CitroJim's AX, C3 Picasso, Cycling and Running Tales

[RichardW]

Grateful if you could look up the part number. VIN is VF7**************[VIN obfuscated, can be read by forum staff] Thanks ever so

Part number 9802763880 - £208.32 from Cit for reference. That appears to be the only one for 1.6 C4 Pic / Spacetourer; the 2.0 uses a different part no.

As I understand it you will need to re-set the denox system once the new part is fitted, even if the fault clears itself.

[MattBLancs]

It was remarkably easy to get it out, the hardest bit was removing the undertray...

We need another. Autodoc do them but offer three OEM part numbers...

Ah, good to see one removed. It's a fixing a bit like an EGR pipework clamp holds them in place, isn't it?

If it's same diameter as EGR pipe clamp, I'd be tempted to us the BMW EGR clamp (basically a modified jubilee clip) - Autodoc lists them cheaper too, link coming up in a mo:

https://m.autodoc.co.uk/3rg/15942179

EGR clip (jubilee type)

Currently £4.07 each, they've been about £3 each in the past I think

[MattBLancs]

Currently £4.07 each, they've been about £3 each in the past I think

Ah, seems that counts as cheap still, in comparison https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/196730295287

= £12.66 each, second hand on eBay!!

[CitroJim]

Grateful if you could look up the part number. VIN is VF7**************[VIN obfuscated, can be read by forum staff]**************[VIN obfuscated, can be read by forum staff] Thanks ever so

Part number 9802763880 - £208.32 from Cit for reference. That appears to be the only one for 1.6 C4 Pic / Spacetourer; the 2.0 uses a different part no.

As I understand it you will need to re-set the denox system once the new part is fitted, even if the fault clears itself.

Thanks Richard

Ah, good to see one removed. It's a fixing a bit like an EGR pipework clamp holds them in place, isn't it?

I believe so Matt. I didn't actually remove it as I'm strictly diagnostics The owner removed it and described the clamp. He found the under-tray in a terrible state and stripped a few fixings in the process. I'm glad I did not offer to do the spanner-work for him!

I have a strict policy of not working on other peoples cars for that very reason; I'm happy to do a diagnostic on the strict understanding it's 'best endeavours' only - a lesson I learned the hard way a while back. I only lay spanners on my own cars or those of friends who understand the potential risks.

Both the C4 owner and I were amazed to find loads of urea injectors offered on the 'Bay and the Bezos Jungle ranging in price from about £25 and all the way up to much higher prices. Owner advised to order a mid-priced one I guess the cheap ones are like cheap oxygen sensors - they only work for a short while and never wonderfully well.

At least Mr. Bezos can supply one in a day...

[MattBLancs]

Yes surprisingly available online, I had a quick look on Autodoc, hard to find as they list it as a "dosing module".

Brand: 3RG, £91.47 (not included a link as that's based on a search based on my 2.0 HDi 308, so not likely of use for you)

I am not sure about "how cheap is too cheap?" with respect to Adblue injectors, seems a fairly simple component but equally it has a hard life, exposed to the elements and salt spray externally, high temperatures from the exhaust gases and it's to flow the "magic chicken p**s" (the Adblue!) which I'd think mildly acidic??


Get your point about minimising exposure to risk etc by not working on other's cars, fair enough!

[CitroJim]

I am not sure about "how cheap is too cheap?" with respect to Adblue injectors, seems a fairly simple component

Well, I can confidently say the ones from the cheaper end of the spectrum on Amazon work... The owner ordered one last evening and it was here this morning... It remains to be seen for how long these cheaper ones last...

He fitted it and I popped my laptop on the car - only to find the same fault remained I then immediately regretted offering to even slightly help with this in view of my earlier comments...

That said, I got struck in and did some tests. I needed to remove the injector again to check it and in doing so encountered the fiddly clamp and the poor way it's mounted to the bottom of the DPF - it just butts up against a none-too-smooth flange. No wonder they all leak urea

The new one tested OK with a continuity of around 13.5 ohms. I checked for voltage on the cable end of the plug and could see around 8V with the ignition switched on and the pump priming. So what was the problem?

Owner said the connector felt a bit loose and fuzzy when he pushed it on. I had a look for bent pins and all looked OK although I did observe the pins are deep in the body. I pushed the connector back on to the injector and it took a bit of a push before it went home with a nice, satisfying click.

The fault then cleared and just to be sure I did an actuator test on it and finally used the repair menu to advise the Engine ECU a nice new urea injector had been fitted. All is good

How much urea weeps out of the joint between injector and the DPF flange can be seen by looking at the under tray...

but equally it has a hard life, exposed to the elements and salt spray externally, high temperatures from the exhaust gases and it's to flow the "magic chicken p**s" (the Adblue!) which I'd think mildly acidic??

Yes, a very harsh environment Matt and the urea will likely be acidic. It's tasteless though as I got a mouthful when I disconnected the injector pipe!!!

On the old injector I notice how much urea collected around its body and the vicinity of its solenoid. That can't help it live a long and happy life...

It was an interesting job and I learned a lot of useful stuff. I also learned just how rubbish the method of mating the injector to the DPF is but at least it makes it easy to remove. And that three-piece clip is bloody fiddly

I left the owner to repair/replace the undertray

So, £30 for a new injector and £100 for our local Stellantis Main Stealer to do the initial diagnosis. The owner is happy in that he swerved a large bill. In return I'll get my conservatory refurbished at a very good rate - we're all happy

[MattBLancs]

A job well done Jim
The injector is much further forward on that 1.6 (with it's DPF sat in front of the block) than on my 2.0 = DPF in the horizontal and injector is after that. Roughly under driver's elbow I'd think. Certainly beyond the weather protection of the under tray anyway!

The body/flange of the adblue injector looks to be stainless, I wonder if there's a bit of preferential corrosion of the exhaust's corresponding flange as to why that's it's not very smooth/flat.

I remember the EGR clamp being a faff, the BMW jubilee equivalents are definitely a better solution ( and eminently reusable - from memory the standard clamps need the stainless to flex a little in lieu of a hinge, would think that liable to fatigue with a few uses)

[Zelandeth]

Problem we used to have pretty much continually on buses back when I was still involved in that field was urea crystallising inside the injector orifice and blocking it up. Sometimes they could be cleaned, but often as not they needed replacement. Can assure you the ones for those applications were considerably more expensive!

[CitroJim]

The body/flange of the adblue injector looks to be stainless, I wonder if there's a bit of preferential corrosion of the exhaust's corresponding flange as to why that's it's not very smooth/flat.

That could well be it Matt. I must admit, not enjoying particularly good health currently, I only went under to take the picture and did not get further involved... If it was mine, I'd have looked to have cleaned it up a bit.

The injector body does look to be stainless.

Problem we used to have pretty much continually on buses back when I was still involved in that field was urea crystallising inside the injector orifice and blocking it up.

That happens a lot with those too Zel. Hence using the Wynns Crystal Clear additive to try to prevent it. The failed one in question was open-circuit.

[MattBLancs]

Interesting picture for you. You mentioned the undertray of the Picasso had AdBlue crystalline residue. Looks very much the same here though this is the grey 308 under tray which does not have adblue! So the dried out road salt which is what I guess this is can also look similar

[CitroJim]

Ahh, I just assumed Matt as the major area of crystallisation was right under where the injector is... I must admit I've never seen it on my Picasso although I know the injector has wept a bit in the past. Stellantis saw it when they serviced the car and tried to tell me I had a big problem.

I'll look more closely next time... Maybe do a taste test as I know AdBlue is tasteless

That's a lot of salt residue on your 308

[Stickyfinger]

That is the result of the new "Salt Slurry" they are using on the roads as it concentrates in puddles more than the grit mixed types.....it splashes up and it pools and dries.................just think what is happening inside the box frame sections and between panel gaps !

[MattBLancs]

Ahh, I just assumed Matt as the major area of crystallisation was right under where the injector is... I must admit I've never seen it on my Picasso although I know the injector has wept a bit in the past. Stellantis saw it when they serviced the car and tried to tell me I had a big problem.

I'll look more closely next time... Maybe do a taste test as I know AdBlue is tasteless

That's a lot of salt residue on your 308

Yes I too was surprised quite how much has accumulated there, I guess the drying effect of a nice hot engine and exhaust above makes an ideal evaporation table! Undertray today modified with a series of 5 mm holes in the hope each "chamber" in the webs of the tray can drain more easily. We well see!

I'm working my way up to this taste test method!

That is the result of the new "Salt Slurry" they are using on the roads as it concentrates in puddles more than the grit mixed types.....it splashes up and it pools and dries.................just think what is happening inside the box frame sections and between panel gaps !

Ah interesting, I'd not heard of that perhaps why I've not remembered seeing so much salt in the past. As you say, undertray dues mind it but it'll be causing havoc in other places no doubt!

[CitroJim]

I have just experienced the most amazing conjunction of remarkable happenings...

So remarkable, I feel the need to do the lottery on Wednesday

It kicked off with a very good and successful visit to Tesco and feeding Strawberry with a nice drop of Finest Momentum 99

But that wasn't it...

I had cause to see my GP this morning. I was seen a full two minutes before the appointment time... Not so lucky for her next patient as we well over-ran.

She ordered me to immediately attend the hospital. There and then she made a walk-in appointment.

I drove to the hospital and immediately found a parking space - a happening so unusual it often makes headlines on the local news.

I then settled in for a prolonged stay in a waiting room absolutely stuffed to the gills. I nearly fell off my chair after being called forward barely ten minutes after my arrival. All was done and dusted and I was on my way home in 20 minutes...

Totally unbelievable! And that was the good old NHS, not private...

That said, I'm still waiting for an appointment with the vampires... I'm not looking forward to that one. I can cope with other people's blood when I need to deal with injuries but go very queasy at the sight of my own... I have to warn the phlebotomist and look away

[Rp0thejester]

I'm not reading any of this Jim. When we meet again hopefully this will give us a talking point, rather than Mick avoiding sheep in a brand new 205.