Xantia 1.9 vs. 2.1

KP · Unread post by KP » 11 Jul 2006, 22:44

Im not sure myself to be honest. Cant see it getting into the front of xantia that easily though as the 2.1 looks tight as it is..

Though i personally think the 2.1 could have a higher geared 5th or be better with a 6th gear for cruising on.

deian · Unread post by **deian** » 12 Jul 2006, 08:59

I feel the 1st gear on my xantia to be very short, maybe it helps when towing though.

Adstar · Unread post by **Adstar** » 12 Jul 2006, 13:04

The 2.1 engine is DESPERATE for a 6th gear. But I have not heard of any alternatives to the 5speed box they are selotaped to.

Do any of the desiel citreons with this engine have a 6speed box? I haven't come across any pugs that do. People keep suggesting the 306gti6 but we all know that wont work!

Kowalski · Unread post by **Kowalski** » 12 Jul 2006, 14:17

The 2.1 may well have been the same block as the 1.9 but the 2.5 almost certainly wasn't, its (2.5) bore is 92mm as opposed to the 2.1's bore of only 85mm and the bore of the 1.9 at 83mm

Judging by the bore of 86mm the 2.2 is probably the same block as the 2.0 HDI (which is very similar to the 1.9) but bored out very slightly and given a longer stroke crankshaft. The 2.2 has balance shafts in the sump, which none of the other diesels have...

KP · Unread post by KP » 12 Jul 2006, 15:51

Could you not just swap the internals over from one casing to another with the GTi6 box? not that i imagine they are cheap or easy to get hold of mind...

deian · Unread post by **deian** » 12 Jul 2006, 20:31

i wouldn't say it's DESPERATE for a 5th gear, it's nice to crush people on the motorway, a 6th gear would make it cheap to run on long journeys but maybe if you move all the gears up half a ratio the 1st gear wouldn't be so keen to blow the engine and the 5th gear would be more economical, those are my thoughts, or maybe it's possible to put a different final drive in the gerabox... such an easy task on the bmw's just swap the rear diffs to change the ratio between acceleration and top speed.

remember the gti6 box is a close ratio box, i would guess the 6th gear on that would be a tiny bit shorter than the 2.1's 5th gear, my cousin has a 306 rallye and he always complains that the 6th gear is still quite short, if it was indeed longer he would get better mpg, he barely gets 20mpg out of his rallye

still... imagine the gti6 box on the 2.1, lot of fun with that torque and turbo!!!

deian · Unread post by **deian** » 12 Jul 2006, 20:36

.... or Can't we just get the 7 speed SMG box from the new BMW M5! (and 2 reverse gears!) ??

Mandrake · Unread post by **Mandrake** » 12 Jul 2006, 21:08

deian wrote:I feel the 1st gear on my xantia to be very short, maybe it helps when towing though.

1st gear is really short on the 1.9TD as well... so much so that it hits the rev limit before you can really get any acceleration out of it

In terms of pressing you back in your seat you feel more acceleration in 2nd...

I'm guessing that its like that for towing as well.... it could certainly have had a lot higher first for normal driving....

Regards,
Simon

deian · Unread post by **deian** » 12 Jul 2006, 21:13

there's a rev limiter on it? if so what kind, a hard one, or a soft one?

is there one on mine too?

i loved the rev limiter on my e30 bmw 325iS... it was seriously awesome 6250rpm and a serious head pull on letting the clutch up in 2nd and 3rd, i wonder if the 2.1td is as hardy as the 2.5i i had on the bmw (engine was M20B25).

jeremy · Unread post by **jeremy** » 12 Jul 2006, 22:16

Do you mean BMW's headcracking diesel as fitted to Range Rovers? may be alright in a saloon but seems to be frightened of hard work in Range Rovers.

deian · Unread post by **deian** » 12 Jul 2006, 22:26

no mate, read above again... the 2.5i as featured in the e30 325i called M20B25, someone must know, from my personal experience it would not just die at all. it excelled on screaming agony at all times

Kowalski · Unread post by **Kowalski** » 12 Jul 2006, 22:32

deian wrote:i wonder if the 2.1td is as hardy as the 2.5i i had on the bmw (engine was M20B25).

Don't you mean you wonder whether the BMW engine is as hardy as the 2.1?? Try driving each after they've both done 250k miles and tell me which one feels like it did when it was new!

deian · Unread post by **deian** » 12 Jul 2006, 22:36

i'd say the bmw engine! i like the citroen engine, mines done 190k, but bmw engines are the dogs danglies too!

Mandrake · Unread post by **Mandrake** » 13 Jul 2006, 01:07

deian wrote:there's a rev limiter on it? if so what kind, a hard one, or a soft one?

is there one on mine too?

I said rev limit, not rev limiter!

Regards,
Simon

BonceChops · Unread post by **BonceChops** » 15 Jul 2006, 08:58

deian wrote:there's a rev limiter on it? if so what kind, a hard one, or a soft one?

All the diesels I have come accros have a rev limiter. On the mechanical pumps there is an adjuster for rev limit. I used to turn my down before the MOT to reduce its pain during the smoke test. On your 2.1 it will be electronically controlled like everything on those EPIC pumps.