An XM next?

[Old-Guy]

This will probably open a flood-gate, but here goes!

Much as we love the Xantia, we could do with something bigger to take 3 child seats in the back for the grand-children and more load space for all their clobber.

Our annual mileage isn't huge, but most of it is long-distance so diesel economy is a must and something even more comfortable on Britain's crumbling roads would be a bonus.

So I'm thinking about keeping my eyes open for a nice XM estate - but I have to admit my considerable ignorance of XMs (almost as great as my ignorance of Xantiae was when I bought ours!)

It would be DIY maintenance (and it looks as though I shan't have any access to a trade workshop for much longer), so is the XM harder to work on than the Xantia? 2.1 or 2.5? Early or late model? When did the XM get the S1 to S2 update and what did that entail? What to watch out for?

[addo]

Yes, the XM is harder to work on than a Xantia. Parts (new consumables) are less common and NOS thinner on the ground.

You get a little more legroom, a little more room side to side, but that is about all. If you want a large barge with PSA pedigree, buy a 605 - all of the XM's space without the leaks.

[Northern_Mike]

f you want a large barge with PSA pedigree, buy a 605 - all of the XM's space without the leaks.

This would be a good idea. However, at least here in the UK, they seem even rarer than XMs. None on eBay, none on Autotrader if I do a national search.

[Old-Guy]

You get a little more legroom, a little more room side to side, but that is about all. If you want a large barge with PSA pedigree, buy a 605 - all of the XM's space without the leaks.

The PSA 'pedigree' I can do without, it's the magic-carpet ride over England's crumbling roads that I'm after (plus the extra space). The problem with the Xantia is that 3 child seats side by side is barely possible, an hour or more of cussing and straining to fit them and get the belts properly tight, and almost as long to remove. Swapping cars for the day is possible - but then something vital is always in the wrong car! Last time is was no sat nav, no maps and flat mobile with no car charger!

[CitroJim]

it's the magic-carpet ride over England's crumbling roads that I'm after (plus the extra space).

The XM will definitely give you both your desires Guy...

I reckon if you can find a basically good XM then you'll love it to bits and you will be able to give it the love it needs in return to keep it happy..

If you're not worried about performance then go for a 2.1TD Auto. I'd not go for a 2.5 unless it's both a very good example and you're very brave. They are complex and not a little fearsome.

A petrol XM, especially TCT, running on LPG is a good choice fro economy too. Best of all is a late S2 V6

Just a word of caution; an XM is not a big Xantia. It's so different it could have (and I sometimes think it does) come from a different planet...

[Northern_Mike]

I agree with Jim, a 2.1TD manual is also a good bet, they are not as slow as you might think. I had a couple of them, and a 2.0TCT auto estate, which was also very nice.

Some will have you believe they are just a big Xantia. They really, really aren't. They ride better, wallow more, and are far quieter at speed.

They are also, in my experience, an utter pain when they break.

[Citroening]

I know of a 1997 XM 2.1TD Auto VSX Estate done 96,000 Miles that has Leather, Air Con and Alloys which will be coming up for sale in the near future...

[andmcit]

There's no dark art to keeping a 2.5 happy and running faithfully: there's just no way I could envisage managing
to do even half the things I can do with mine compared to a Xantia. Yes OK, Xantiae seem more bulletproof and
forgiving somehow and I put this down to their being developed later by those 4-5 years but you needn't panic
about running an Xm as a daily car - I go ripping up the countryside and leaving no prisoners with my 2.5 and it
easily takes it all in it's stride - some say I drive it like a sports car and it does a damned good job of it so a more
restrained more chilled driver will barely touch the sides of the big car's envelope of abilities.

Only word of advice I would emphasise over all others though - I'm very jaded about the longevity of the ZF autoboxes
and frankly wouldn't trust them going any distance so hanging out for a rarer manual estate would be worth the wait but
expect it to be a s1 as s2 manual estates are rarer than men who've walked on the moon!

[CitroJim]

I'm very jaded about the longevity of the ZF autoboxes

Why? The 4HP18 will, or should go on for ever with regular fluid changes and there's an encyclopaedic knowledge of them on here and Club-XM to fix them when they do throw their toys.. I believe the common problems with the valve block are easy to fix in-situ...

The 4HP20, well, they will see at least 200K with only one minor overhaul...

[myglaren]

This will probably open a flood-gate, but here goes!

Much as we love the Xantia, we could do with something bigger to take 3 child seats in the back for the grand-children and more load space for all their clobber.

Our annual mileage isn't huge, but most of it is long-distance so diesel economy is a must and something even more comfortable on Britain's crumbling roads would be a bonus.

So I'm thinking about keeping my eyes open for a nice XM estate - but I have to admit my considerable ignorance of XMs (almost as great as my ignorance of Xantiae was when I bought ours!)

It would be DIY maintenance (and it looks as though I shan't have any access to a trade workshop for much longer), so is the XM harder to work on than the Xantia? 2.1 or 2.5? Early or late model? When did the XM get the S1 to S2 update and what did that entail? What to watch out for?

Chris (citroenmad) is selling his XM Estate and I can vouch for it being a superb example with tons of room and exceptionally comfortable.

[citroenxm]

I'm very jaded about the longevity of the ZF autoboxes

Why? The 4HP18 will, or should go on for ever with regular fluid changes and there's an encyclopaedic knowledge of them on here and Club-XM to fix them when they do throw their toys.. I believe the common problems with the valve block are easy to fix in-situ...

The 4HP20, well, they will see at least 200K with only one minor overhaul...

I have to agree on the ZF Box's, its NOT the box thats weak, but the owners maintenance!!!! My mates 2.1 td auto Exclusive is now on 222k with original autobox, and from what we can tell NO rebuild. WE change the box fluid every 6-8k, and its still as smooth as can be...

However, do forget to do oil changes, Which on a HP18 is very simple and no computer needed, and they can live a long time.

Guy, Id also reccomend the 2.1 for self maintenace and economy - 45 mpg in a manual car...

The 2.5 engine FILLS the engine bay, and you cannot see through to the floor. A starter swap is a big job to start with, and a clutch swap is also a BIG job, and quite expensive, where a 2.1 is not, and can be done with the engine in situ..

An XM is not a big Xantia, they do not ride or drive the same at all....

[andmcit]

Well all I said was watch for this weakness as not every one of the 2,3,4,5th etc owner is going to give a monkey's
about the gearbox oil even if it's something you can/will devote some OCD time too sure. I've seen so many dead
one's in my time on ebay and witnessed x2 pal's CFSH cars give up as well as a v6 auto i bought and didn't get a week
out of. Don't come running to me when it packs up that's all I'm saying - oh that's right, it'll only have reverse gear
that works...

these can and will give up and the car isn't thrown away with the manual box alternative where, heaven forbid, the
clutch may eventually wear out and set you back a few 100quid as opposed to £1k's with a failed auto.

[Deanxm]

I have to agree on the ZF Box's, its NOT the box thats weak, but the owners maintenance!!!! My mates 2.1 td auto Exclusive is now on 222k with original autobox, and from what we can tell NO rebuild. WE change the box fluid every 6-8k, and its still as smooth as can be...

Couldnt agree more Paul, the only reason they die is excessive use of rad weld/k seal etc leading to overheating or neglected fluid changes, the HP20 is more fragile i will admit but only because they were 'sealed for life' and do not have an easy to reach filter, the box itself is still built like brick outhouse.

D

[citroenxm]

these can and will give up and the car isn't thrown away with the manual box alternative where, heaven forbid, the
clutch may eventually wear out and set you back a few 100quid as opposed to £1k's with a failed auto.

Ahhh. so the recent clutch I fitted to an XM Manual for 80 quid or so was a bargain then...

These points are not just XM specific, they can be for Any car!

[CitroJim]

It's the same things really Dean that cause the HP20 to throw in the towel. I suspect several suffered death by Radweld but often it's not the 'box at all but the torque converter that calls it a day and takes some of the 'box with it, usually the oil pump...

the box itself is still built like brick outhouse.

Just a bit. The term 'over engineered' comes to mind. It's a thing of pure mechanical beauty...