Leaky ram and electrovalve!

Unread post by **Dommo** » 15 Jan 2010, 20:20

Well.............!

The subframe has been dropped down an inch or two. Still not able to remove the electrovalve, so.. Took the sphere block out (only took 4 hours til this point... Not including the time I spent on it yesterday), and after we got it out my dad said "so why exactly do you think this is the leak?" and I explained that Jim mentioned that it corrodes and eventually you're able to see the green LHM O-ring (we were looking around the sphere block at the same time I was explaining), and he said "you mean like that one there?"

Sure enough once we took the electrovalve off there was a hole in the alloy part of the electrovalve revealing the O-ring to the outside world...

Something's gone right at least!

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 15 Jan 2010, 20:28

That's good Dom, the problem is found...

Good work

Can you post up some pictures please? Make them no bigger than 640 x 480 please and preferably compressed to about 50K for fast loading. If you can't, email me them and I'll host them for you.

Now, with pictures, we can tell if the Activa electrovale is similar internally to a normal hydractive electrovalve.

As it's toast anyway, split it apart by holding the 24mm end in a socket held in a big vice and carefully undo the 16mm hex and then take some detailed photos of the innards and the assembly order. If the two halves are very tight, try heating it gently in an oven to warm up and soften the Loctite.

If the pictures show it's similar, a rebuild using a hydractive body may be possible...

Unread post by **Dommo** » 15 Jan 2010, 21:25

CitroJim wrote:That's good Dom, the problem is found...

Good work

Can you post up some pictures please? Make them no bigger than 640 x 480 please and preferably compressed to about 50K for fast loading. If you can't, email me them and I'll host them for you.

Now, with pictures, we can tell if the Activa electrovale is similar internally to a normal hydractive electrovalve.

As it's toast anyway, split it apart by holding the 24mm end in a socket held in a big vice and carefully undo the 16mm hex and then take some detailed photos of the innards and the assembly order. If the two halves are very tight, try heating it gently in an oven to warm up and soften the Loctite.

If the pictures show it's similar, a rebuild using a hydractive body may be possible...

Cheers Jim. Yep we're going to take it apart over the next few days and take a look. We'll compare it with the picture you posted on the bottom of page 4 and take some photos while we're at it. We could also measure some things if needs be. From what we can see of the electrovalve when it's taken off the sphere block everything is the same size.. The insides will be the difference I'm sure.

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 15 Jan 2010, 21:58

Great stuff Dom,

If it'll help, I can do some better photos of a dismantled hydractive electrovalve for comparison purposes...

Unread post by **Dommo** » 15 Jan 2010, 22:07

That would be good. But then again I'll have both apart for comparison purposes anyway. But if you have any pictures of it apart to hand (preferably with the alloy part in shot too) that'd be great.

Cheers Jim, Dom.

Unread post by **Dommo** » 17 Jan 2010, 18:03

We had the electrovalves apart today, from what we can tell the only differences are the flat section closest to the sphere body on the bit the slug slides over, and there is 0.7mm difference in the coil length and presumably in the alloy part too, I forgot to measure this but I can do if needs be.

0.7mm doesn't sound like much but it's enough to make a gap where the crinkle washer is so the crinkle washer isn't flat, if that makes sense. It means there is movement between the coil/cover and the internals. I don't know if this is normal but I'm assuming not. The crinkle washer that came off the activa electrovalve with the 0.7mm larger coil was totally flat, no 'crinkle' left in it.

Top is a hydractive electrovalve, bottom is an activa electrovalve

There's more photos here:

http://s180.photobucket.com/albums/x226/Dommmo/

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 18 Jan 2010, 09:21

Dom!

That's fantastic

I reckon you can safely say they're identical...

Good work and a good addition to our knowledge

Unread post by **Dommo** » 19 Jan 2010, 21:28

The main problem is the difference in length between the flats on the pin in the valve. There's 1mm difference between them, the activa one is 6.9mm and the hydractive one is 5.9mm (measured from the start of the flat to the pin tip.

The effect this could cause is allowing more LHM to leak passed the pin and out through the leak off pipe, ie, not just when switching between hard and soft. Possibly it's supposed to leak passed all the time when it's on hard mode. We checked the alloy part and have determined that they are the same.

The only way to prove or disprove our theory is to pop off the leak off pipes on both the hydractive and activa electrovalves and compare the flow rate. Any takers on that job?

Dom (and his dad!)

Unread post by **Dommo** » 19 Jan 2010, 21:31

Oh and another thing. The spring lengths were 1mm different.

Also the pins overall length is the same. Suggesting the alloy parts are totally interchangable.

Edit - here's a picture of the pins

Unread post by **Dommo** » 09 Feb 2010, 20:19

After a bit of a delay with.. well almost everything being a pain in the arse.. the car is back on the ground, and apart from around the HP pump there are zero leaks!!!

The rear ram spigot was the cause of the rear ram leak, the front ram has been swapped for a brand new one, there was quite a bit of play in the shaft of the old ram, but most importantly, the spigot was cracked.

The rear activa electrovalve appears to be leak free, as well as the pipework we had to disconnect.

So... Should be going for an MOT by the end of the week.

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 09 Feb 2010, 20:55

That's good news on the rear ram Dom

Good luck with the MOT

Unread post by **Dommo** » 09 Feb 2010, 20:57

Cheers Jim

One thing I forgot to mention, we noticed a hissing sound from around the throttle body, we assume it's vacuum related, but is it supposed to happen?

XantiaMan · Unread post by **XantiaMan** » 09 Feb 2010, 21:27

Dommo wrote:Cheers Jim

One thing I forgot to mention, we noticed a hissing sound from around the throttle body, we assume it's vacuum related, but is it supposed to happen?

Yes. Its the idle speed control valve below the throttle body.

Unread post by **Dommo** » 09 Feb 2010, 22:29

Thought as much XantiaMan (853

) But are you supposed to be able to hear it over the sound of the engine, with your head under the bonnet?

XantiaMan · Unread post by **XantiaMan** » 09 Feb 2010, 22:38

Dommo wrote:Thought as much XantiaMan (853 ) But are you supposed to be able to hear it over the sound of the engine, with your head under the bonnet?

583

Yes, its very audible with your head under the bonnet but i tend not to drive like this (cant reach the pedals) so its never an issue.

The engine itself is actually quite quiet, thanks to the low compression, but everything else makes a racket like the idle speed control valve, the valve on the NSF for the fuel purge, the injectors, the long aux belt, and the occasional tick of the accumulator every few minutes or so.