diesel conversion

deian · Unread post by **deian** » 26 Mar 2006, 17:51

Just out of curiosity, is it possible to drop the 2.5td from the XM into the Xantia?

Thanks

AndersDK · Unread post by **AndersDK** » 26 Mar 2006, 18:10

Citroen on-line parts does not mention a Xantia 2.5TD.
Dont know if it ever existed.

I think it would be possible but not sure.

However it would be much more clever fitting the latest type 1.6 HDI lump. This engine both has more power and torque - at lower max rpm - impressive 1750rpm.

Its really hard to understand the massive improvement there has been on diesel engines over the last 10 years. Because its much simpler to control pollution on diesels.

The old saying "volume rules" is no more true if you compare old diesels to late diesels. And thats really hard to push into the backbone

deian · Unread post by **deian** » 26 Mar 2006, 20:11

don't get me wrong here anders, i'm not planning the conversion and i don't believe they made a 2.5 xantia either,

i was just curious as to whether it's possible to drop the 2.5 from the xm into a xantia, knowing full well it's a 2.5 with about 136bhp, and may be bigger and thirstier and heavier etc etc, just a fun question

i understand the 1.6hdi is better, but lets not assume someone wants to put such a modern engine in the xantia (yes i also know it has a 2.0hdi), my point is, it would be an interesting exercise to put the 2.5 in the xantia...

'old school idea for old school diesels', i.e same generation engine, same generation cars.

for example, take a bmw e30 (old 3 series), they come with a 2.5 12v 170bhp inline 6cyl engine, some of the owners might want to drop the 2.0 24v from the e36 or the even a newer 24v engine with more bhp, and then some might want to drop the 3.5 12v (210bhp) engine in it, indeed some have put a v12 in it and a 400bhp v8 from the m5.

but i do think the 1.6hdi is an impressive engine! it's like it goes against science.

jeremy · Unread post by **jeremy** » 26 Mar 2006, 23:35

I should imagine that the critical dimension is the length of the engine-gearbox unit. The XUD is quite a tight fit - so if the old 2.5 is longer then you're going to have a problem. It probably is longer as its bore is bigger at 93mm compared to the 1.9XUD's of 83mm. The next problem would be mounts and height - but with all those solved you might be in business.

NiSk · Unread post by **NiSk** » 28 Mar 2006, 13:33

If you take a look under the bonnet of an XM 2.5TD and compare it with an XM 2.1 TD12, you would never ask that question!
While the 2.1 is quite a tight fit, the 2.5 doesn't even give you a view of the road from above! If you drop a screw in the engine compartment of a 2.5, it's 99.99% certain never to reach the ground below (even with the sound tray removed).

Mind you, there are funny people who bend V6's into ZX's on this forum . . .

//NiSk

Homer · Unread post by **Homer** » 28 Mar 2006, 13:58

NiSk wrote:
Mind you, there are funny people who bend V6's into ZX's on this forum . . .

And there is that BX with an inline engine!

Unread post by **Peter.N.** » 28 Mar 2006, 16:14

I agree with NiSK. The main thing that put me off getting a 2.5 is that you cant see the ground anywhere from the top of the engine compartment. The 2.1 is difficult enough to work on and the XM is a bigger car. I would have thought the the 2.1 would go pretty well in the Xantia, if its a late one you can chip it, or even if its an earlier one you can wind the turbo pressure up a bit.

deian · Unread post by **deian** » 28 Mar 2006, 21:16

Chip it? Mine is a 98 2.1TD, it does go well yes, tell me more Peter.N., and turbo boost, any way to increase it? Are any of the procedures reversible? Some chip makes claim an increase in power and better mpg, at the expense of what? engine life, emission increase?

Unread post by **citroenxm** » 28 Mar 2006, 21:50

Hi All

Well why not put a HDI into an XM!!!

Its such a shame the XM had missed the HDI engines.. Thats one of my ambitions to be honest, when Xantia/306 HDI's become cheap, purchase an XM DERV, and a Xantia/306 or even a 406 HDI and transfer the harness/ecu etc etc over..

I've looked at it this way. 2.1td fitted to XM.. 2,1td fitted to Xantia. 2.0 HDI fitted to Xantia .. so why not 2.0 HDI fitted to XM.. Its still 110bhp as per 2.1td, so there should be a good gain in Consumption, as I beleve the XM has better consumption then the Xantia has...

Mmmmm now wheres that spanner ......

Regards
citroenxm

madmanbob · Unread post by **madmanbob** » 28 Mar 2006, 21:52

Of course the 2.1 was fitted to the xantia as standard, but then they went to the same power but more economical HDI 110. Of the 2 I find the HDI smoother and nicer to drive so why fit the older technology?

Unread post by **citroenxm** » 28 Mar 2006, 21:57

EXACTLY! Chuck the old technology away and fit latest........

Regards
citroenxm

deian · Unread post by **deian** » 28 Mar 2006, 22:03

I quite like my xantia 2.1td (better than my old pug 106 1.4d), of course i haven't had a go in a HDI yet, i think the XM was discontinued before the HDI came out.

Technically (scientifically), I don't think a 2.1td in an XM would be more economical than a 2.1td in a Xantia, you have the power to weight ratio against the XM, the engine has to work harder to keep it going. Unless the weight of the XM kept it going (momentum) therefore keeping the engine steady. At the end of the day I believe it depends a lot on the car's specifications and maintenance, and definately driving style.

Hands up who will put a HDI (the new 1.6 maybe) in an XM first?

Unread post by **citroenxm** » 28 Mar 2006, 22:13

ME!!

I intend to. I cant think of anything better to drive now. I've had three XM's, but an HDI one has to be....

There has been a debate about fuel consumption and size of engine in which car else were, either on this fourm or on the Club-xm fourm..

The other thing to consider, the 2.1td may be better in a Xantia, but being more powerfull and making it go better can also make it use more fuel.

Consider this. Peugeot made the 205 DERV... Citroen made the BX TD.
Peugeot then put the TD unit albiet without an intercooler. Result after a road test on the TD which I have somewhere.. an awfull 38mpg!! Consumption from the DERV 50mpg..
Power for the DERV, 64bhp. Power from the TD, 78bhp..
BX TD Consumption was about 44mpg. Maybee the intercooler helped that a bit..
So not always putting a more powerfull engine in a lighter body makes it do a better mpg.

My guess is that the car goes better and faster so the tow goes down further, TD's over 3000rpm can still be rather thirsty..

Something for you to argue over....

)

Regards
citroenxm

deian · Unread post by **deian** » 28 Mar 2006, 22:23

i've seen the power to weight ratio issue on the bmw forums too, at the end of the day many aspects can affect the outcome, so it's not worth arguing about. it happens on all car forums many times, good luck in your conversion though. keep us posted

f00lzz · Unread post by **f00lzz** » 30 Mar 2006, 18:58

deian wrote:I quite like my xantia 2.1td (better than my old pug 106 1.4d), of course i haven't had a go in a HDI yet, i think the XM was discontinued before the HDI came out.

Technically (scientifically), I don't think a 2.1td in an XM would be more economical than a 2.1td in a Xantia, you have the power to weight ratio against the XM, the engine has to work harder to keep it going. Unless the weight of the XM kept it going (momentum) therefore keeping the engine steady. At the end of the day I believe it depends a lot on the car's specifications and maintenance, and definately driving style.

Hands up who will put a HDI (the new 1.6 maybe) in an XM first?

Wouldn't the XM be a bit on the large/heavy side for a 1.6 and why a 1.6 when a 2.0 is available?

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