C5X change of behaviour

[DS9]

Hi

I have a C5X change of behaviour that I've noticed with the engine/ hybrid system. I have the Shine Plus PHEV

When I got it last summer the engine seemed to operate in a way I expected. With a flat traction battery the engine occasionally works off the smaller hybrid battery, with a full traction battery the car seems to try and use up the traction battery. Seemed to be the experience of most people as far as I know. But this was summer.

In the early winter what I noticed is early on in a journey the car would work off battery but if i turned the heating up to 23-24 or so initially the engine would kick in. I get this, the car thinks it's more efficient to warm the car via the engine rather than the battery.

But there has then been another change and what's happened in the last month or two has me a bit baffled. If i have charge in the traction battery at startup the car starts the engine but then the display shows 800rpm, tickover but also uses the battery as well. So it's like the wheels are being driven by the battery and the engine is just ticking over.....maybe charging the other batteries. Then if i say start a journey with traction battery charge but stop after half a mile, switch the car off and then turn it back on again it just uses battery and not the engine.

I don't use the car regularly, might use if for 2-3 short trips in a week and then not use it for a fortnight. It normally gets a decent run once every 6-8 weeks. Is it running the engine to both replenish the hybrid and normal battery because i have it standing so long? But then why when i do the short drive turn off/ turn back on is it just using the traction battery.

A garbled post maybe but I hope it makes sense. All views appreciated in advance.

[Sloppysod]

Garbled, yes, but understandable.
These cars are designed to run on electric first, providing certain parameters have been met. (Traction battery above 3%, both 12volt batteries sufficiently charged, 12volt drain minimal & not driven hard).

Here is what I think.....
When you plug your car in, the traction battery gets charged to 100%, then I think the underbonet battery also gets charged to 80-90% then the auxiliary battery gets a bit to. However, I think, if you plug in too soon say with 40% + battery remaining, the two smaller batteries do not get charged.

If the car 'thinks' either of the 12volt batteries are low, the engine will startup to top them up, the underbonnnet battery to about 80-90%, then the auxiliary (armrest) battery to whatever.
What you have explained is that you started off in electric mode, probably with heated seats/wheel/rear window/lights/radio/wipers etc... that has put a drain on tge 12v systems, so the ICE was started to recharge those batteries.

But then you stopped and when you started again the voltages the car was reading from the 12volt batteries was good, after all they have just had a little charge, so the ICE wasn't required.

The 80-90% figure is no alternator will charge a battery to 100% because the electrics are not accurate enough, so if the designers, design the system to only charge 80-90% they are never going to over charge the battery.

I think, the engine is started from the traction battery, the underbonnet battery powers 'normal' 12volt electrics, and the auxiliary battery powers the Hybrid system.

I have a battery tender and plug it in every so often, to keep the 12v batteries charged, especially in the colder months. And now, try to run the traction battery to 0% as often as i can, before recharging.

[DS9]

Thanks. I get all that. I think to a degree we're all guessing off what we've experienced and you'll have far more experience than me.

I think your charging to 100% angle makes sense. I have noticed on the rare occasions in the past when I've charged to 100% the car continues charging for a few minutes, this is probably to charge the other 2 batteries a little. I agree with battery "normal", aux battery hybrid.

I just wonder after prior experience if cars these days are meant to be driven regularly. I can have mine standing for weeks on end. I know with the DS9 I had, which had a freewheeling mode (subject to sufficient battery charge) that the electronics even when the cars turned off are using juice. On the DS9 I could be on the motorway for 150 miles until the freewheeling kicked in so the battery must have been very depleted.

Wouldnt mind a trickle charger myself. I have looked at the £30-£40 solar ones in the past, is this the type of thing you have? Only issue is we're moving in a couple of months and the new parking space is in an underground car park. Ideally I'd like a small battery tender that could be plugged into the cigarette lighter, charge the battery a bit in the quiet periods I have and then when the car goes on a long run it recharges the tender from the car. Does such a thing exist? does the 12v socket need to be constantly live? Is that possible?

[Sloppysod]

Hi, I have owned my car for around 20 months, now and have gained a fair understanding (I think....I hope) of how and why it behaves the way it does. Please don't take my words as gospel, I have been wrong before..... just ask the wife!

I think the cigarette lighter (sorry 12volt socket) inside the car turns off when the car goes to 'sleep'. The battery tender I have is a cheap draper one, I have hard wired the connections to the car, see below, so i can connect the tender without lifting the bonnet.

If you look at pages 193/4 of the owners manual, it will explain charging of the 12 volt battery.

Not sure what you are after exists, good luck. My brother-in-law used to have a solar charger for his Saab, it sat on his dash. But getting the wires from inside the car to under the bonnet may be difficult, also the Shine+ windscreens may not be compatible with solar chargers.🕶

Yes, like every car it has to be driven, especially modern cars that all seem to have small 12volt batteries.
However, as you don't use your car for quite a few days, it may be wise to turn off proximity unlocking to save battery. With this 'On' the car is always trying to find your key fob. This is another symptom of either of the batteries getting low, another symptom is the (cr)app not being able to connect, but not the only reason.

[DS9]

Thanks.

That's a really good call actually regarding disabling the proximity unlocking. With the "radar" being on all the time looking out for the key it probably uses up a load of battery while stood in say a 2wk period. I can easily turn it back on when im actually using the car for a few days.

I remember when I first got my car you mentioned that a sign the battery was depleted was the proximity opening stopped working, something that I can attest to through experience.

[Sloppysod]

The owners manual actually suggests disconnecting the battery if left unused for a long time. If you did you would have to use the manual key to open the Passenger Door!.
Remember,as well as the proximity unlocking using battery while parked, the over the air update system and the app data may also use battery capacity.

[DS9]

Hi

I looked through the vehicle settings last night and disabling proximity locking isnt listed on there with the other stuff. About the closest I can get is driver door only unlocking.

I had a look in the handbook an its says it's in Settings>Vehicle but presume it's just generic. It does say however the unlock on approach disables itself after approx 1 week and then resets the next time the car is started. This might be good enough for me.

[Richard_C]

Theres all kinds of drain on modern cars, a few things you could try if its to be left unused for a period.

On most cars I've had, locking using the key (or blade in Citroen's case) leaves it locked but with the alarm off. You can usuallay disable the volumetric alarm with a button on the dashboard. If you go into lighting settings you can turn off welcome lights and follow me home lights (or whatever they are called now). It can't be helpful if the headlights come on as soon as you get near the car and before the engine is started - maybe less of problem with LED.

I was pretty sure you could stop proximity unlocking - mine's a C4 - I will be in the car waiting for someone tomorrow so will play with all the menus and try to find it in case its the same as yours.

[Richard_C]

On my C4 it's settings, vehicle, vehicle access, auto hands free access. Under vehicle, vehicle lighting you can turn off the welcome and guide me home stuff

(The unlock drivers door only option may be more important in some markets. Every hire car I've had in USA and Canada is set like that by default, presumably to stop gun toting miscreants lurking on the passenger side leaping in before you set off. Bad people, very bad people, the badliest people ever...etc)

[DS9]

Thanks for looking, I thought i set up alerts on the thread so didnt realise a reply had been posted. I'll have another dig around when I'm next in the car menu's.

On the other thing I posted about, i.e. the engine running when it shouldnt be, I've found someone else bemused by the same event on pistonheads so can only conclude it's how the car is setup and not something unique....or a fault...in my car.

[Sloppysod]

....... the engine running when it shouldnt be......

Mr Al Ogarithm controls when the engine needs to run, any queries or complaints should be made to him.
If it should or shouldn't is up to him, not you.

[DS9]

Just wondering what you think of your door seals Stu?

When I had my previous DS9 one thing that I liked was the solid feeling, took me back to 1990s mercs. Everything felt so solid. Opening and closing the doors was great, they felt so solid and well sealed. I think the door metal was thicker than on the C5X and they perhaps had a bit of sound deadening in them. When i knock the C5X's doors they sound like big drums.

The doors open and close fine but I'm not sure the seals are as tight as on the DS9 so today I bought some WD40 silicone version and sprayed it around liberally in the hope it brings the seals back to life a bit and makes them swell a little, hopefully with the effect of tightening the seals.

[Sloppysod]

Not really something I have given alot of thought to. They seal, no noise, but yes doors are a bit thin, but then again most cars built since the late 2010's all to save money and weight.
Spent the last few days trying to sort out the USB, manual says up to 63gb, but also FAT32 format, whereas, 64gb wants to be formatted naturally to exFAT, hopefully my problem had been sorted.

[DS9]

Ok, ta. I suppose if youve come from similar you dont really notice any difference. I just think they dont seal that well so will try and improve.

I've never toyed with the USB, I just normally have a lead to my google Pixel phone I plug in when I get in. I sometimes use the charging tray but then always forget the phone when I leave the car.