Xantia hydraulic problem

Fox · Unread post by **Fox** » 22 Aug 2003, 00:19

Hi there,
Last week I was driving along when the STOP (!) light illuminated on the dash. So I pulled over and checked the car. The pipe connecting the LHM reservoir to the pump had split right down where it connects to the pump, and LHM was seeping out. I'd had this problem about a year ago, and we trimmed off the split part and fixed it back on and it worked fine for a year. We repeated this remedy and I drove the car fine for a week.
Today I got in the car and while driving to work I noticed a problem with the steering. It was very heavy at times, and light at others. Half way through a turn it'd suddenly go very heavy, then I'd turn it and it'd become normal again, etc etc. Brakes and suspension worked perfectly and no warning lights illuminated The problem got progressivly worse on my way home, and the steering was very stiff but I still had some power assistance as I could turn the wheel without the car moving which I can't with the engine off. I stopped the car on the drive and popped indoors.
I went back to the car 5 minuites later to find a pool of LHM on the drive under the car. Flicking the bonnet revealed the pipe which split last week had split again, and LHM was again pouring out.
A few questions:
a) I am assuming the PAS problem is related to the split pipe? If so, why did the STOP light illuminate last week and the PAS remain fine, but this week the STOP light did not come on but the PAS went funny?
b) I think it's time the pipe was replaced properly rather than trimmed again as it's obviously getting old. Trouble is, it's difficult to see which of the pipes connecting to the reservoir it is. Has anyone replaced this pipe before and does anyone have any tips?
Thanks!

AndersDK · Unread post by **AndersDK** » 22 Aug 2003, 00:33

That would be the largest diameter hose on the reservoir.
Simply detach the hose from reservoir & try empty the hose the best you can - to avoid messy spillage - anyway have lots of papers & rags handy.
Then withdraw the hose - using a length of wire - to have some means of pulling the new hose back the same route.
may be necessary to cut any larger dia part of the old hose.
With new hose fitted - this hose must be filled up with LHM - to prime the hose & pump. If not the pump will try suction on air - not feasable.
Chances are with a rotten rubber hose - that quite a bit of air has been allowed to reach the pump's suction.
You won't see any leaks from this - since it's on the pump's suction side.
Air in the hydraulics causes al sorts of odd's - highly unwanted in ANY hydraulic system.

Fox · Unread post by **Fox** » 22 Aug 2003, 00:51

Excellent idea with the bit of wire [:)]
What hose do I need and where would be the best place to get it? I can't find it on Andyspares

AndersDK · Unread post by **AndersDK** » 22 Aug 2003, 00:59

I don't think GSF stock these hoses -
You Citroen dealer is most likely the quickest source -
Don't be scared off their price in the £25 - £35 range expected - it's not possible to find it cheaper (my experience).
Anyway - standard PVC (oil resistant) tubing suitable diameter would probably last the car out. But PVC is likely to get sharp bends - blocking off the hose.
You may even use 3/4" PVC water/garden hose (cleaned [;)]) as a shortterm repair. The suction in the hose is very low anyway.

Fox · Unread post by **Fox** » 22 Aug 2003, 01:01

I'd like to try the PVC hose if at all possible. £40 for a peice of black tube is quite hard to stomach [:D]
Just a case of getting a length and cutting it to fit I'd guess?

AndersDK · Unread post by **AndersDK** » 22 Aug 2003, 01:17

Yup [:)]

Dave Burns · Unread post by **Dave Burns** » 22 Aug 2003, 01:20

You wont get the hose through by trying to pull it with a peace of wire, sometimes this can of course be done but this isn't one of them unfortunately.
You will have to remove the air filter completely and unclip the hose from the plastic tray fastened over the gearbox, you will note the hose goes round a double bend in this tray, this is why the wire wont do it for you.
When you get the new on fitted at the reservoir end and ready to prime, clean the vent pipe on the lid of the reservoir or better still replace it with new, stuff rag round the pump to catch any spilt lhm, place the end of the new pipe close to where its to be fitted to the pump, then simply blow down the vent pipe on the reservoir, when lhm runs out of the new pipe quickly shove it on the pump and secure it, engine not running at this time of course.
Open the pressure release screw on the regulator and start the engine, blowing down the vent pipe again will help to quickly prime the pump.
After a few seconds close the release screw, wait, then open it again listening for the teltale hiss, a sure sign that the pump has primed and is doing its stuff.
Dave

Unread post by **alan s** » 22 Aug 2003, 02:45

FWIW,
Here's a type of hose I have to use out here in regional Australiaas my nearest dealer is a half days drive away.
It's used in Industry & marine and I've used it for LHM, ATF and engine oil. I understand it is used in diesel fishing boats as fuel line also. The only problem I can see with it is the outside diameter can be a problem but I have fitted 12.7 mm stuff on to 15mm fittings by heating & stretching. I've had really good long term results with it.
I understand it's a fairly universal material & posted this as a possible low cost alternative if necessary. This piece I think cost about A$4.50 from memory.
Alan S

Richard Gallagher · Unread post by **Richard Gallagher** » 22 Aug 2003, 04:23

I'm not wishing to depress you Foxy but the cost of this genuine Citroen hose is not £40 but £134!!!!!
I got around the problem but taking a section off of an LHM hose on an XM in the breakers which gave me the correct right-angle where the hose connects to the pump, then bought a plastic 'reducer' to marry up the different hose sizes.
The problem you have is that the inlet pipe to the pump is larger than the rest of the hose coming from the LHM tank, hence the reducer. Total cost, less than a fiver job done.
Also no need to 'feed' a pipe around the engine bay.
I wrote to Citroen at Slough about the price for the hose but they comfirmed the price as correct!

Fox · Unread post by **Fox** » 22 Aug 2003, 05:31

£134 for a pipe? What are the on? Some misguided mission to proove the Citroen-doubters right? This coupled with the £64 I was quoted by my dealer for an oil change reinforces that beleif!
Anyway, I'm not spending 130 quid on a bit of hose [:)]
What I want to do is get another bit of hose, cut this one and join the two bits together, which is pretty much what you've helpfully described

I'm assuming it worked fine for you and was still airtight etc? Where did you buy the joiner thing from, and what about the pipe?
Cheers for your help guys

blueboy2001 · Unread post by **blueboy2001** » 22 Aug 2003, 22:42

Fox - Go into your local tractor/agricultural machiery dealer stores and ask if they have/can order something similar. If they have an account with a company called Kramp UK (most Ag. dealers do) they have a catalogue the size of the yellow pages with hydraulic bits in. They may also be able to crimp a section on to the old hose for you. Unfortuately I haven't any contacts in your area that I could sound out about doing it for you.

Fox · Unread post by **Fox** » 23 Aug 2003, 01:22

Hi,
Picked up an entire replacement pipe from a 1.8 16v at a local breakers yard. Cost a fiver. Replaced old pipe with new pipe, topped up LHM, steering is now fine

Hurrah!
Citroen dealer cost: £134 + labour (Another £100?) = £260
DIY cost: £5 + £4 LHM = £9
[:)]