Engine Locking

davehughes · Unread post by **davehughes** » 06 Jan 2006, 19:47

There is a thread on here somewhere, that I can't find about what size bolts to use to lock the sprockets on a diesel engine. Can anyone help. It's a 93 Xantia 1.9 SX TD. I need to put one bolt in the camshaft sprocket, two in the fuel pump sprocket. I know I need an 8mm drill bit for the flywheel.

Cheers

Dave

sooty · Unread post by **sooty** » 06 Jan 2006, 19:55

You'll need 8mm bolts, but I can't remember the lengths. It might be better to get some threaded bar and nuts, and make up your own, then the surplus could be used to lock the flywheel as it not that easy with a drill bit. You'll have to remove the starter to do this with ease.

davehughes · Unread post by **davehughes** » 06 Jan 2006, 21:04

Thanks Sooty.

I thought you only had to remove the starter on an auto

Cheers

Dave

Gaskin · Unread post by **Gaskin** » 06 Jan 2006, 22:03

From recent experience (see thread on cambelt covers) I found it almost impossible to see how to remove the starter motor from my Xantia 1.9TD to get to the flywheel locking hole. I managed to get a bent piece of 8mm threaded steel rod into the hole from underneath the car. It is not easy to see the hole (to put it midly!) at the same time as getting the rod in. The hole is 8mm, but it is seems to collect corrosion/crud that reduces the diameter so I filed a taper onto the end to allow it to go in. I didn't get as far as locking the various pulleys, but according to the info mailed to me by 'zxTd' (the images have now gone from the above thread) you need 3x125mm 8mm bolts.
Good luck!

Cheers

Duncan

AndersDK · Unread post by **AndersDK** » 06 Jan 2006, 22:13

This one : http://www.frenchcarforum.co.uk/forum/v ... hp?t=17393
Thanks Duncan

BTW : Can you confirm the hole for locking the flywheel (under starter) is still to be found on later XU/XUD (Xantia facelift etc) engines ?
- as I thought you only had that rubber slipping (and moving) index hole option in the drive belt pulley

Dave Burns · Unread post by **Dave Burns** » 06 Jan 2006, 23:50

Hole is still there on XUD's Anders, the wappy rubber affair is only on the petrols I think.

The 8mm bolts to time the pulleys need to be 60mm long, where Duncan gets 125mm from I don't know, unless he's refering to the pitch, which on an M8 bolt is 1.25mm.

Dave

AndersDK · Unread post by **AndersDK** » 07 Jan 2006, 14:08

Thanks Dave -

Just wanted to have this info recorded for later forum searches.

citronut · Unread post by **citronut** » 07 Jan 2006, 14:24

and the pin to lock the flywheel is not 8mm,as all i use is a length of 3/16 copper brake pipe bent to the right shape to go up behind the starter
regards malcolm

Gaskin · Unread post by **Gaskin** » 07 Jan 2006, 19:03

Appologies for supplying duff info, I was merely passing on details of bolt lengths from an Autodata manual supplied to me. As I said I never got as far as using the bolts as I wimped out!
You can use a a thinner rod to lock the crankshaft to undo the bolt, but if you want to fix the crank at TDC surely you run the risk of allowing some movement with a thinner rod? This might put you 1 notch out on the cambelt maybe?
I'll happily defer to those with practical experience over this though.

Cheers

Duncan

Stewart(oily) · Unread post by **Stewart(oily)** » 07 Jan 2006, 19:13

It is not advisable to use the crank locking hole to hold the crank while undoing the pulley bolt, especially with anything thinner than 8mm, if you are struggling then I would suggest having an accomplice hold a large screwdriver or similar in the ring gear through the hole adjacent the starter, whillst you swing on the big bar. Removal of slack in the front run of the new belt is best accomplished by temporarily removing both locking bolts from the fuel pump and allowing the pump to turn slightly clockwise, move the belt on a tooth then with a spanner on the fuel pump pulley turn the pulley anti clockwise until the locking bolts can be replaced, you now have no slack in the front run, ALWAYS turn the engine over by hand 720 degrees and refit timing bolts to make doubly sure.
Stewart

davehughes · Unread post by **davehughes** » 07 Jan 2006, 21:06

I wimped out too. I was going to do the cambelt today but it was snowing and I don't have a garage at the mo, so it is going to my local Citroen expert, 'The Tin Snail Company' who will do the honours. They will do the waterpump too as a precaution, something I've had bitter experience with in the past when I repaired BMW's for a living (the bolts seize)

Unread post by **CitroJim** » 08 Jan 2006, 09:27

Gaskin wrote:From recent experience (see thread on cambelt covers) I found it almost impossible to see how to remove the starter motor from my Xantia 1.9TD to get to the flywheel locking hole.
Cheers

Duncan

My starter motor failed a few weeks ago. I found out how from pure necessity..

It's not easy. It looks it but it's not. To get at one of the allen bolts holding the starter it is necessary to remove the airbox and all trunking, unclip the hydraulic pipes on the plastic carrier mounted over the top of the gearbox, undo a couple of it's securing bolts (quite inaccessible) and then you can slide it over far enough to get at the bolts it hides. You need a very long allen key that will slide under the plastic carrier. It also helps to have 9 inch long fingers with 20 joints in them.

Dave Burns · Unread post by **Dave Burns** » 08 Jan 2006, 22:33

There's no chance of getting the timing a whole tooth out by using a thinner diameter locking pin, if like citronut you used a piece of 3/16 brake pipe which is about 5mm, you would have some 3mm of play between the hole and the pipe, that 3mm equates to a maximum error of only 1.7 degrees at the crankshaft, that 1.7 degrees is hardly going to throw things out much since the angular distance to the next tooth is over 17 degrees.

Given that the timing hole is around 100mm distance from the center of the crankshaft, one tooth out would misalign the hole in the flywheel by some 29mm.

I use an 8mm probe however and this is a must if you are changing the idler roller and want to get it back bang on.

Dave