomorrow and i 've got a wedding on Saturday to go to 50 miles away and I can't attempt anything before then .Do i put more good oil in and hope it will run for a bit longer .
Jesus Christ.Jesus Christ.

VertVega · Unread post by **VertVega** » 24 Nov 2008, 18:56

OK, axford I hope there is no serious damage (Wifes are usually right

). Do you know the gear box type? The picture I have added was type ML5C.
Anyway gearboxes are similar and the idea is almost same.
Here is a photo of a BE3 type (Xantia) while adding gearbox oil, filling hose still attached. 1.8 liters goes there.
I have added the same colored circles here.

I hope someone will be able to help.

axford · Unread post by **axford** » 24 Nov 2008, 19:04

Thanks vertvega for at least being there..Now I know this is crazy but I had no option.I must have this car for tomorrow and everyone i,ve asked is using theirs.I had the choice between putting the baileys back in or used engine oil which is the only thing I had as an alternative and ......yes I 've put 2 litres in and am hoping I 'll get through to next week .......I can't believe ive done it but what else can i do
What's gonna happen next week i have no idea

VertVega · Unread post by **VertVega** » 24 Nov 2008, 19:17

Keeping fingers crossed.

You should not wait for next week but replace asap with gearbox oil

TOTAL TRANSMISSION BV 75W80.

citronut · Unread post by **citronut** » 24 Nov 2008, 19:56

the drain plug marked in the picy is only the drain for the diff, there will also be a plug under the gear box its self,

in the second picy that plug is the level plug, which is ok to fill through, but i always fill through the vent plug on top of the gear box, this is a 17mm plastic plug right on top of the gear box,

if you try filling through the speedo point you might not get much or any up into the gear box proper,

as when filling a gear box with oil it fills the the level ledge in the main box the overflows down into the diff,

what you describe sounds like you have got water in the gear box,

and no you must not use engine oil in a geare box, as Handyman said they are both diferant animals, gear oil is desinged to cling

regards malcolm

ps.
did you say were abouts you are no not the pub

AndersDK · Unread post by **AndersDK** » 24 Nov 2008, 20:19

There is a first time for us all.
And has been for any one else contributing to this forum ...

No one is laughing, no one is calling anyone else stupid, if mistakes are done.
The whole idea with this forum is to help each other especially when things turns out not quite as expected, i.e. when you really need help from someone

Of course engine oil was not meant to enter a gearbox.
But for a short drive in a limited time period, I dont see any harm.
Its certainly better than running on a dry box - or any other completely unknown stuff (i.e. that Bailey mix).

axford · Unread post by **axford** » 25 Nov 2008, 14:20

Just finished work and done 40 miles round the doors without problem.Strangely enough it works great with the engine oil in but have got proper stuff now and am about to change it.
Spoke to specialist and he says I used wrong oil as the baileys effect is the oil 'foaming' which would not happen if correct oil used.
So be careful of halfords own make gear oil even though its the correct viscosity and even states on the bot that its speciaaly made for cit and pug boxes.
I suppose i could have just been unlucky and got a bad batch .The specialist also said that I may have got a returned bottle that someone had 'tampered with' ie added water ? But I am sure i would have noticed when adding and I am 99% sure I can remember breaking the seal on the bottles though.
Anyway the proper stuff (total transmission bv 75w 80) was almost the same price as the halfords stuff.Am going to change it again in a month to get any more iron filings out.Hope its not baileys effect again.Will let you know!

axford · Unread post by **axford** » 27 Nov 2008, 16:11

As an afterthought ,even the proper total stuff seems extraordinarily thin.In contrast to what came out when the axle pulled out ie the original factory stuff.

Unread post by **myglaren** » 27 Nov 2008, 18:17

axford wrote:As an afterthought ,even the proper total stuff seems extraordinarily thin.In contrast to what came out when the axle pulled out ie the original factory stuff.

But was it original or has someone been mucking around with it?

The only alternative that I can think of is that water has contaminated it and emulsified due to the churning of the gears. Perhaps through a breather? Can't imagine how but perhaps there has been a leak somewhere, or a detached drain hose from somewhere.

axford · Unread post by **axford** » 30 Nov 2008, 16:01

Makes sense but I can't see anyway for it to happen.I,m still mystyfied and although its working I can feel there is permanent damage.

handyman · Unread post by **handyman** » 30 Nov 2008, 17:13

Hello Axford, I've only just read this thread and see you are a little perplexed. Is the gearbox still baulking in 3rd and 4th gear?

If you have now put the correct Total BV oil in the gearbox, providing the gears are selecting cleanly, without baulking, you may have saved the gearbox from any further serious damage.

Do you still have the creamy mixture you removed from the gearbox? Has it separated out, ie contaminates at the bottom, clearer oil at the top? Is there water in the bottom of the vessel with the contaminates?

As for solids in the old oil, are there any shiny metal flakes, about 1-3mm? Are they magnetic? The black bits you found are likely to be aluminium deposits from the baulk/selector rings.

If you are not sure about the deposits, email me a photo, as I may be able to identify them. You might need a macro lens if they are small.

If the gearbox is still baulking in 3rd and 4th gear, it will probably mean a gearbox rebuild, as the synchro rings are worn. You can still drive the car like this, as provided the rings do not break up, the selection of gears will be the same. Can you double declutch?

I drove an Aus**n 1100 for 10 years with no synchro in 2nd, just use to double declutch. This was how gearboxes worked prior to the advent of synchomesh gears!

Handyman