Xantia 1.9 TD smoky start up SOMETIMES

[Xantidote]

oh dear. I was hoping your update was all about how you'd fixed it .

On the bright side, at least the car (always?) starts

[CitroJim]

I know your pain Graeme..

I had most of this on my old Sinker...

Odd thing was, as it was used mainly as our towing machine it would spend long periods with our caravan discussing life, the universe and everything but not actually running, when called upon to start after weeks of lay-up it would start and run smoothly absolutely instantly

Ask it to sart from cold after say overnight or from half-hot and it would bump, cough and smoke a bit - just like yours...

Sadly, I never did resolve it fully... How it could rest for weeks and then start absolutely on the button perfectly always baffled me...

[aerodynamica]

Have you checked to see if there is actually voltage on the glow plugs when you start it? Apologies if this has already been mentioned.

Peter

Hi all, thanks for the advice everyone - Peter - I actually haven't checked this as I assumed that the lack of voltage at all or each plug would result in really obvious problems - but I'll definitely check this.

The plugs are Bosch brand items from Halfords (I have trade discount) but I notice that the list o applications on the rear of the packet shows the 1.9 D and TD as well as other car makes as suited. I thought the 1.9D items were rated differently. (or is it that the D plugs can't be used on the TD but the opposite is allowed)

Anyway, I'll shortly be going out to start her up from cold. I noticed that it seems to start up smooth and smoke-free if I leave on the plugs for a full 7 secs after the plugs light goes out. It seems it might just need extra heat time.

I'll continue this practice today but it raises questions:

If the plugs light goes out but the heaters continue to operate after this, what does the light timing mean? is it always the same? I feel that is stays on longer from cold.

Why would it need extra heat to start all the time?

I'd possibly use some of the Diesel injector cleaner too as it's something else to attend to.

Well, thanks again folks!

G

[Peter.N.]

If it starts better if you leave the glowplugs on after the light goes out that would indicate you do have voltage on them. I use this as standard practise on mine as they tend to start less easily as they age, I wait until I hear the relay drop out or see the panel lights increase in brightness slightly. General engine wear combined with a tired starter and possibly battery all conspire to make the starting not what it was.

Peter

[aerodynamica]

âllo.

Well, it's offical: leaving the plugs on for longer has it start up smoke-free every time (so far)

Peter: could be true but I note that it starts on about one revolution of the starter so it's a keen starter with extra glow plug time.

I also did the thing where I waited until the relay clicked off and slight change in brightness of the warning lights - quite a long time but of course the glow plugs light itself goes out after only 5-7 secs - why is that? Is the light just a 'dummy' light on a timer? does it vary in time with different starting temps? I thought it did.

Well, that's looking up anyway - next problem is that the back suspension goes down an inch if I put my foot on the brake when stationary.

[Peter.N.]

The light goes out when under ideal conditions the glow plugs are hot enough but the relay keeps them on for a bit longer to reduce smoke when the engine is cold, but on older engines its a good way of making them start better.

The rear section of the brake valve is fed from the rear suspension sphere line so I would expect the suspension to drop a little until the height corrector can compensate.

Peter

[Xaccers]

The light stays on until it's hot enough in theory to start up, then they keep heating while cold fuel is being injected until the engine warms up enough.
It's that "in theory" bit that is letting you down, it relies on enough power getting converted into heat, if the electrics aren't behaving well enough, or the plugs are sub-par then it needs a bit longer to heat before you can start.

[aerodynamica]

Thanks guys. Now where is the relay and wiring for the plugs? I'd like to give them a little overhaul to ensure best performance for the no doubt, hectic winter that's imminent

As for the rear suspension lowering: I've had hydraulic Cits of various types for years and never seen one lower this much on single light brake presses - especially after such intense brake bleeding a few weeks ago... there's air in there.. again...

[Xantidote]

I think you will find the relay, a black box affair, close to the battery, bolted to the inner wing near the battery's main earthing point. Just be careful when playing with it, because I don't think the feed to the relay is fused. The wiring is thick because the glowplugs take 12-20 amps each (the current drawn tails off as the glowplugs heat up)