C5x7 NEW steering disaster..

[aerodynamica]

C5 steering again! I've got a major fluid leak. It is certainly one of the pressure pipes because it only gushes out on RH turns.

I haven't been able to inspect it yet but I think it is likely to be one of the 2 external pipes seen on top of the rack. Possibly where they connect.

I had the rack out early in the year to fix the usual c5x7 shaft seal. I had these external pipes off at the time and noticed they are a push fit with O ring and have a thin metal clip to hold them. I wonder if one of these has come off

[aerodynamica]

I wonder if one of the steering fuses removed will allow the drive home without losing much more LDS. Anyone done this?

EDIT: fuse F7 10A under the bonnet is for the steering. I think it will be OK to remove this for a while and have stiff steering until I can fix the leaking. Shouldn't be any knock-on problem driving a bit with the PAS pump not running would there?

[mickthemaverick]

I think your logic makes sense Graeme although I don't know if manual movement of the rack will cause back pressure in the pipes and leak the same?

[aerodynamica]

I think your logic makes sense Graeme although I don't know if manual movement of the rack will cause back pressure in the pipes and leak the same?

Oh I didn't think of that. To be honest, itleaks at such a high pressure dry steering right had that I think even if it still leaks like you say, it won't be to the same extent. But just don't know.. gonna try this anyway. Only need to get home.... via an eyetest appointment...

[PaulC5]

If possible plan a route that only turns left to get you home.

When my dad got older he did not like driving right hand turns and would plan routes with left hand ones. When he wanted to buy us presents he would buy practical things so we used to pick things from Machine Mart since he could do a 5 mile circular route with mostly left turns. Also gave him a chance to browse their tools.

[aerodynamica]

Ok well I pulled out the 10A fuse and it comes in steering faulty. I agree with it

Started, run around car park and no sign of any major leaking now. Topped up the LDS. The inactive steering is immensely heavy. Like nothing I've experienced before (had LHM Citroëns with the system depressurised and think their steering was still more manageable..) so that's going to be fun.

I notice that the 'snow' and 'sport' symbols for the gearbox are flashing now. Why would that be? Is the gearbox reliant on the steering in some major way?

[mickthemaverick]

You probably have wider tyres with better grip on this car than you did on the older ones so it is heavier. I suspect that the ECU has detected a steering issue and possibly inhibited the sport and snow functions, I think you can ignore that until you get home.

[aerodynamica]

Well travelled a distance and it was OK. Very heavy at low speeds but not horrible. Of course. No parking spaces at all. So had to do a 3 point turn. Funny how the first time I've found no spaces on this visit is the time I've got no PAS

[aerodynamica]

Well, I found the problem. One of the two pipes that exits the pinion valve housing is leaking badly. Sprays LDS directly on the DPF housing. I removed the pipe and O ring and the O ring has split. I have a spare from the previous steering rack I worked with so tried this O ring and it stopped spraying! But still leaks. The pipes are held in the bore by a single screw and a little clamping plate that never inspires confidence to me. I think the sealing is done axially between the pipe and its surrounding bore and the idea is that so long as it's in the bore it should seal but it doesn't. I think the O ring is actually free to move between the pipe flare and the inner seat of the pipe bore in the pinion housing. I think there must be either pitting to the material or the O ring is shrunk. Tried adding a thinner viton O ring to sit on the pipe between the actual O ring and the pipe flare in an attempt to push the O ring further into the bore and that has actually improved it further. Now the LDS merely oozes when steering. I might replace this smaller O ring with another of the main O ring that I have from that other rack to step up that effect a bit more tomorrow. But I wonder if really it needs a slightly bigger O ring

[bobins]

If all else fails, you could always bond the pipe into the bore with something suitably gluey.... but it's a far from elegant solution. I'd also thought in the past about seating a small shim or suitably tiddly washer to sit between the flare on the pipe and the seat that that flare sits onto - so when you clamp the pipe back in with its screw, it'd be held in place with a firmer pressure and possibly a secondary seal.

[aerodynamica]

If all else fails, you could always bond the pipe into the bore with something suitably gluey.... but it's a far from elegant solution. I'd also thought in the past about seating a small shim or suitably tiddly washer to sit between the flare on the pipe and the seat that that flare sits onto - so when you clamp the pipe back in with its screw, it'd be held in place with a firmer pressure and possibly a secondary seal.

An excellent idea that, I had toyed earlier with the idea of a thin metal shim just on the lower part of that little clamping plate but was not confident it would actually hold them equally.

I also did think about some sort of bonding thing. I have some 2 - part chemical metal that might work with the O ring stuffed in first. The trouble is doing that with the rack in situ. With this pie disconnected there is an unending, steady flow of fluid from the port of the pinion valve housing so I just don't know how I could do it. Probably would actually do this if it wasn't so oily...

[stu9]

Why is there so much trouble with the rack on these cars.

[wurlycorner]

PSA switched production to cheaper sources for the x7, lower quality metals used.

[aerodynamica]

PSA switched production to cheaper sources for the x7, lower quality metals used.

Which is a shame because otherwise it's a great car. It could have taken on the rivals far better. It has a great ride quality and pretty good road holding with acceptably controlled body roll. Laminated side windows, heated, massaging front seats. Mine is nearly 18 years old and there are no rattles or squeaks. So they did make a good effort with it. Shame otherwise.

[aerodynamica]

Anyway, it still seems to be holding for now but I plan to return with a slightly thicker O ring for it once I find the right size.