2007 Citroen Relay 2.2 starting problems

[Justsam]

Hi Guys, Really scratching mine and the local garages head here. About 6 months ago I started noticing it struggling to start especially from cold. Although it seems intermittent, sometimes it fires straight away and other times it just cranks and cranks, do this about 5 times and it eventually fires. Once its warmed up it starts fine and drives excellent, plenty of power throughout the range, and no smoke unless revved hard, presume this is normal for this engine with 145k on the clock. Gets about 30-33mpg. So for the last 2 weeks its been round at my local well trusted garage. Work/tests completed so far:

* Injectors tested for leak back, 2 worse than others but not bad and within limits.
* Pressure relief valve and pressure regulator replaced with new Denso. - No difference
*Glow plugs found to be not working, relay dropping out due to one glow failed (shorted to earth) Glow plug seized so unable to remove and left disconnected. Other 3 measured for load and resistance ok. - No difference
* Cranking speed tested and ok, also another battery tried and still same problem.

We don't believe it to be a fuel issue as when it doesn't start, it floods itself very quickly. If it doesn't fire quickly you look down at the exhaust and white smoke is puffing out and when it does eventually fire it runs rough and smokes like mad for 10-20 seconds.

So now we are thinking is it low on compression or a timing issue on start up. Next thing we are trying today is the crank sensor? Is this faulty or picking up interference on from the dmf flywheel? Or could the flywheel be causing the problem?...

Any help here would be very appreciated. Sam

[Hell Razor5543]

Well, first, let me welcome you to the forum. All are welcome here.

OK, now to the problem. You will need to get you vehicle onto a Lexia system, as the PSA group use protocols that some generic readers struggle to understand. If the garage are using one of the expensive readers it may have got some useful information. There are members on the forum who have Lexia clones (that should get accurate readings) and are willing to help out. Here is the link;

http://www.frenchcarforum.co.uk/forum/v ... 19&t=29178

Good luck, and I hope that all goes well.

[Justsam]

Thank you James!

Presume they don't have the Lexia but have seen them with a snap-on unit hooked up. Haven't discussed it to that length yet.
So, just had the garage on the phone and looks like they have found the problem crank sensor has been damaged in the housing and is loose. Also it has been hitting the flywheel.
The bad news is that the gearbox has to come off to replace, whilst this is off surely its a good idea to replace the clutch (problematic on these engines apparently) and also the dmf flywheel which does shudder on switch off. Maybe 600-700 pounds worth of work...

[BX]

Its the Transit engine. Failure of the DMF and the crank sensor is not unknown. Sometimes heat from a slipping clutch toasts the sensor.

[Bick]

Hi Justsam and welcome, i did not offer advice on this one because i could have been many things and over the wire i would just have been having random guesses.

However like BX says the problem you have is quite a common one for that engine.

I will tell you one thing though with that Ford engine and the mileage you have on it now (by the way you have done very well to get this far) you need to be thinking about a replacement van. The early MK3 Relays have, as BX says, the Ford engine and it is known for having a barrel of problems and with the mileage you have on it now the bills are going to start coming in.

[Justsam]

Bick, I get where you are coming from. But the van is a converted camper/day van and when I purchased it about 6 months ago it had loads of receipts of the work done, its had a lot in recent years including gear linkage, turbo, brakes, injectors, rear suspension, steering rack etc. Also I think I got it at the right money I have a contingency to complete this work and get it right.

Quoted £500 for clutch, dmf and crank sensor fitted which I didn't think was too silly? After that it should be solid, I hope...

[BX]

This was not the best engine in the world. However in spite of this they can give good service. As you have noticed they can also be quite economical considering the size of the vehicle they haul around. Strangely as far as I observed most of those that suffered actual engine failure, failed early in life. You now have some of the main problems out of the way. I think that you have a good chance of getting your moneys worth out of it.