xantia front drop links knocking

jeremy · Unread post by **jeremy** » 03 Apr 2005, 13:21

Could be - Steering rack loose, inner or outer track rod ends, balljoint at bottom of strut or inner wishbone rubbers or even subframe mounts.
Most not that difficult to check if you are careful to get the load off and also look very carefully for things like signs of disturbance round bolt heads which suggests they are loose.
Jeremy

[email protected] · Unread post by **[email protected]** » 04 Apr 2005, 23:12

Thanks jeremy ill have a look tonight at all those things and let you know

[email protected] · Unread post by **[email protected]** » 05 Apr 2005, 01:20

hi jeremy
And everyone ive had a look underneath and there,s nothing loose bottom balljoints and steering knuckles all look ok the only thing i can find is maybe the bottom lower arm bushes might be worn a bit there was tell tale mark there on the subframe but when i tried to lever them with a big screwdriver there was no play can this be the source of my problem lower arm bushes would that couse the knocking
pete..................

broomie · Unread post by **broomie** » 07 Apr 2005, 18:47

I know you're talking Xantia here but on my old BX I had every knock you can imagine
A rattly clanck when going over a pothole or bump points to the droplinks - done
A syrupy feel to steering and a clocnk is often teh wishbone bushes uppper or lower. - done
A loud clunking sound from one side when goling over bumps was a loose front subframe - quite common - its "loose" in terms of it has to be astonsihingly tight to be doen up correctly - done
Then a hush filled ride - lovely
PaulB

Unread post by **RichardW** » 07 Apr 2005, 19:53

Annoying rattle on my previous Xantia turned out to be the track rod end. Could only detect the play with the wheels on the ground at normal height though - hold the ball joint and get someone else to rock the wheels.

[email protected] · Unread post by **[email protected]** » 08 Apr 2005, 00:35

hi guys
Thanks broomie and richard well the steering feels ok and it drives ok but i still have this annoying loud knock when i go over little sharp bumps in the road it seems to sound as the wheels are bouncing over the bumps and its coming from both sides near side being louder than offside but when the car is off the ground there is no play anywhere no side movement in the wheels bearings or anything ill have to get my torque wrench out and check all the bolts under the car subframe bolts etc but i cant see any tell tale movement round any of the bolts eathier but its worrying becouse if i cant find the couse then whatever it is could snap off while im driving or am i worrying unduely its even leading me to think is it time for a part exchange for a turbo diesil xantia earlyer than i wanted to as i love these cars and i wouldnt buy anything else
pete...........

jeremy · Unread post by **jeremy** » 08 Apr 2005, 01:26

You said that the "Bottom" lower wishbones had left a mark on the subframe. I don't think this is right and would suggest that another look at the relevant bush might be useful.
If its the one I think it is and its similar to a BX one it should be rock hard if you lever between the wishbone and the chassis. I know they can go soft as I was surprised to find my 16 valve ones (non runner at the moment) were much softer than my TD BX ones.
Incidentally - have you had a good look at all the other bits in the front of your car - like inner wing shields, bumpers, radiators, engines, gearboxes etc to see if they are tight and the mounts are good? - Does the bonnet shut properly, Is anything touching it (Like a sphere?)
Jeremy

[email protected] · Unread post by **[email protected]** » 08 Apr 2005, 03:53

Thanks Jeremy
That lower arm bush i was talking about is the front bush on the arm i tried to lever it with a large screwdriver and it was indeed solid i also tried the lower arm balljoint with a jackhandle and agian no movement so ill have to look at engine mounts and things like that the front bumper is sound so are the inner wing shields and bonnet is shutting properly the thing is you dont hear it when going over speed humps only when you go over sharp little bumps like cracks in the road, oh just a thought could it be the struts themselves making this noise as it sounds like a heavy double barralled thump.
pete.....................

[email protected] · Unread post by **[email protected]** » 09 Apr 2005, 03:04

One more thing
I need to ask is i have,nt said this before but when i first start up in the morning i have to put the hight lever on high setting first becouse the back and front of the car is down, and if i dont do this the back of the car will rise ok but the front hardly rises at all so hardly no suspension on the front unless i rise the car then let it go down to normal then i can drive off ok its really annoying as it take,s me about 5 minutes before i can drive off im wondering if these two problems are related in any way. Also can anyone tell me what the front accumilater sphere does. and could my problem be front sphere,s anyway
pete..................

jeremy · Unread post by **jeremy** » 09 Apr 2005, 12:57

Pete - has your xantia got anti sink? fitted from some time in 94 I think and briefly has a 2 outlet pump, no flow divider pump and does have a 3rd sphere for each axle as well as anti-sink valves.
If you do have anti sink then the car should not drop over night.
If you don't have anti sink then its much the same as a BX with stronger front struts.
Whichever system it should not be necessary to fiddle with the lever at all if everything is working properly. Indeed i probably move my lever about once a fortninght generally to raise the back for loading or something. I'm sure many levers don't get moved from one year to another.
My guess is that the front height corrector linkage has siezed and needs lubricating. There may be trouble with the plastic link as well. BE CAREFUL YOUR CAR CAN KILL YOU WHEN DEALING WITH THESE PARTS - MAKE SURE ITS PROPERLY SUPPORTED. the linkage can be greased and the most important bit is the actual link on the corrector where the rod goes into the body. this corrodes and needs grease. I find a brush works well for putting the grease on (Thanks someone on here for that tip).
If the linkage isn't free the car will ride at the wrong height. because these cars are load compensating they in fact have a very small suspension travel (you dont need to allow travel for the car to sink 3 inches when loaded) and so a small variation in ride height means its getting near its limits and may contact internal stops - hence a rough ride for no reason.
The accumulator on the regulator is there to smooth the hydraulic supply and to provide a reserve for times when a lot of high pressure LHM is required as well as for emergencies. The regulator should tick no more often than about 30 seconds. If it does the accumulator may be flat and/or the non-return valve in the regulator may need re-seating. A test for the accumulator sphere is to raise the car fully, let it settle and then see if the ticking reduces. When the car is on high in effect it has 4 more accumulators - so the rate should drop. There are other tests, get to normal height, turn off and sit in the boot - the car should drop and after 30 secs rise to its original height. (I think this works with anti-sink).
The anti sink spheres are there to provide a reserve supply after startup when pressure in other parts of the circuit has leaked away. No pressure can cause the suspension to drop when you move off and can also affect the rear brakes.
hope this helps - numerous posts on here about all these bits - so a search may be useful.
jeremy

[email protected] · Unread post by **[email protected]** » 09 Apr 2005, 15:16

Hi jeremy
Thanks for the info my car has no anti sink its the sx model without the airbag that ticking sound youre talking about well on my car its more like a hiss every 20 seconds or so and its been like that ever since ive owned the car its he first xantia ive heard make that sound so that could indicate a problem my last xantia drove like a dream compared to this so i know what they should be like. ive tried spraying the front height corrector linkage with spray grease but no differance maybe ive not sprayed in the right place i really soaked it in the grease there may be a problem with the plastic linkage but when i inspected it the other day it looked sound not broken or disconneted but there could be a problem ive missed under there as its the first time ive ever looked at one. ill try those tests on the accumilater sphere but what are the effects if one actully goes.
egerly awaiting your reply
pete...........

Richard Gallagher · Unread post by **Richard Gallagher** » 09 Apr 2005, 15:55

Just one thought for you, I had a knocking on the front end of an early Xantia.
It turned out that the anti-roll bar had moved across to the nearside, causing it to hit another part of the suspension (I can't off-hand recall what part).
However the strange thing was that after relocating it, it would then move back again to the nearside over the next few weeks. Strange very strange.

jeremy · Unread post by **jeremy** » 09 Apr 2005, 20:20

Anti - roll bar movement is a problem of BX as well I seem to recall - especially 16 valves?
20 secs for regulator cycling is a bit fast. I think your accumulator will be sound and that re-seating the non return valve may need re-seating. Tap the steel ball with a brass punch - detailed instructions probably can be found by searching. If the accumulator is sound this is not urgent but one of those jobs thats 'nice to do'.
Jeremy

[email protected] · Unread post by **[email protected]** » 12 Apr 2005, 04:34

Hi jeremy
well ive tried those tests and with the car on a high setting the accumilator hisses once every 25 seconds approx when let down to normal ride height it hisses once every 50 seconds approx is this hissing normal or should it really be a click (maybe that ball does need reseating) anyway that knocking on the suspension is still there and it sounds nasty so im thinking engine mounts or subframe mounts as i can now hear and feel it coming up through the floor more on the passenger side i did try this test going down the road slowly and disengageing the clutch and letting it back on again so,s to jerk the car and that induced that same sound also one other thing i noticed when stopping at traffic lights gently the near side dips down more than the right when put on the brakes may be the front spheres are going as well
pete.................

jeremy · Unread post by **jeremy** » 12 Apr 2005, 05:05

50 secs at normal height is fine - i'm surprised its faster on normal than high! No need for a positive tick - some regulators tick - sometimes you just hear a sort of muted rattle. The main thing is that it isn't doing it every 10 seconds!
If 'Rocking' the engine produced the noise then you're probably on the right track. The bottom one may be visible from underneath and you can see it all moving when its worn. Sounds vague but you'll know what I mean if you see it. The more likely one is on top of the gearbox and on a BX is buried under the battery. I have replaced a BX rear mount in situ. You are supposed to remove the alloy plate it sits in and the RHS driveshaft and do it on the bench. You may be able to do the same on yours but I have never seen one.
If the car dips on one side just about the only thing it can be is spheres. Try bouncing each front corner and look for differences.
jeremy