Goodbye 1.8 16V Xantia, hello 1.9TD! And a list of problems!

Unread post by **Dommo** » 07 Mar 2012, 17:48

Re the windows, there's a switch to turn off the rear electric windows, to the right of the steering wheel, it's a big X with two arrows on, one pointing up one pointing down. Try pressing that.

Stepto1 · Unread post by **Stepto1** » 07 Mar 2012, 23:58

Right, the garage couldn't find a fuel leak but did find an LHM leak from the drivers side end of the power steering rack.

Is this a big job? Never done one.

On the upside, the engine seems to be loosening up a bit. Pulls better now between 2500-3500 rpm.

Still not much in the way of low down torque.

Stepto1 · Unread post by **Stepto1** » 08 Mar 2012, 00:01

RE the rear windows. The rear window isolating switch dies appear to work.

However, the switches between the front seats and the switches on the rear doors do nothing at all. They don't even illuminate with the lights at night.

xantia1 · Unread post by **xantia1** » 08 Mar 2012, 13:44

I think I have told you aboout my fuel consumption in another post, mine is 44 ish constant. I will say tho on the performance front as mentioned by another user a few posts up, diesels are all low down power, where you might think you want 3rd say to over take a car, you will have to try to forget everything you did with a petrol, ie if you tried over taking in forth in a n/a petrol at say 50 you may have got that gritted teeth and moving your body back and forth in the seat synareo coming on to get the car to go faster as the other driver is looking at you thinking what you doing!!!, you all know what i mean there!! where in a diesel it will be on boost from just over 2000 rpm so it just pulls and the torque builds up, and that is the key thing, you have bags of pulling torque, to put it in perspective a little 92bhp 1.9 diesel tho may sound small does have 148 ft lbs torque at 2200 rpm, i think a 2.1 has 184 at 2000?? might be wrong there! 2.0 turbo petrol has prob 170ish again with a turbo quite low down ish, but 16v 2.0 i bet has less than 140 and will be at over 4000 rpm, so you have all that torque right where you need it. if you think it is a bit sligish, deff sort the fuel issue, all the filters, oil etc put some decent forte or the like injector cleaner in , is you are happy with you cam belt then drive it foot hard to the floor on the limiter in 2nd and 3rd and hold it a bit then slow down and use all the rev range again holding on the limiter, maybe even try the pickup in the tank, i run mine 100% veg oil when I have good supply and is does clog up with the organism growth that grows in diesel( a sort of black sludge) is isnt a hard job to do, rh back seat base up and support it, v large round cover, remove the clips and get some jubilee clip to replace them, makes it easy next time, pipes off, i would take the clips off or they fall down the pipe and under the car and hard to retrieve undo the plastic holder, I use a serew driver and tap it with your hand, can be tight, once off, take wires off and pull through the gromet in the bodywork to keep them out if the way, pull the whole tol out taking car of the sender arm. you can see the gause on the bottom, when refitting it put some greese on the seal, and it only fits one way, and the sender bit sort of manipulates in through a gap, might take a couple of goes.. after all that if it is still a bit down then you can fiddle with the pump and settings, but I didnt mention that..

JamesQB · Unread post by **JamesQB** » 08 Mar 2012, 14:25

xantia1 wrote:if you tried over taking in forth in a n/a petrol at say 50 you may have got that gritted teeth and moving your body back and forth in the seat synareo coming on to get the car to go faster as the other driver is looking at you thinking what you doing!!!, you all know what i mean there!!

Brilliant succint description. I thought I was the only one who did that, looking like a nutter to anyone watching from the pavements.

Unread post by **Old-Guy** » 08 Mar 2012, 14:41

DickieG wrote:...........Windows, is the relay still in place in the fuse box by the drivers right knee? I believe its the one just behind the diagnostic socket which if your car is a S1 will mean it needs to be removed to plug in the diagnostic plug and may not have been replaced afterwards.

On S1 cars, which relay is where on the under-dash fuse/relay unit, seems to have depended on who fitted the electrics - I don't mean which factory, but which individual! There are lots of different arrangements most of them undocumented! The only reliable way to work out which 'relay' is which is the relay colour (Green - multi-use, Black - multi-use, Grey - buzzer, Orange - timer/relay, Blue - wiper) and then it's a matter of unplugging them one at a time to see what stops working.

As well a fixing the fuel leak, take a careful look at the boost sensor pipe - the small black rubber pipe to the 'flying saucer' on the fuel pump from the big black plastic air pipe that goes over the cam cover. This pipe commonly splits on the underside so the pump doesn't compensate for the turbo boost and seriously under-fuels the engine with a consequent lack of performance!

Stepto1 · Unread post by **Stepto1** » 08 Mar 2012, 22:05

Great. Thanks guys. There just seems to be so little boost. I wouldn't even know it had a turbo.

I had a n/a 1.9 XUD in a 306 and it felt much quicker. (I know it's a lot lighter but still)

Will start checking all the pipes. It seems a mice has been living under the bonnet so I fear nibbled hoses!

Unread post by **Rhothgar** » 08 Mar 2012, 23:26

36 is way too low.

I've averaged 42 over the last 33 months since I started accurately measuring consumption so that is a good, reliable indicator.

In that period, maxed out at 48.054. Minimum 35.170 ( not sure what happened there). On autobahn, you can get 47mpg with smooth driving at max. 80. Minimum 39.180 with AVERAGE speed of 80 (Max 122mph).

On UK motorways 45mpg is good with steady driving. I've filled up tonight after going up and down to Jim's twice this week with approx. 200 miles of around town driving and achieved 45.017.

Once did, 53mpg. (870 miles on one tank).

Stepto1 · Unread post by **Stepto1** » 09 Mar 2012, 11:05

So why am I getting less then 40mpg?

I sat at 80mph for four hours, refilled the tank and worked out the mpg.

I've changed the air filter and fuel filter.

It starts and sounds good.

I have noticed that it NEVER smokes, even at high revs.

Also, it only 'pulls' from about 2500-3500 rpm.

I've always condidered engines without spark plugs witchcraft!

ecohouse1 · Unread post by **ecohouse1** » 09 Mar 2012, 13:07

I get around a steady 42 mpg on my 1.9TD running mostly country A roads an 10% urban stop start. I rarely rev over 3k and because of a buggered gear box with no sychromesh on 3rd I have a leisurely accelaration pace! Just drove to Lancaster & back from Aberdeen and got 45 mpg and all time best was about 46.
When I got the car, I changed all the filters and checked pipes etc- no smoke even on accelerating. It feels like a heavy car though whereas my BX TZD estate - which I take as the equiv predecessor was much much quicker and more frugal. I remember getting 55 mpg on that, and my BX TGD (1.7D non turbo) getting 60mpg on a trip up to the NW of Scotland 10 years ago! Thats progress for you - but at least the Xantia is not dissolving into a pile of Iron oxide at a rate of knots! This is over about 4000 miles since I started using a Xantia in Nov last year. Its all been winter driving. Do they get more economical in the summer?

Unread post by **Northern_Mike** » 09 Mar 2012, 13:21

I used to get between 42 and 45mpg out of my Xantia TDs , a steady 46mpg out of my ZX TD , a seemingly unerring 43mpg out of both my XM 2.1 TDs and around 40mpg out of my N/A 306D.

It seems quite dependent on driving style. There's no point flooring it in any of these cars unless you're in top gear doing 90+ All that happens otherwise is that you create more noise, use more fuel and go no faster. Not pressing the pedal all the way down and using the (very) noticeable part of the rev range where the boost has most effect, between about 1900 and 2700rpm is the way I found most effective.

This does not apply to the 306 NA 1.9D. That's just slow and not very economical whatever you do to it.

Stepto1 · Unread post by **Stepto1** » 09 Mar 2012, 13:57

Perhaps it's just me then?

Or is there anything I should check?

I'll have a look at the vacuum hose to the fuel pump tomorrow. I can get it in the car club on base then and give it a good once over. Any checks or tests?

xantia1 · Unread post by **xantia1** » 09 Mar 2012, 17:56

Just had a thought , I am not sure what year car it is, Has it got a cat???? and if so they can block with time more so when driven gently all the time, hence all the problems with more modern diesels under the same conditions, the options on that are, remove it, there are cleaners on the market you could try one of them or the other option is replace, I put a ne one recently on the step daughters 206 1.9d, made a hell of a difference. If it has a bocsh pump you can also adjust the fuel flow screw see if that makes any difference, it did on mine many years ago, but people had been messing with the pump tho..

Unread post by **Rhothgar** » 09 Mar 2012, 17:58

Stepto1 wrote:it only 'pulls' from about 2500-3500 rpm.

That sounds right to me. Others are quoting S2 torque range. I've never had a non HDi pull from below 2000.

Mine pulls well from about 2600. You can feel it start to spin up at about 2200rpm.

Considering your previous comments about it not being much different to your 1.8i, it doesn't sound as though you drive erratically so I would doubt it is your driving style. Diesels are very forgiving compared to petrol in my experience. You clog a petrol and you can double your fuel consumption.

If you are in Nottingham at the weekend, I can come over and take you out in mine if it gives you something to gauge against, if you want.

If you do follow some of the advice re clogging it to clear it out, make sure you know condition of cam belt. Last thing you need is that snapping.

Unread post by **Northern_Mike** » 09 Mar 2012, 18:36

Rhothgar wrote:
Stepto1 wrote:it only 'pulls' from about 2500-3500 rpm.
That sounds right to me. Others are quoting S2 torque range. I've never had a non HDi pull from below 2000.

I'm not. I never had an S2 TD. Max torque, IIRC on a 1.9TD is at 2250rpm

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