406 2.1td Stuck in gear

Lycanthrope · Unread post by **Lycanthrope** » 29 Jan 2011, 14:19

Hello, I have a 406 2.1td stuck in gear

Its been sat on the drive for a year now, when it happened I was driving along a dual-carriageway and changing up through the gears it felt a bit sloppy and strange, at the roundabout it would not come out of 5th

I have had a look at the linkage (cables) all seems ok - nothing broken, I have removed the cable balljoints from the bar thing on the top of the gearbox and tried selecting gears by hand and wherever you put the selector don't seem to make any difference.

Where can I go from here, are there any access plates I can remove and check things ? I can't see any

A friend suggested that the selector pins? might have snapped, can I get to these without taking box out ?

I don't really think its worth taking the box out, its a lovely car in great condition, owned by my dad for 8years, but its in need of a cat and exhaust for a mot and its just not worth a new gearbox

Thanks in advance

Unread post by **myglaren** » 29 Jan 2011, 14:26

Second hand gearbox?
At the right price it would be worthwhile, shame to scrap an otherwise decent car.
Think of the cost of replacing it too.
If you have to fit a new exhaust with cat then the additional expense of chucking a replacement gearbox may not be that high - budget for a new clutch though, while the box is out.

Have a mooch around the forum re: exhaust. The cat is an unnecessary burden to a diesel.
If you are replacing a significant part of the exhaust system then a de-catted bespoke ss system might be a consideration, lifetime warranty and lower fuel consumption.

Unread post by **Peter.N.** » 29 Jan 2011, 22:34

Is the gear lever sloppy or does it feel normal?

Lycanthrope · Unread post by **Lycanthrope** » 30 Jan 2011, 04:02

Peter.N. wrote:Is the gear lever sloppy or does it feel normal?

When it was connected it felt normal... Now it is disconnected and I have been moving the selector arm on the top of the gearbox by hand, and nothing seems to happen, does not feel like its getting different gears.

Unread post by **Peter.N.** » 30 Jan 2011, 08:46

Do you mean that there is no resistance when you move the arm or the resistance is the same throughout the range of movement? If so it sounds as though the pin has sheared in the selector shaft, can you see the shaft moving with the lever, you might jut be lucky and its the outside one.

Peter

Lycanthrope · Unread post by **Lycanthrope** » 30 Jan 2011, 09:56

I've had my hand down on the gearbox moving the arm about with someone else sat in the car with foot on clutch, I move the arm to different positions and it feels like its selecting a gear - but when clutch is let out its still in same gear-5th, can't get neutral.

Unread post by **Peter.N.** » 30 Jan 2011, 14:54

OK certainly sounds like the gearbox internals then, possibly a pin in a selector fork, very unusual though. Does it slide in and out as well as rotate?

Peter

Lycanthrope · Unread post by **Lycanthrope** » 30 Jan 2011, 15:43

It does not rotate abnormally, it feel as if I am getting the gears right, I can move it to all positions, but when you let the clutch out it is still in 5th, pulling it up I've not tried.

poddack · Unread post by **poddack** » 01 Feb 2011, 13:43

how does the clutch feel? has the hydraulic system leaked?

Lycanthrope · Unread post by **Lycanthrope** » 01 Feb 2011, 14:27

clutch feels normal and theres no leaking, start car by pressing clutch, let it out and it stalls.

Lycanthrope · Unread post by **Lycanthrope** » 31 Jul 2011, 21:02

Well its a few months later and the cars still sat on the drive, not looked at it since I posted this topic in Feb, contemplating dropping the box out of it as I still consider it too good to scrap even though its been sat nearly 2years now.

Read through the Haynes manual and it don't look overly complicated, just this special tool for the hydraulic clutch.... where I get lost is what to do after the box is off

Can anyone help and point me in the right direction ?

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 31 Jul 2011, 22:06

The ML5 is one bearbox I've never had in bits but I'd be amazed if there's an internal fault.

My thought is that the pin/nut that secures one or other of the external bellcranks to their selector shafts has come loose. This would account for why the stick feels more or less normal but fifth remains selected.

Expose as much of the external selection mechanism as you can and whilst getting someone to operate the gears, see if the movement is actually reaching the shafts.

Also, try disconnecting both cable ends (they're on balljoints and you'll need a forked tool to pop them off) at the gearbox end and try operating the bellcranks by hand. You may even find one falls off in your hand...

As I say, an internal fault is highly unlikely. PSA gearboxes are built like brick outhouses. The same cannot be said of the external bits...

Lycanthrope · Unread post by **Lycanthrope** » 01 Aug 2011, 00:36

CitroJim wrote: Expose as much of the external selection mechanism as you can and whilst getting someone to operate the gears, see if the movement is actually reaching the shafts.

Also, try disconnecting both cable ends (they're on balljoints and you'll need a forked tool to pop them off) at the gearbox end and try operating the bellcranks by hand. You may even find one falls off in your hand...

Thanks for your post CitroJim

back in February when I initially posted - I pull the cables off the top of the gearbox and moved the arms in various positions, it felt like it was selecting gears, but there seemed to be no difference, was still in 5th, and I certainly didn't find neutral

the cables seemed to be in good condition so I'm reluctant to buy a cable set for £60? I read on here.

Unread post by **Peter.N.** » 01 Aug 2011, 12:22

If the selection feels normal and its stuck in 5th the only thing I can conclude is that the pin that secures the fifth gear selector fork has broken or come out. If that is the case when you select another gear the gearbox should lock solid as you will now have two gears selected. I believe you can gain access to fifth gear by removing the end plate on the gearbox - you can on the CX box anyway.

Peter

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 01 Aug 2011, 20:53

Indeed you can Peter...