Xantia stuck in "LEAK" mode
Moderator: RichardW
- xantos
- Posts: 409
- Joined: 02 Apr 2013, 10:05
- Location: Slovenia
- My Cars: Xantia 1.9TD Break non-hydractive (1999)
Xantia 3.0 V6 Activa (1998)
C4 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mk2 (2010) - x 10
Xantia stuck in "LEAK" mode
Forget my problem of Xantia being stuck in hard mode...
Now it seem that rubber pipes decided they won't cooperate with the hydraulic system and are failing one after another. It's jolly nice when you get stranded on the side of the road with a green puddle under the car. Looks like you just slaughtered a "Predator". Lost 4L of LHM in the past month and will be bankrupt it that continues...
I decided to change all of the return rubber pipes in the system. Now which pipes do I choose? Searching through forum I found that it must be either silicone, for gasoline or hydraulic (like on bulldozer). Other question is how much heat resistant must the pipes be? Is 100°C enough or should it be 200°C? Maybe any other suggestions for which pipe to use...
Does anybody maybe have a detailed sketch of the rubber pipes with diameters?
Now it seem that rubber pipes decided they won't cooperate with the hydraulic system and are failing one after another. It's jolly nice when you get stranded on the side of the road with a green puddle under the car. Looks like you just slaughtered a "Predator". Lost 4L of LHM in the past month and will be bankrupt it that continues...
I decided to change all of the return rubber pipes in the system. Now which pipes do I choose? Searching through forum I found that it must be either silicone, for gasoline or hydraulic (like on bulldozer). Other question is how much heat resistant must the pipes be? Is 100°C enough or should it be 200°C? Maybe any other suggestions for which pipe to use...
Does anybody maybe have a detailed sketch of the rubber pipes with diameters?
Xantia Break 1.9TD (jammed b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
-
- Moderating Team
- Posts: 11577
- Joined: 02 Apr 2005, 16:11
- Location: Charmouth,Dorset
- My Cars: Currently:
C5 X7 VTR + Satnav Hdi estate Silver
C5 X7 VTR + Hdi Estate 2008 Red
In the past: 3, CX td Safaris and about 7, XM td estates. Lovely cars. - x 1206
Re: Xantia stuck in "LEAK" mode
If you are loosing LHM in any great quantity I would suggest you have a leaky strut seal.
Peter
Peter
- Old-Guy
- Posts: 1798
- Joined: 11 Sep 2008, 12:08
- Location: Gloucestershire
- My Cars: 2011 Grand C4 Picasso VTR+ 1.6HDi in Kyanos Blue
1995 Xantia Estate SX 1.9TD in Vert Vega "The Green Lady" - now owned by XanTom
1998 Xantia 2.1 VXD Estate in Mauritius Blue - R.I.P. (terminal tin-worm) - x 17
Re: Xantia stuck in "LEAK" mode
You have my sympathy, last year the Green Lady suffered a series of LHM leaks; doseur return pipe split, pressure unions on both the pinion valve and the ABS block decided to leak. The first was a bit of a pig to do, the last two needed less than half a turn to tighten when I'd identified which union it was that was producing the fine mist of LHM!
Fuel pipe is just fine - IIRC, for the doseur repair, I used what was left over from the 'universal' injector leak-off kit plus a plastic right-angle joiner. Fuel hose is LHM proof, for return pipes, you don't need or want reinforced pressure pipe as it's too thick and stiff. Along with the (2½L) cans of LHM, coolant and screen wash, and roll of 'Plenty' kitchen roll (it's as good as the idiot in the TV advert claims ), my emergency kit in a plastic bin in the boot now includes a metre or so of various sizes of clear plastic pipe for temporary fuel line and LHM return repairs. Note to self: must get a selection of plastic joiners.
Fuel pipe is just fine - IIRC, for the doseur repair, I used what was left over from the 'universal' injector leak-off kit plus a plastic right-angle joiner. Fuel hose is LHM proof, for return pipes, you don't need or want reinforced pressure pipe as it's too thick and stiff. Along with the (2½L) cans of LHM, coolant and screen wash, and roll of 'Plenty' kitchen roll (it's as good as the idiot in the TV advert claims ), my emergency kit in a plastic bin in the boot now includes a metre or so of various sizes of clear plastic pipe for temporary fuel line and LHM return repairs. Note to self: must get a selection of plastic joiners.
2011 Grand C4 Picasso VTR+ 1.6HDi in Kyanos Blue
1995 Xantia Estate SX 1.9TD in Vert Vega "The Green Lady" - after 11 years now owned by XanTom
1998 Xantia 2.1 VXD Estate in Mauritius Blue - R.I.P. (terminal tin-worm)
1995 Xantia Estate SX 1.9TD in Vert Vega "The Green Lady" - after 11 years now owned by XanTom
1998 Xantia 2.1 VXD Estate in Mauritius Blue - R.I.P. (terminal tin-worm)
- xantos
- Posts: 409
- Joined: 02 Apr 2013, 10:05
- Location: Slovenia
- My Cars: Xantia 1.9TD Break non-hydractive (1999)
Xantia 3.0 V6 Activa (1998)
C4 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mk2 (2010) - x 10
Re: Xantia stuck in "LEAK" mode
Thinking of buying transparent silicone pipes for easy diagnosis of hydraulic problems...
Xantia Break 1.9TD (jammed b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
- xantos
- Posts: 409
- Joined: 02 Apr 2013, 10:05
- Location: Slovenia
- My Cars: Xantia 1.9TD Break non-hydractive (1999)
Xantia 3.0 V6 Activa (1998)
C4 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mk2 (2010) - x 10
Re: Xantia stuck in "LEAK" mode
Managed to get the car home after repairing the return pipe from the pressure regulator with some garden hose. Totally lost about 3L of LHM
Noticed that there is very high flow of LHM in the return pipe (from the pressure regulator). When started the car LHM was pouring out of the leak (at least 1L/min). Is that normal?
Noticed that there is very high flow of LHM in the return pipe (from the pressure regulator). When started the car LHM was pouring out of the leak (at least 1L/min). Is that normal?
Xantia Break 1.9TD (jammed b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
Re: Xantia stuck in "LEAK" mode
Sorry to hear about your problems, its no fun having to deal with an LHM leak.xantos wrote:Managed to get the car home after repairing the return pipe from the pressure regulator with some garden hose. Totally lost about 3L of LHM
Yes thats normal. The pump is pumping all the time whether any pressure top up is required or not. When the system pressure reaches the cut-out pressure of 170 bars the the oil flow from the pump to the pressure regulator is diverted straight back to the tank, so it recirculates in a loop.Noticed that there is very high flow of LHM in the return pipe (from the pressure regulator). When started the car LHM was pouring out of the leak (at least 1L/min). Is that normal?
Think of it just like a return loop fuel pump system where any excess fuel delivery returns through the pressure regulator back to the tank - the pump is always pumping at the same volume whether fuel is needed or not.
Also you have the return flow from the power steering rack which joins the pressure regulator return at a T junction before reaching the tank - if you have a leak on the pressure regulator return hose you'll probably get backfeeding from the power steering return as well since it will take the "easier" downhill path.
Simon
1997 Xantia S1 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive in Silex Grey
2016 Nissan Leaf Tekna 30kWh in White
2011 Peugeot Ion Full Electric in Silver
1977 G Special 1129cc LHD
1978 CX 2400
1997 Xantia S1 2.0i Auto VSX
1998 Xantia S2 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive
1997 Xantia S1 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive in Silex Grey
2016 Nissan Leaf Tekna 30kWh in White
2011 Peugeot Ion Full Electric in Silver
1977 G Special 1129cc LHD
1978 CX 2400
1997 Xantia S1 2.0i Auto VSX
1998 Xantia S2 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive
- xantos
- Posts: 409
- Joined: 02 Apr 2013, 10:05
- Location: Slovenia
- My Cars: Xantia 1.9TD Break non-hydractive (1999)
Xantia 3.0 V6 Activa (1998)
C4 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mk2 (2010) - x 10
Re: Xantia stuck in "LEAK" mode
Managed to reseal the pump, not yet tested. Must first change the return rubber pipes and the inlet pipe to the pump.
Used one bit thicker o-ring (I think original is 44x2,5 and I installed 44x3,5), other were to spec. Material is viton, hopefully it will not be eaten (as far as I know it should be mineral oil resistant).
It's quite an easy job and cheap job. I got the o-rings for 15eur. Hopefully that will help get rid of the harsh ride...
Also took the LHM tank out, so I can change the rubber pipes. I noticed something, that might be related to internal electrovalve leak... I depressurised the car so I could unplug the "octopus". Return pipe from the pressure regulator was dripping a bit (just a few drops per minute, think that is normal). But when I opened the drivers doors the electrovalves kicked in and the flow increased a lot! After 30 seconds the valves went off and the flow stopped. Sign of a leaky electrovalve? (I pray to all the Citroen gods it can be repaired as described in another post )
Hopefully the car be back on the road next week and that it won't let me down for at least a year... Since I bought it (6 months ago) I was stranded beside of the road for 4 times now
Used one bit thicker o-ring (I think original is 44x2,5 and I installed 44x3,5), other were to spec. Material is viton, hopefully it will not be eaten (as far as I know it should be mineral oil resistant).
It's quite an easy job and cheap job. I got the o-rings for 15eur. Hopefully that will help get rid of the harsh ride...
Also took the LHM tank out, so I can change the rubber pipes. I noticed something, that might be related to internal electrovalve leak... I depressurised the car so I could unplug the "octopus". Return pipe from the pressure regulator was dripping a bit (just a few drops per minute, think that is normal). But when I opened the drivers doors the electrovalves kicked in and the flow increased a lot! After 30 seconds the valves went off and the flow stopped. Sign of a leaky electrovalve? (I pray to all the Citroen gods it can be repaired as described in another post )
Hopefully the car be back on the road next week and that it won't let me down for at least a year... Since I bought it (6 months ago) I was stranded beside of the road for 4 times now
Xantia Break 1.9TD (jammed b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
- xantos
- Posts: 409
- Joined: 02 Apr 2013, 10:05
- Location: Slovenia
- My Cars: Xantia 1.9TD Break non-hydractive (1999)
Xantia 3.0 V6 Activa (1998)
C4 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mk2 (2010) - x 10
Re: Xantia stuck in "LEAK" mode
Is there any difference between this octopus (on the picture non-hydractive) and an activa or hydractiva?
I see that it is missing one return line from the electrovalve (should be T-joined on the regulator return pipe)... It has also different diametres from the pump to the LHM tank (mine is 10mm pump and 12,5mm LHM tank). Others are right?
It would be really helpful to have s a sketch like this and making your own homemade octopus would be easy
I see that it is missing one return line from the electrovalve (should be T-joined on the regulator return pipe)... It has also different diametres from the pump to the LHM tank (mine is 10mm pump and 12,5mm LHM tank). Others are right?
It would be really helpful to have s a sketch like this and making your own homemade octopus would be easy
Xantia Break 1.9TD (jammed b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
- xantos
- Posts: 409
- Joined: 02 Apr 2013, 10:05
- Location: Slovenia
- My Cars: Xantia 1.9TD Break non-hydractive (1999)
Xantia 3.0 V6 Activa (1998)
C4 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mk2 (2010) - x 10
Re: Xantia stuck in "LEAK" mode
And...
It's leaking again... This time it's the brake dosser valve. Already took it apart and cleaned it. Just waiting for new seals and new (used) carpet.
It never ends...
It's leaking again... This time it's the brake dosser valve. Already took it apart and cleaned it. Just waiting for new seals and new (used) carpet.
It never ends...
Xantia Break 1.9TD (jammed b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
- xantos
- Posts: 409
- Joined: 02 Apr 2013, 10:05
- Location: Slovenia
- My Cars: Xantia 1.9TD Break non-hydractive (1999)
Xantia 3.0 V6 Activa (1998)
C4 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mk2 (2010) - x 10
Re: Xantia stuck in "LEAK" mode
The Elf Master of Leaking has struck again! This time it was the return pipe from the steering rack. 3 hours of frustrating job getting the spare pipe on the spigot. At the end I decided to bend the spigot a little bit and managed to put the pipe on. Yipikaye!
Xantia Break 1.9TD (jammed b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
Re: Xantia stuck in "LEAK" mode
Any change in the ride after fixing that leak ? I've theorised before that the power steering return line is one possible place where an air leak could occur to cause a lot of air bubbles to return to the tank. It certainly has the greatest flow of any return line.
Simon
1997 Xantia S1 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive in Silex Grey
2016 Nissan Leaf Tekna 30kWh in White
2011 Peugeot Ion Full Electric in Silver
1977 G Special 1129cc LHD
1978 CX 2400
1997 Xantia S1 2.0i Auto VSX
1998 Xantia S2 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive
1997 Xantia S1 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive in Silex Grey
2016 Nissan Leaf Tekna 30kWh in White
2011 Peugeot Ion Full Electric in Silver
1977 G Special 1129cc LHD
1978 CX 2400
1997 Xantia S1 2.0i Auto VSX
1998 Xantia S2 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive
- xantos
- Posts: 409
- Joined: 02 Apr 2013, 10:05
- Location: Slovenia
- My Cars: Xantia 1.9TD Break non-hydractive (1999)
Xantia 3.0 V6 Activa (1998)
C4 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mk2 (2010) - x 10
Re: Xantia stuck in "LEAK" mode
After the change did a session of citaerobics, but there were still some bubbles in the LHM tank. There wasn't any visible leak from the pipe before, it just suddenly burst. The ride was maybe a bit better but I just couldn't exactly tell because I drove just about 5km and the parked it at home as I was just feed up! I am still waiting to do the timing belt replacement and head valves seals replacement. Then I will also try to reseal the suction pipe at the LHM tank and pump. I was thinking that maybe when a resealed the pump one o-ring was a bit thick (it should be 36x2,5mm and I used 36x3,5mm because I didn't get the proper one) and maybe that one is not sealing properly. Will also remove it and seal it with silicone paste.
Xantia Break 1.9TD (jammed b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
- demag
- (Donor 2016)
- Posts: 1441
- Joined: 18 Oct 2004, 05:03
- Location: Black Country, aye it ar kid.
- My Cars: "H" Citroen Bx Tgs Automatic.
2006 Toyota Prius T4 Gen 2. - x 102
Re: Xantia stuck in "LEAK" mode
Are you sure your accumulator sphere has not gone flat? Under normal use it acts as a shock absorber for the whole system including the regulator cutting in and out, brake use, all the individual suspension movements, electro valves etc etc. When the accumulator sphere is flat all this shock loading has to be absorbed through the system and rubber return pipes are the first to fail. Guess how I know this doh!
Sent from my HUAWEI P6-U06 using Tapatalk
Sent from my HUAWEI P6-U06 using Tapatalk
Dave
2011 Peugeot 3008 1.6hdi Exclusive EGS.
'04 C5 auto estate 2.2 hdi. Gone.
Bx 1.6 TGS Auto 50k A rare beast by all accounts. A bit tired but getting better by the day. Gone.
'96 XM 2.5TD VSX.......Sadly sold. What an idiot! I should have held on to that.
2011 Peugeot 3008 1.6hdi Exclusive EGS.
'04 C5 auto estate 2.2 hdi. Gone.
Bx 1.6 TGS Auto 50k A rare beast by all accounts. A bit tired but getting better by the day. Gone.
'96 XM 2.5TD VSX.......Sadly sold. What an idiot! I should have held on to that.
- xantos
- Posts: 409
- Joined: 02 Apr 2013, 10:05
- Location: Slovenia
- My Cars: Xantia 1.9TD Break non-hydractive (1999)
Xantia 3.0 V6 Activa (1998)
C4 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mk2 (2010) - x 10
Re: Xantia stuck in "LEAK" mode
My accumulator sphere is new, changed it about 3 weeks ago. The old one was flat and maybe you are right that it was the shock making pipes weak...
Well today I was riding with my Xantia and guess what... The ride was a lot better! But still there are bubbles in the tank. Tomorrow I'm starting with timing belt replacement and will reseal the pump and suction pipe. Report follows.
Happy new year I wish to all and not to many LHM leaking
Well today I was riding with my Xantia and guess what... The ride was a lot better! But still there are bubbles in the tank. Tomorrow I'm starting with timing belt replacement and will reseal the pump and suction pipe. Report follows.
Happy new year I wish to all and not to many LHM leaking
Xantia Break 1.9TD (jammed b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT + LPG (1998) (peeing b****!) RIP
Xantia Activa 2.0 TCT (1998) (burnt b****!)
Xantia Activa 3.0 V6 (1998) (not a b****! yet )
C4 Exclusive 2.0 HDi (gear shifting b****!)