P1210 fuel pressure regulator fault

[darbuck]

Ok so I changed out 3 and 4 and she wouldn't start and yes I did code them in.i then coded in a different injector into 1 because that injector seems to have been slightly faster leak off than 2. It still won't start it ran for a couple of seconds and then cut out. I don't think I have any good injectors at this point.

Edit I think I am going to have to buy a set of refurbished ones

[darbuck]

I'm going to move this to my other thread on injectors misbehaving

[Rhothgar]

Yeah. It doesn’t look ideal but mine leak 50ml but they are all equal.

[darbuck]

50ml is a bit high but consistency I think is more important.

[Rhothgar]

Correct. Consistency is important. I’ve often wonder if my poor fuel efficiency is largely down to leaks. Mine doesn’t seem to smoke much at all but I guess it wouldn’t take much fuel loss to drop from 52 - 43 mpg

[darbuck]

Yes it could easily be or it could be a slightly binding caliper

[Rhothgar]

In fact, just worked it out. It would work out at just under 6 teaspoons per kilometre or around 10 per mile.

Calipers are all good. I’ve seen what a binding caliper does on the Smart!

[darbuck]

Try a bit dipethane it can help with fuel economy

[KennyW]

Darren,

Do you have a diesel specialist near to you who could refurbish your original injectors ?

As you know they are coded to the car and any other 2nd Injectors to you have no knowledge of there past use.

Kenny

Just read your post about the injectors

[darbuck]

Yes there's one in portlaoise, they are expensive 170 each but I have had enough of guessing. I'm going to take the plunge and get them refurbished. I think it is my only option at this stage. It could be a while though the heat pump has given up the ghost after only 6 years. So I need to get an alternative at short notice. If it doesn't rain it pours.

[Rhothgar]

You probably won't end up paying 170 Euros a piece because they usually charge about £70 (over here) to test and if you only have one or two that is out of specification then they will only rebuild those I'd have thought. Still a substantial cost though.

So I spoke with my mate last night about your car and he kept asking me what the current symptoms were. I said I’d found it hard to really tie down what your symptoms were.

In summary, I came to the conclusion that the car is producing a lot of white smoke and that you felt it was only running on two cylinders.

He asked why you had changed the turbo but I could not give him the reason.

One low tech test to perform to confirm relative compression is to disconnect all the connectors to the injectors and turn the engine over (obviously with a well charged battery). It should sound smooth and with a regular cadence. If it is wavering or surging that it would indicate low compression on a bad cylinder. That is a really good point. I suppose the effect would become more exaggerated if more than more cylinder has poor compression.

He hypothesised about cylinder washing and other things.

One simple point he made was are you sure all the ignition electrical connectors are on their respective correct injectors? Again, a great point and one I don’t believe any of us has considered.

I said I was unsure if the wiring loom would allow that one the injectors and then recalled you had a managed to get the other connectors mixed up last year so definitely worth a proper check though I am not sure how you check this. I think the wire colours are all the same on my RHZ.

He also went through injection flow correction at great length and I cannot even begin to fully explain that but basically it reminded me of something. Certainly in Lexia and I am sure in Diagbox it will give you the correct reference values you should be seeing. It’s really hard to find in Lexia and I have no idea about Diagbox.

Basically there is a base reference value of 6mg/stroke on your car and the correction value adjusts the time element so that if one cylinder takes longer to rotate then it tries to adjust the length of opening or decrease it as the case may be to create a greater or lesser combustion to bring the engine to a stable and smooth rotation across all four cylinders.

See if you can find the values in Diagbox.

[darbuck]

Thanks for the info Roger. A lot of good info it's not possible to mix up the injectors. There's not enough cable. The turbo was changed because I was getting a mixture of blue and white smoke and I pulled it and discovered a lot of play and considerable oil in the compressor side of the turbo.
Symptoms were rough idle and white smoke after the turbo was changed. As you know I had a couple of bad injectors from the leak off. I changed the injectors that were leaking off the
With the replacement injectors in she won''t start she turns over but no start. She sounds like she is trying to start so it feels like a fueling issue given it would run with the other injectors I know it's fuel system and I don't trust any of the injectors.
I will get more data for you and do some more investigation to give you a clearer picture. Sorry I haven't been clearer. I mixed up the other two because they were practically identical. Its 170 each for a refurbished unit.
I think I need 4 but I will see what he says when I give them to him.My boroscope is too wide to fit through the injector portsso I can't check for cylinder wash damage. I'm praying it's not at this stage. I have changed the oil a few times recently because I was afraid of the injectors thinning it out

[darbuck]

Just one other point these are Delphi piezo injectors not solenoid. The piezo crystals expand and retract in response to voltage/current which moves the needle as requested by the ECU. it's more complicated but that's my basic understanding of it.
The crystals are prone to failure though I don't think this is the issue. I think it is a mechanical issue with the injectors.

[darbuck]

Interesting video on piezo injectors

[Rhothgar]

Interesting video on piezo injectors

My mate is good mates with Frank Massey! He went on some of his diagnostic courses some years ago now. Small world.

One salient point from the video is that Frank does say it would throw a DTC and it is accurate.

Either way, you can check your injectors easily with a multimeter.

Thanks for sharing that. I know little about injectors other than what I have written. I am not sure if they are piezo in the Xantia HDi but it is something I'll look into. Maybe today if I get time and I'll also scope mine too for fun...