DMF advice please

[citroenxm]

Car: C5 1.6 HDi 110 16v.

Problem: s**t engine and box.

Verdict: Every thing else is great!

The car has always had a slight urrrm... whine when first starting and reversing out of their drive, then about 3 months ago, the Starter Fuse popped. BUT I didnt know this untill after I swapped the starter for another one, then I found the fuse problem.. anyway. fitted a new fuse, all was ok for about 4 months. Now the replacement starter has - well I think burnt out, so I swapped out the old starter WHICH incedentally useing jump leads spins perfectly well and freely!

However, on the car, it wont work! It simply pops the fuse in the fuse box...

Engine turns over on a Socket and ratchet on the crank pully so its perfectly fine there.

The question is: Is this a DMF problem, and a replacment is needed???

Thanks!

[Peter.N.]

Hi Paul

Are you thinking the starter is actually sticking in mesh? I suppose it could be the DMF unless something is holding the supply on the solenoid after the key is released. I can only suggest that you check for the presence of voltage on the solenoid when the key is released.

Peter

[citroenxm]

No im saying the engine is perfectly clear to turn by hand.. and I KNOW the starter works perfectly.. yet it blows the fuse and just wont turn the engine and the replacment has burnt out after 4 months...

[addo]

Fit an old-fashioned external relay between the fuse panel and solenoid. The fuse can also be up-rated but I believe it's simpler to relieve the strain on the fuse panel with an extra relay.

[citroenxm]

Doesnt work..there is 12v to the motor.. if I put 12 to the solinoid I get a current draw and the starter wont turn.. remember its perfect off the car..

[hamster99]

I'm no expert on auto electrics but i did have a problem some years ago with a started motor which seemed fine out of the car when you connected it to a 12v supply but as soon as it was put under load trying to turn the flywheel it refused to work. When I bought a replacement the guy at the factors said that sometimes the internal windings/brushes/diodes etc etc can get burnt out but you wouldn't notice it without stripping the motor down and testing it.

[citroenxm]

We fitted a new one!! Lasted 4 months.. dont tell me they should die that quickly. The replacement wont do anything on the jump leads.. unlike the original..

[Gibbo2286]

Your fault will be a short circuit somewhere on the loom supplying the solenoid, maybe rubbed through and shorting to the body/engine somewhere. Try disconnecting it at each end and running a wire directly.

[RichardW]

Paul

The starter fuse blowing looks to be a known problem - and replacement/overhaul of the starter is the suggested cure - nothing suggesting it is linked to DMF failure (unlike the TDCi 130 in the Mondeo.... ). So, it looks like original starter was blowing the fuse, replacement fixed that, but new one has subsequently died. Unusual but not unknown - the fact that it appears to be dead if jumped directly suggests an internal failure of windings or brushes - will it go if you give it a whack with a hammer? Can you return the starter to see what they say?

[citroenxm]

Been messing around with this some more today. I put a jump lead on the starter terminal, and put my meter on the other end and to - terminal.

Turned the key, the solinoid clunks nicely, and the meter still shows 11.3v ... so its not lack of power.. its not a stuck engagment, as the engine will turn over by hand easilly on the socket and ratchet..

??????????? ...........

[RichardW]

This on the new starter? It's buggered..... Have you still got the old one, or was it an exchange? If you've got it, can you strip the solenoid and have a look at it? Some info circulating seems to suggest arcing across the contacts is the cause of the fuse blowing. You could refit, and rig up a temporary supply to the solenoid via a relay as Addo suggests to at least prove you can crank / start it.

What's getting the starter out like? I can't even see the things on either of mine!

[citroenxm]

Ive put the old starter back on.. I have put a link wire in place of the fuse .. the solinoid just strongly clunks. Not even the sound of it turning over. Theres 11.3v at the starter terminal.. but not a peep for turning over.

engine is free.. drives with a bump but motor still wont turn.. earth is good..

starter spins and kicks perfectly on the floor with jump leads..

[Peter.N.]

Sounds as though you have two duff starters Paul. If the solenoid is engaging the motor apart from it turning the engine there will be a hefty voltage drop so either the solenoid contacts are not making - unlikely, or the starter is open circuit, most likely the brushes stuck.

Peter

[citroenxm]

Yes I understand that.. but why does it work perfectly on the floor with the jump leads. If they were stuck surely they wouldnt work on the jump leads either!

[Northern_Mike]

There's no force working against it when it's on the floor Paul, so it spins easily. Give it any work to do, and it'll fail. I've had this myself with a VW Passat TDi years ago. Had me baffled. Two faulty starters.

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk