206 1.4 hdi timing belt setup 5 teeth out?

[avamotor]

Hello French Car Forum Members,

I attempted to change the timing belt on my 2004 Peugeot 206 1.4 HDi but feel I have hit a serious snag. After removing the auxiliary belt and pulleys (also due for replacement) to get the upper timing belt cover off which was fiddly but straightforward.

when it I lined up the camshaft sprocket and timing hole to put the 8mm bolt through, all was well but I wasn't able to insert the 5mm bolt through the hole between the gearbox into the flywheel which confused me. The "Haynes" manual suggests putting a 5mm rod through the crankshaft pulley which locates with the relevant hole on the front of the engine into the oil pump housing, this was just not relevant in my case as my crank pulley is 1 piece with no hole to facilitate this so i marked the front pulley with blue chalk and this lines up at about 4-5 o'clock with camshaft correctly located.

Could I ask to all the folks who have successfully changed a timing belt on a 206 1.4 HDi, am I correct in thinking that both the 5mm rod/dowel/bolt through the flywheel alignment should also correspond with the camshaft sprocket alignment? in practice I noted that when the flywheel was locked in position the cam was 3-5 teeth off!!!

Photo 1shows how far out the crank shaft is from the 6 o'clock locating dowel position when the camshaft is line up and bolt inserted.

http://s1242.photobucket.com/albums/gg5 ... 113530.jpg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Photo 2 shows how far out the camshaft is out i.e. 4-5 teeth when the crankshaft is aligned and the 5mm dowel inserted at the rear of the oil sump into the gearbox casing/flywheel.

http://s1242.photobucket.com/albums/gg5 ... 112836.jpg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

this doesn't seem to match up with either auto data or Haynes so I am somewhat stumped and don't wish to "kill my car" trying to line up for the sake of damaging the head or pistons!!!! can a car run 3-5 teeth out?

Please help!!!

Garry

[CitroJim]

Garry,

Have a look at this guide to changing a 206 cambelt.. It shows the timing hole very clearly. I used a piece of Kunifer brake pipe to find the flywheel hole...

[avamotor]

Hello CitroJim,

are the timing hole locations the same for petrol and diesel then?

The guide looks the same as the 1.4 petrol Peugeot Citroen engine which I have managed to change timing belts on before (my 1400 Xsara) but I will have to look in better light on my car as I don't recollect the this 1.4 HDi being in the same location as I think my oil filter and turbo are somewhere in this location on the side of the engine.

Will look in better light but even the autodata information (which corresponds with the Haynes manual) also indicates different location for crank timing hole, so will have to see tomorrow.



Garry

[CitroJim]

Sorry Garry, it was late last night and I mis-read your post as being a 1.4 petrol

SpecSavers here I come

[citronut]

how did/does the engine/car run as it is set at the moment, if it was/is out it will be as flat as a cow pat, and or it might sound like a bag of marballs,

is this a case of there being more that one hole in the flywheel and you have possibly selected the wrong one,
i would lock the cam off then with a length of kunifer/copper brake pipe in the hole in the crank case, then gently turn the crank by its pulley bolt ( i use a half inch drive T bar with the correct socket for this ) just taking up any slack both directions whilst trying to engage the kunifer into the flywheel,

if you then cant engage the kunifer doing this then it definitely seems something is out of synch.

also you must rotate the crank pulley in a clockwise direction as this keeps the tension on the belt the wright side of the cam,

regards malcolm

[wheeler]

On the DV4 engine the hole in the flywheel is only for locking the crank to loosen the pulley, it does not line up the timing. The timing on the crankshaft is by a small rod through the pulley on the pulley end of the engine.

[spider]

Link is broken from their index but a quick look around etc and here you go:

http://www.peugeot206cc.co.uk/repair-20 ... EG27K3.HTM" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I assume its accurate, I've never really been near a 1.4HDi unit apart from the odd oil change.

[citronut]

On the DV4 engine the hole in the flywheel is only for locking the crank to loosen the pulley, it does not line up the timing. The timing on the crankshaft is by a small rod through the pulley on the pulley end of the engine.

looking at Garry's picy's there is not a hole in his crank pulley,

regards malcolm

[wheeler]

Sorry, there is a little round plate under the pulley that is also the magnetic pickup for the crank sensor, the hole is in that, it's only a very small hole aprox 5mm in diamiter.
The guide link that spider posted is correct, it clearly tells you to remove the flywheel pin once the pulley is loosened the turn the engine to line up the cam hole.

[avamotor]

Right then folks, thanks for the advice,

in answer to an earlier question, "how did/does the car run?" to be honest I wouldnt ever be able to appear in the line up of cars in the "Fast and Furious" flim , but it starts okay and runs okay, I only want to change the belt as a preventative future measure rather than replacing an engine especially based on the fact its done 132,000miles with no service history

So to start then (after auxillary belt is removed and upper timing belt cover is removed) the first peg/rod/dowel/bolt that goes through the underside of the engine behind the oil sump into the flywheel (12mm bolt now I think someone else informed me) is to lock the flywheel which has no bearing on timing what so ever, and theoretically another hole sholud be apparent in the crank belt pulley which should line up with the camshaft, but:-

Is this 12mm peg/bolt/rod/dowel etc likely to be strong enough to "crack off" the pulley bolt tightened on to 30 nm and then a further 180 degrees?

am i likely to shatter the rear alloy casing or the actual retaining peg/bolt/dowel etc trying to undo this bolt?

how else is it possible to lock the flywheel from turning to undo the pulley bolt safely of is this the new safe method by which to carry out this process?

after I can undo the front crank pulley bolt is it safest to use a new bolt to ensure it doesnt break on reinstallation?

Thank you again, Garry.

[wheeler]

Is this 12mm peg/bolt/rod/dowel etc likely to be strong enough to "crack off" the pulley bolt tightened on to 30 nm and then a further 180 degrees?

am i likely to shatter the rear alloy casing or the actual retaining peg/bolt/dowel etc trying to undo this bolt?

Thats what it's there for so I doublt any damage will ocurr as long as you use a strong steel rod & not a brittle drill bit or something similar.

how else is it possible to lock the flywheel from turning to undo the pulley bolt safely of is this the new safe method by which to carry out this process?

There is no 'half moon' plate on this engine to access the ring gear hence why the hole is there to lock the flywheel. You could give yourself a lot more work & remove the starter to get to the ring gear. Or the old put the car in top gear & get someone with their foot hard on the brake method.

after I can undo the front crank pulley bolt is it safest to use a new bolt to ensure it doesnt break on reinstallation?

I've never had a problem re using the old one, I just clean the threads & put a smear of threadlock on the bolt.

[citronut]

i agree with Wheeler

as i used this point with a 12mm bolt in it to remove and re/fit a DMF on my friends HDI 307, and it worked a treat,

you will have a job breaking a 12mm bolt especially the very short length between the back of the flywheel and the crank case,

the locking peg at the pulley end is not 12mm not 100% sure what size it is i think may be 6 or 8mm.

regards malcolm

[Lighty]

Spiders pictures are spot on, the car would not run if it were 5 teeth out. These are a very simple replacement .