Going to view a Xantia soon...what are the warning signs?

vince · Unread post by **vince** » 26 May 2008, 20:03

God im excited

....its one ive had my eye on for a few days. 2 owners from new 100K on the clock, old boy current owner, little village in the country....described as great condition....£500 or as near as....

What i need to know are what are the absolute warning signs to know when to walk away.....? so far i can think of the following checks to make...

- The usual checks on the service history etc
- The frequency of the accumulator sphere ticking.....should be about once every 30 seconds?
- Citaerobics to make sure all is going up and down well enough
- On "top" check for excessive camber on the back wheels / wear on the tyres inside edge indicating rear subframe bearing wear?
- LHM between the 2 marks whilst on "top" setting?
- LHM nice and green with no leaks visible anywhere on the system or around the spheres
- Usual Headgasket OK checks (im pretty good at that one)
- Ticking sound from the steering wheel when at rest (column stalk issues)

Can you confirm the above is all correct and anything else to check for?

Fingers crossed its going to be a good one cos i want to move the Passat on sharpish....its a show / club car and its show season so is a good time to sell

Help me Obi Wan Kenobis your my only hope...... 8) any advice welcome.

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 26 May 2008, 20:25

You have most of it covered Vince

Others to check:

HEATER MATRIX!!! heater on full heat and check for antifreeze smells in the cabin.

Check the radiator. They die at around 100K/ten years. Look for antifreeze stains on the lower edge.

Check the strut tops are sound. Look for excessive rust on them and look underneath the front wings at them for signs of delamination on their mounting flanges. There is a huge thread on here about strut tops. Rusty ones can fail and pop through the bonnet!

Check whilst you're there that both front struts have their gaiters in place and intact.

Check the auxillary drive belt is running true on all pulley grooves and the aircon compressor pully is not grumbling/rumbling; check the aircon basically works.

The pressure regulator should tick at the leat every 30 seconds. That is the lowest acceptable figure. A good sphere coupled to good hydraulics should tick once per milennium; have a shuftie all around for LHM leaks, especially from the steering rack pinion valve. On normal height, bounce each corner to check the suspension spheres are not flat.

Check under the front passgener footwell carpet for damp, indicating a leaky windscreen scuttle seal. Lift off the door weatherseal and feed your hand in under the carpet.

Check likewise for LHM under the drivers carpet, indicating the brake dosuer is leaking.

Unlikely, but check ithe seam in the lower part of the rear door shuts for rust. If an estate, check the front door hinges for weakness and failing welds. Again on an estate, check for water ingress in the tailgate.

If a 1.9TD. check the injection pump for leaks.

EDIT: Check the heater blower works at all speeds.

I'm sure there is more...

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 26 May 2008, 20:31

Vince,

Here is the thread concerning failed strut tops.

Beware, it contains several pictures of a disturbing nature

vince · Unread post by **vince** » 26 May 2008, 20:51

fantastic list Jim, thats exactly the kind of stuff i needed to know.

What also would be handy is which one of the faults listed would you walk away from? ie which would cost the earth to fix.....i presume the heater matrix would be one of the worst costs?

its a saloon also...

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 26 May 2008, 21:15

Personally Vince, I'd run away from any rust but that is pretty uncommon on the Xantia. I'd not run away from much else.

Paradoxically, for all its complexity, a Xantia is pretty straightforward to fix in virtually all areas and for a 1.9TD, most parts are cheap. It is only when you get into Activa/2.1/V6/HDi territory that things change significantly and can get a bit eye-watering.

The heater matrix is a major but doable job. The new matrix is cheap but labour will look like a telephone number. Barrs Leaks will stave off a minor weep for some while.

New strut tops are easy to change but new ones are expensive and breakers yard ones may have a limited life. Budget £250 for these in parts alone.

Rear arm bearings are a pain to do but again not terribly expensive in bits.

I forgot to say, check the ABS is working. Sensors are the usual failure and these are shockingly expensive and rear ones cannot be rescued from a scrapper. Front sensors often can. Check the bulb has not been removed from the warning light to disguise a problem.

A 1.9TD with signs of a failing head gasket might be a walk-away job depending on your ability to do the job. To do a head will cost a minimum of £100 in bits plus the cost of a skim. They're quite doable on a DIY basis. Xac and I did one on the side of the road last year. Again labour will be high as there are fiddly, time-consuming aspects to the job.

A badly leaky diesel injection pump also may tilt the balance but agin, it is not often a problem unless very high ratios of veg have been used on a regular basis in cold weather.

Check the engine management light illuminates and goes out as soon as the engine starts. If it stays on for a while and then goes off, there is a fault stored in the ECU. If there is no light, you either are looking at a mechanically pumped 1.9TD or the bulb has been removed to disguise a fault.

Alternators are both a pain to replace and expensive. Check the HP pump has not been leaking all over it as LHM seems to shorten the life of an alternator. If the HP pump is weeping LHM from it's pipe unions or the big hexagons, the fix is easy. If leaking from anywhwere else, like the spindle, a new pump may be needed.

What you have to be on the lookout for is a car with a multitude of small problems. Each in isolation might not be bad but when multiplied together they can be much larger than their sum and be both time consuming and expensive to sort out.

vince · Unread post by **vince** » 26 May 2008, 21:52

Cheers Jim,

i am going to price up strut top mounts to me tomorrow. Remember i work in the trade and get parts at cost so perhaps they might work out ok..

Must admit though, the top mount thing has shocked me and i will definately be checking that first thing.....

deian · Unread post by **deian** » 26 May 2008, 22:37

what have you seen vince... c'mon now, spill!! we can be more specific with engine/years.

please tell me it's a 2.1td or a V6!

vince · Unread post by **vince** » 27 May 2008, 00:08

its a 1.9 on a 95 plate, 100k on the clock....being honest, my head has gone with the top mounts thing.....its really upset the apple cart

andmcit · Unread post by **andmcit** » 27 May 2008, 00:33

You'll see if the strut top is on borrowed time or all fine and dandy easily
enough by having a good looksee from underneath the wheelarch! I think
it helps if the spheres have always been kept in good health without
being allowed to get hard.

The price of a new pair of strut tops isn't cheap, but then again, most
significant jobs on a car aren't really are they!? PLUS, you can bank on
another 10+ years of lifespan on this aspect of the car if you replace
them - more if you protect/prep the replacements!!

Being aware of the POTENTIAL problem arms you with the confidence to
make a good purchase decision at the end of the day, that's all!

Andrew

admiral51 · Unread post by **admiral51** » 27 May 2008, 00:56

Hi Vince
just seen its a 1.9 you are going to see assuming its a TD but the following still aplies if it has A/C and is a 1.9 n/a (ive got both)
if you look here and see location I - J 6 the brown plug is the sensor for the fans.with the engine /ignition on by unplugging this both fans should start on slow speed for about 5 secs and then go at full speed important note is that both fans should do the same at the same time. the replacement of the motors is a bit fiddly but well covered on here as is the relay/power side of them.
with regard to the interior fan operation it may seem daunting but both the Heated Rear Window and the Blower work off the same ignition supply and is not unusual for both to go down. if its just the Blower then it could be the resistors (Citrojim is the man to speak to on this matter) or it could be a modification is needed in which case look here or here.i did mine a couple of months ago and it cost me no more than £10 and an hours time (ok i had to buy the crimps etc

).
I would do the sit in the boot test to give you a good idea of the state of the Acc sphere. Start the car let it settle at its correct height and then switch off.open the boot and sit in it(well on the bumper not clamber right in

) ,the car should sink and then correct its height after about 20-30 secs.when you get out the boot the car should lift and then settle back to its correct height. A really good Acc sphere will do this at least twice a duff/flat one wont do it at all
The strut tops are unfortunatley one of the things that cause a great deal of concern but having said that they are not an over difficult job to do DIY but the cost new is high as they are a Citroen only part many have got good ones from a scrappy at a fraction of the cost
If the car does not have A/C and is a 1.9 n/a then i think the engine cooling fan will be singular but still have the 2 speeds im sure Citrojim will be able to tell you excatly how it works as he did tell me once but that car has long since been scrapped and my memory is not what it used to be

All in all if you dont think its right walk away and come back with some questions a couple of days thinking time cant hurt and im sure you will be given some good advice on any doubts you have..... may even turn out to be a good bargaining tool over the price

Colin

vince · Unread post by **vince** » 27 May 2008, 07:17

Boys, you are right !!! its not that bad a problem when you put it into perspective

I went to bed late last night with my head spinning...i started pricing up 406's but worked out that to get a similar mileage one i will be paying double Xantia price and therefore would be better off buying a £500 Xantia and replacing the top mounts etc if necessary and still come in at less money overall..

So im back on the horse again....

Still crapping myself though to make sure i dont buy a bag of nails....

Hope its a good one.

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 27 May 2008, 07:44

That is good to hear Vince

vince wrote: I went to bed late last night with my head spinning...i started pricing up 406's but worked out that to get a similar mileage one i will be paying double Xantia price

That was precisely what got me into Xantia ownership in the first place. I was initially looking for a 406 but pound for pound, you could get a lot more Xantia

I bought one with rough strut tops and found they were an absolute doddle to replace.. As said, you'll never have to replace them again.

Good luck Vince, and any questions or issues, you know where we are. I'll be lurking throughout the day...

AndersDK · Unread post by **AndersDK** » 27 May 2008, 09:34

Worst case warning sign : you fall in love with the Xantia you are looking at. Thats really dangerous

Penguin · Unread post by **Penguin** » 27 May 2008, 10:07

Watch out for a heavy clutch. I had to replace mine soon after buying the car (with hindsight I think it's why the car was being sold). The clip breaks leaving you stranded and its a bitch to replace (see numerous threads!). 7 hours labour to replace the clutch. I paid £420 for new clutch, cable and clip, the car only cost me £480!

vince · Unread post by **vince** » 27 May 2008, 21:41

Well i suppose there is an advantage of being in the game....

I just got myself a Citroen dealer mechanic who does foreigners....i can get clutch kits for about £60 Valeo / LUK ones too, and he will do one for me for around £150 labour. He has been at Citroen for 12 years....

Its great having contacts