Xantia S1 and the Lexia....no talkie talkie

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Stickyfinger
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Xantia S1 and the Lexia....no talkie talkie

Post by Stickyfinger »

OK....tried searching and get asll sorts...

Lexia talks-2-works well on all my C5's incld this, other cars incld C8's and Pug 206 etc all work, I am using the large clip plug/cable-2-Lexia (fits both ends..no force used )....BUT

Not on the Xantia, wondering why ?
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xantia_v6
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Re: Xantia S1 and the Lexia....no talkie talkie

Post by xantia_v6 »

Some of the 30 pin adapters apparently do not have the right connections. Have you removed the locking clip from the connector so that the plug goes in all the way?

I have found that my Lexia 3 does not like talking to the A/C, mirror and airbag ECUs on a Mk1, but the engine and ABS ECUs should be OK (enter the immobiliser code for the engine ECU).
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DickieG
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Re: Xantia S1 and the Lexia....no talkie talkie

Post by DickieG »

Is the connector pushed all the way into the socket? As unless you remove the relay below the socket or the sliding bar on the connector it won't be far enough to make contact with the pins.
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Re: Xantia S1 and the Lexia....no talkie talkie

Post by Stickyfinger »

xantia_v6 wrote:Some of the 30 pin adapters apparently do not have the right connections. Have you removed the locking clip from the connector so that the plug goes in all the way?

I have found that my Lexia 3 does not like talking to the A/C, mirror and airbag ECUs on a Mk1, but the engine and ABS ECUs should be OK (enter the immobiliser code for the engine ECU).
DickieG wrote:Is the connector pushed all the way into the socket? As unless you remove the relay below the socket or the sliding bar on the connector it won't be far enough to make contact with the pins.
Hence the "clicking" I heard and quickly disconnected....Will remove the clip and try again.....|the Kit if from Easy-D via ebay 2nd hand btw...

Cheers Gents, will let you know
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Mandrake
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Re: Xantia S1 and the Lexia....no talkie talkie

Post by Mandrake »

A lot of the OBD2 16 pin to 30 pin rectangular adaptors sold with clone Lexia's simply don't work at all.

I've seen two first hand that I have tested for other people on my Lexia kit that don't work and seen others mentioned on the forum... in fact it seems more often than not they don't work.

Having said that, my Easy Diagnostics one does work on my S1 V6 - but doesn't communicate with all ECU's. From memory the Rear view mirror, Deadlocks and Airbags won't communicate, but everything else will. (Including the A/C - contrary to xantia_v6's experience above)

I've looked into this a bit and traced the pinouts of all the cables and adaptors and have come to the conclusion that it's impossible to communicate with all the ECU's using the 16 pin to 30 pin adaptor - there simply aren't enough pins on the 16 pin adaptor!

There are actually 17 pins used on the 30 pin connector with each ECU having it's own separate K-line. In the 16 to 30 pin adaptor cable two of the K-Lines on the 30 pin connector (used for different ECU's) are wired together to the same data pin on the 16 pin connector - and I believe this is part of the problem.

The only way for it to work with all ECU's would be to use a S1 30 pin (rectangular) to 30 pin round connector cable to connect directly to the round connector coming from the Lexia interface without going via the 16 pin connector.

These cables do exist but don't seem to be common.
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Stickyfinger
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Re: Xantia S1 and the Lexia....no talkie talkie

Post by Stickyfinger »

Nope...totally lost me on that....I do get it may be s**t however

edit:
I was told this unit was organically sourced from Easy Diagnostics (this may be total sheep Blks it seems)
Works 100% with everything I have used it on so far, C5's, Pugs C8's etc
Do not wish to buy cables if the unit is crap
Do not wish to buy a new Lexia if I can help it...

Best Advice ?
ken w
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Re: Xantia S1 and the Lexia....no talkie talkie

Post by ken w »

I have worked out a way around the 2 problems with Lexia 3/Diagbox being able to communicate with the Series 1 Xantia Airbag ECU.

The first problem is that most of the 30pin adaptor cables are wired for XMs not Xantias. The XM has a pre-tensioner test pin listed as D2 but the Xantia Airbag K-line is on the F3 pin. The adaptor cable brings out the D2 pin on pin 13 of the 16 pin interface connector and luckily, it brings out F3 as pin 8.

The Series 2 Xantia with the 16 pin connector expects a airbag ECU on pin 13 of the 16 pin OBD style connector. The Lexia version within Diagbox communicates OK with the Airbag ECU on a Series 2 Xantia. I made an OBD adaptor cable that transfers the power and earth leads and pin8 from the 30 pin adaptor cable and transfers pin 8 to pin 13. I could still not get a signal on the F3 pin of the 30 connector using a Series 1 Xantia model with Lexia 3 within Diagbox because it did not seem to connect a pull up resistor to Pin 13. However, if you select the model Xantia 2, the pull up resistor is applied and the computer is very happy to commmunicate to the Series 1 airbag ECU. At least now one can start to read and grapple with the errors bringing on the dashboard light in a series 1 Xantia.

Cheers Ken.
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Re: Xantia S1 and the Lexia....no talkie talkie

Post by wheeler »

ken w wrote:
23 Nov 2021, 08:41
I have worked out a way around the 2 problems with Lexia 3/Diagbox being able to communicate with the Series 1 Xantia Airbag ECU.

The first problem is that most of the 30pin adaptor cables are wired for XMs not Xantias.
There is only one type of 30 pin connector & it works on xantia, XM plus early Saxo’s & Synergies. Has been the same from E.L.I.T. Through to Diagbox. As far as i know any pin switching is done internally in the interface.
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Re: Xantia S1 and the Lexia....no talkie talkie

Post by Mandrake »

wheeler wrote:
23 Nov 2021, 10:51
ken w wrote:
23 Nov 2021, 08:41
I have worked out a way around the 2 problems with Lexia 3/Diagbox being able to communicate with the Series 1 Xantia Airbag ECU.

The first problem is that most of the 30pin adaptor cables are wired for XMs not Xantias.
There is only one type of 30 pin connector & it works on xantia, XM plus early Saxo’s & Synergies. Has been the same from E.L.I.T. Through to Diagbox. As far as i know any pin switching is done internally in the interface.
I have the same problem as ken w - I have a 2012 Lexia (from Easy Diagnostics) with the 16 pin OBD-II to 30 pin rectangular adaptor and there are three ECU's in the car which cannot be read - the Airbag, rear view mirror and deadlocks.

When I looked into this problem myself many years ago I concluded the same as ken that the adaptor is wired incorrectly for the S1 Xantia - for starters, there are not enough wires in the 16 pin connector !! There are actually more data lines assigned on the 30 pin connector than there are on the 16 pin connector and one data line on the 16 pin connector is connected to two different data lines on the 30 pin connector. (Deadlocks and Rear view mirror) See the following:

viewtopic.php?p=416000#p416000

My conclusion at the time was that the 16 to 30 pin connector is a bodge that can't work 100% on a S1 Xantia (or maybe it's designed for the XM as stated earlier) and that the only way to fully read a S1 Xantia is if you have one of those rare 30 pin rectangular to 30 pin round cables that goes all the way back to the round connector coming out of the Lexia without an intermediate adaptor. I haven't been able to source one of those and stopped trying.

There just aren't enough data pins on the 16 pin connector to pass through all the discrete signals needed by a S1 Xantia.

Well done to Ken for going the extra mile I didn't to find a bodge to talk to the Airbag ECU and it confirms my original suspicions that the 16 to 30 pin adaptor is simply wired wrong, and in fact cannot be wired 100% right.

Edit: I see this is an old thread that I've already posted in before saying the same thing, whoops!
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Re: Xantia S1 and the Lexia....no talkie talkie

Post by wheeler »

I have a 30 pin to the round plug that i’ve had for years, im sure i got it off ebay. Its not genuine but it looks exactly the same as a gen one. Its completely untested though never had to use it as i cant remember the last time i had the need to work on a car with a 30 pin plug. The genuine one is like this, its not a 16 pin to 30 pin converter, its 30 pin to round plug . There is definitely only one type of 30 pin plug for all models that have this socket, you dont swap it to change between Xantia, XM, Saxo etc.
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Re: Xantia S1 and the Lexia....no talkie talkie

Post by xantia_v6 »

Wheeler, if you have a fit of boredom, perhaps you could test the pin connections on that cable?

I did once connect a flying lead to bypass the 16 pin adapter when working on a MK1 Xantia, but I have forgotten all the details.
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Re: Xantia S1 and the Lexia....no talkie talkie

Post by Stickyfinger »

I "solved" all the coms problems by employing the well know "Jim Eastment" solution, eg, his ELIT, this talks to all systems on the car.
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Re: Xantia S1 and the Lexia....no talkie talkie

Post by wheeler »

xantia_v6 wrote:
25 Nov 2021, 03:38
Wheeler, if you have a fit of boredom, perhaps you could test the pin connections on that cable?
I can at some point do a pinout on it but like i say its not genuine & I’ve never been able to test it on a car.
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Re: Xantia S1 and the Lexia....no talkie talkie

Post by cit-rotti »

Hi there,
for older Citroen with the square OBD socket, the ELIT or the LEXIA 2 is ideal if the original connector is used.
These original plugs are also suitable for the LEXIA 348.
I still have two - but the lock has been lost and you have to press and hold firmly.
Greetings Wolfgang