Attempting a cam belt change

[smoker]

My 1998 306 (xud non-turbo) had its last belt 30k ago - before I got the car - and I'd like to change it, and all rollers/tensioners in the near future. I'm thinking of putting on a new water pump at the same time, just to be safe. I have a few questions I wonder if anyone can help me with:

- I understand that I need a deep socket for the top engine mount - is this right and what size is it?
- Does the crank pulley bolt have to be replaced?
- Is there a simple description of how the belt tentioner and rollers are removed/refitted/properly set - I've had a quick look and it's not obvious (it's dirty and hard to see).
- Is there anything else I should be aware of before starting? I need the car every day during the week so would need to complete the job over a weekend.

I've done belts on other cars I've had but never this one, and I don't have a Haynes for it. I reckon I can d it, but slightly nervous 1st time.

Many thanks

[spider]

16mm usually.

In theory although I've never replaced one on an XUD and done dozens of belts over the years.

The tensioner roller and idle roller are quite decently made and heavy duty not like newer stuff. You can change them if you wanted to. The only issue is holding the plunger in with the tensioner removed, its a plunger / spring affair. It can be done without the tool with some cursing.

Water pump is very sensible and should be done at the same time.

The only real problem you might find is a seized plunger although this is quite rare (when you push it into the body to release the tension) iirc I've had it twice in ten years. In theory a new engine mount is needed however you can remove / drill / free it off (my 205 was like that for about three years)

The tensioner / idler are only bolted on / nut / bolt / stud affair. A 3/8 ratchet / tiny extension will allow you to move the lever arm.

A timing pin kit will help greatly. To facilitate the crank pin, remove the starter bolts and push the starter aside (don't undo the wiring) it will move enough to get to the pin hole easily that way, the special tool does not actually always fit (it did not fit mine, and it was a real dealer tool) due to the pattern (slightly larger in body) starter motor a previous owner had fitted.

It is quite easy though generally, the belt is tensioned by the plunger spring. A cable tie will help keep it on as its a bit tight for space but other than that its OK.

Crank pulley bolt is very tight that may be difficult for you to undo.

I'll leave this for others comments in case I've missed anything but they are so straightforward there's not much to say really. Although obviously the first one is more 'tricky' than doing it again. To put it into perspective, I could do my 205 in an hour at the roadside. A 306 took me a bit longer due to the pipework in the way.

A haynes would help with pics though I think.

[smoker]

Many thanks Spider. Your write up is very helpful, and I've found a diagram in t'internet showing belt routing which is also useful. Wondering about doing the aux belt etc at the same time - just to know it's all done. Is there a preferred/cheapest decent supplier for these kits?

Thanks

[spider]

I use my local(ish) SDL Factors although not sure if there's one near you. I seem to recall they charged me about £110 or so a year ago for a timing belt and the two rollers. It is rare they need doing I only did mine as they were original (!) and 19 years old.

The aux belt is more tricky on some models than the timing belt given the aux tensioner arrangement, iirc there's about three different tensioning systems depending on year / with or without aircon etc.

[JohnD]

I did the belt on my daughter's 1998 306 a year or so ago. 1998 was the year when engines changed from XUD to DW8. Her's is the later one. On that, there's no crankshaft bolt to undo. The pulley is held by three 10mm(?) bolts, and also there's no auto-tensioner on the belt. From having done XUDs in previous BXs I don't recall needing a deep socket to undo top engine mounts. I do recall having some difficulty undoing the crank bolt. Do it when it's hot and have help at hand to prevent the engine turning.

I always think it's worth replacing the auxillary belt when doing the cambelt.

[spider]

Ah yes your's is the DW8 as you say, that has the bolts on the pulley outer, similar to the petrol TU units in that respect. The DW8 does not have a spring plunger tensioner though and the cam pulley is adjustable (although you are supposed to undo and retime it, a tech once said to try it 'as is' as if it was OK before and you have tensioned the belt 100% correct it will in 9/10 cases still be spot on)

[spider]

Just a quick follow up,

Did you change it at the weekend ?

[smoker]

Not yet! Last wekend was dedicated to replacing the front section of the exhaust which had fallen in half (separate thread - thanks for you help with that). Still have a couple of issues with doing the belts though.

First, are all kits equal in quality? There seem to be a number available (e.g. on ebay) but slightly concerned about buying duff stuff which could not last well, or worse fail in use.

Second, I'm still not sure about the timing belt tensioner arrangement. I've seen a separate post which suggests you release the tensioner then bolt it in place. This seems counter intuitive to me - I would have thought you bolt it in place then release it. Are you able to clarify at all?

Third was about replacing the crank pulley bolt.

Cheers

[JohnD]

There may be cheapo belts around but get a Gates or Dayco, and you'll have the best.
Although the tensioner is spring loaded, it's still locked with a pinch bolt. Undo the bolt, push back the tensioner and hold it with the bolt.
Although replacing the crank bolt is recommended, I've never done so.

[jgra1]

just to add quickly
yes change aux as it has to come off anyway..
my blog (not the one on here) has pics of the TD engine, plunger etc.. I will try and find the link later unless someone has it?
dont need a deep socket, normal one held half off the extension bar will do
reomve wheel, inner arch, etc at the beginning
before doing that use a long wrench and ?21?mm socket on the crank, turn engine over very briefly, and the crank bolt will loosen (make sure engine cant run eg disconnect fuel colenoind wire)

John

[spider]

I was looking for some pics for him the other day but surprisingly a google image search did not turn any up of interest. I was after a side-view of the engine with the cambelt covers removed so I could draw on it the tensioner bolt and explain the plunger etc in that it pushes the 'arm' on the tensioner roller and with that tensioner removed the plunger / spring will come out (a pain but not that bad)

[smoker]

OK - bits ordered. £107 for cam belt kit, water pump and aux belt. Did look at aux belt tensioners/rollers etc but seemed very expensive and since I'm not sure there's anything wrong with them, and since they are not catastrophic if they fail I'll skip for now. Had a good look at the weekend ahead of getting stuck in and it doesn't look easy. How does the aux bet come off (other than cutting it )? Assume I slacken a tensioner, but how?

Still a bit nervous about starting, but scheduled for a week wednesday now.

[CitroJim]

Did look at aux belt tensioners/rollers etc but seemed very expensive and since I'm not sure there's anything wrong with them, and since they are not catastrophic if they fail I'll skip for now.

Failure of the aux. belt tensioner can be VERY catastrophic. If the belt comes off the pulleys and sheds chances are it'll go through the cam covers and tangle with the cambelt.

Result can be a written-off engine...

That's expensive. Tensioners are cheaper. Much cheaper than that. The automatic one fails regularly and is best replaced, along with it's spring, as a safety precaution if nothing else.

[spider]

The pre-facelift 306D / TD was a lot easier as it had one giant "lollypop" tensioner and the belt was always 5750K0 (I think that's the correct number) that one would fit them all as long as it had power steering, very early models just had a conventional thin belt driving the alternator.

After face-lift they seemed to have a big variation of aux tensioning / aux belt arrangement even for models with the same features such as A/C , P/S etc. Strange that it got more difficult, although [off topic] at facelift time it was IDEAL time to fix the door loom by putting the connector on the A pillar (406 style) not on a length of wire[off topic] but they did not.

I would agree though it can have some nasty problems with broken aux belts, bits end up in the cam cover (and the sprockets may pick them up + lifting cambelt = expense!) or sometimes a tiny stripped 'string' of it can wrap itself around the crank pulley and work its way in (again not good)

[jgra1]

a few pics from my td