Double hydraulic stops

[GiveMeABreak]

No I hate the new system with a vengeance too. Used several of them in courtesy cars and they are a total disaster. Ridiculous steering wheel buttons that are unintuitive, terrible menu system, no logic to the control displays, impossible to get what you want working. I vowed never to buy a vehicle fitted with anything like that system.

[DS9]

I did read your reply but never responded at the time, thanks.

Just a quick update. I took the car in for a service and they had a bit of uncertainty when the bump stops would arrive. They ended up doing the service/ bumpstop replacement while it was in, good that I didnt need to take it in twice. Got a nice surprise with the service cost + brake fluid change, they knocked it down a bit more to £343 which I think for London is very reasonable. Start/ stop started working again, and I can't really detect much difference on the rear suspension so far but haven't driven it much.

While it was in I had an E-C4 courtesy car C series, about £35k list. At first I wasn't planning to drive it much at all but because I had it for 2 weeks ended up driving about 60 miles in it, mainly 20mph roads around me with a bit of 30mph/ 40mph mixed in. I liked the instant torque off the line and chuckability when driving around town, what i didn't like was the infotainment and whirring/ whining from the electrical setup.

The ride comfort was the big thing i wanted to compare with mine and as said before, the road noise was worse but the suspension compliance better than mine. I wasn't getting a knocking sound over bumps in the e-C4. One thing I did notice with it though over time is the ride at the rear was inferior to the front probably because of the torsion beam setup.

When i picked the car up the dealer said he'd call me in a few days to see if the rear had improved, and I knew this was unlikely and never happened. I'm on holiday shortly for 2 weeks and will pursue once I get back, probably by going back to Jules Tilstone.

In all honesty if I could get my DS9 ride to match that of the E-C4 courtesy car I'd be more than happy.

[DS9]

Hi

Just wondered if the DS9 servicebox was showing anything new in terms of known faults? I'm still no closer with my suspension issues and after the service I never got the promised call back.

By the way GMAB (or anyone else) what's your view on the C5 Aircross PHEV Max? RRP just under £38k new in white (free colour), but £23k and a bit to buy new. Quite a discount. I expect with the new 136hp very mild hybrid being the version of choice this falls by the wayside a bit..... that said I can't get that version for anywhere near this price.

I'm thinking Pro's:
Great value.
The same 180hp 1.6l + battery = 225hp of the DS9 PHEV which I have driven and liked. I have the 1.6l 225 ICE now in my car and like that too.
Great ride comfort and refinement.
SUV more practical.

Con's:
Wallowy ride which may induce travel sickness in my daughter. Mitigating this I am a careful driver and I have read reviews and people say it isnt a problem.
One or two on forums complain about jerkiness in the transmission that dealers seem unwilling to recify. Seems like the parking brake might be mistakenly activating?
I haven't got any home charging, but would probably only need to charge every 1-3 months.
Rear legroom looks tight especially vs the DS9. That said the people who sit there are 4ft 10 in and 5ft 2 in, so probably not a problem.

[GiveMeABreak]

No change and no info relating technical bulletins on the stops...

Re the C5 AC Hybrid, I've just had one for a day whilst having my MOT done and verdict: I liked it a lot. The model I had was leather heated seats, panoramic roof and EAT8 8 speed Auto. Very smooth ride, very quiet engine, suspension as great as all the C5 Aircrosses are - no wallow, but soaks up the terrible uneven bumpy no tarmac full of pot holes Welsh roads.

Only noticed the electric mode kicking in in the car supermarket parks at low speed - as soon as there was any acceleration petrol kicked in.

If I was replacing my C3 Aircross in the future, I'd certainly be considering one of these - and moreso if you can get the Euro 6.4 petrol - specifically the EB2LTDH2 engine) this will have a timing chain as opposed to the wet belt timing system on the other EB2 engines.

[DS9]

Hi

Many thanks for that. I'm not surprised with the volumes that the servicebox has not changed but worth asking.

Good to hear a first hand recent experience, im not sure what AC stands for but I presume you had the new 136hp mild hybrid, and the pan sunroof makes me think it was a C series version. I'd like the pan sunroof option myself (it'd make it an easy sell to the missus) but it seems unlikely I'd be able to get one for the money I'm looking at, and also they have been dropped now from the configurator, it's just PLUS and MAX now.

Ironically the cheapest version of all I can get at the moment (no miles, 25 reg) is the most expensive in the configurator.

Like i said I've driven the DS9 PHEV AT8 which I presume has the same setup, and I liked it a lot. As for ride I'm wondering....you say your version had a great ride but with what I expect are the same dampers and 300kg or so of batteries (I think kerb weight is 1739kg) I do wonder if this would make the car more wallowy? Do you think there would be any factory adjustments to firm up the springs? I think these are just the KYB's we've mentioned in the past? and I only remember 2 model numbers for front and rears.

Good call on the wet belt, it seems universally despised across forums. I had no idea they had changed it...... albeit I'm not surprised.

[GiveMeABreak]

AC - Aircross

[DS9]

Oh dear How silly of me.

Just been looking again at the online configurator and something seems slightly amiss in the specs. Choosing the same diesel engine for both PLUS and MAX results in a price gap of £4,640 (£32,055-£27,415), quite a lot. What do you get for this premium?.....well, from what I can establish.....

Roof bars
Bitone roof
Front fog lights
electric driver seat (excl lumbar)
ACC
Blindspot monitoring (and perhaps a few other similar safety gizmos?)
Heated folding door mirrors with kerb puddle light
Slightly nicer alloys
Upgraded seats to fake leather/ alcantara.

Is there really close on 5 grands worth of additions there? doesn't look like it to me. Adding them all up maybe £3k is more realistic?

I looked because when I first came across the MAX spec I expect top of the range, a bit like the old "Shine Plus", in its place the PLUS version feels very much to be the "shine" mid spec, and MAX some halfway house between this and top spec. Kinda irrelevant to me but I did expect max to have a bit more about it.

[GiveMeABreak]

You missed out the other differences - namely:

Ambient lighting

Intelligent Beam Headlights (uses camera mounted in windscreen to switch automatically between dipped and main beam headlights)

Highway Driver Assist, featuring Adaptive Cruise Control with Stop & Go and Active Lane Keeping Assist - actively maintains position in lane relative to traffic ahead and lane markings. Driver retains control of car and must keep hands on steering wheel at all times.

So the 'Max' has radar units in addition to cameras for level 2 drive assist functions.

There are probably some other subtle minor changes throughout the specs - but the additional hardware and different ECUs no doubt cost more.

[DS9]

Thanks for that GMAB. I suppose there is a fair bit more than listed.

However, I have found out vs the car's I am looking at it's probably incorrect. I forgot that RRPs give an indication to the cars age. I knew I was onto something when I saw the MAX versions had a roof in the body colour rather than black (something I prefer to be honest)

At the moment the configurator has the car at £37,425. The 2 unregistered cars listed on Autotrader ive been looking at have RRP's of £36,000 and £35,880.

Then I do know from finding old brochures that the P11d price from January 2023 was £35,880 for a shine version (This is when they had sense plus/ shine/ C series), and in April 2024 £36,440 (This is when they had PLUS, MAX, E series). I can't find brochures for prices between these dates.

So what I'm guessing is:
1) They changed specs from sense plus/ shine etc to PLUS/ MAX sometime later in 2023 and didnt change the prices.
2) Then they changed the price again.

Gut feeling would be the £36,000 RRP one is about a year old or so (probably Q1 2024, maybe Q4 2023 at a push), the £35,880 one perhaps 6-12 months older than that

[GiveMeABreak]

Bear in mind that specifications for trim levels change within the years, with some features going and some being added and some become optional chargeable extras or part of an option pack. So you can't really go on year or registration, but need the actual factory build date and compare that to the actual brochure of the same date.

It's just what they do.. A small example was that my Aircross 'Flair' spec was supposed to include the cup holders in the rear passenger armrest - but that is mussing - being covered over with cloth and another small niggle like the passenger glovebox light missing that is also supposed to be there. Also, the driver's ceiling grab handle is missing.

They did all this to penny pinch and save some costs!

[DS9]

Thanks for that info, I'll bear it in mind.

Just been looking again, the prices are tempting me. The cheapest brand new MAX 1.2 C3 aircross is only £2k cheaper!

[GiveMeABreak]

I can't recommend the C3 Aircross suspension unless you wait for the new model 5 or 7 seater (these are not available yet) which will be fitted with the Progressive Hydraulic Cushions found on the C5 Aircross. Previous C3 Aircross models are not fitted with these and you can tell!

[DS9]

The existing C3 is on the small side for our needs, kinda like our previous fiat 500x albeit more space efficient. I'd like something a bit bigger, and also with comfort suspension. The new C3 Aircross looks good at 4433mm long but is likely at launch to be priced at circa RRP so will probably be more expensive than what I'm looking at with the C5.

I am getting a bit of deja vu. When we got the Fiat 500x in 2017 it was essentially the unloved and priciest version in the range, 2.0l diesel 4wd. Due to lack of demand they sat and then were discounted heavily. I got mine at motorpoint 8 months old, 11 miles on the clock for £13,250, that was against an RRP of £27k at the time. Sold it 6 yrs later for £10,250 with 19k miles on it. About as good as it gets.

Same seems to be occuring here with the C5 aircross, with all the focus now on the 136 hybrid (and deservedly so reading the reviews) thats the one in demand and i can get a top of the range unloved version which lists far higher cheaper. I've just had a look at all C5 aircrosses on autotrader, all versions, automatic, 2019 on, less than 30k miles and they are start around £15k, Hybrids about £16k. So if I bought one for 5/6 yrs I might come out of it with not much more than £1k per year depreciation. As an accountant, a tempting proposition.

I've read a fair few reviews, especially the long term tests where it seems to grow on people, and it appears supremely comfortable and well liked in the right hands. I dont care about sporting prowess, I care more about a smooth drive.

Now i need to try and sell the idea to the missus. Wish me luck!

[GiveMeABreak]

Hah! Best of luck with Mrs Accountant!

The Earlier C5 Aircross did have issues with water leaks at the windscreen passenger corner (a bad ill-fitting exterior weather seal on the A pillar corner and others with sunroof leakages. But apart from that, just the usual 1.2 wetbelt issues, so keep an eye on that if going for 1.2 petrol engined version. 1.6 Petrols have chains not belts.

[DS9]

Good guess, she's one too.

Thanks for the tips. I was just reading a parkers long term review on a 1.2l 130 manual. Main bugbear in the conclusion seems to be they didnt think the 130hp was quite enough.

I'm sure 225hp will be. If it's going to happen thats the one i'll get...... can't justify the extra price of the 1.2l.