Citroen C5 2.0 Hdi engine failure

[citroencurran]

Hi. I own a 2010 C5 2.0 Hdi (160 BHP) tourer. The car has 59,000 miles on it and it was used for family driving about town. I have owned it for 2 years (at 40,000 miles) and it was about to get it's 20,000 mile service until disaster happened nearly 3 weeks ago.
The car was on the local bypass when the stop light came on the dash and the engine stopped. My mother in law was driving so she pulled into the hard shoulder. She tried to start the car again and nothing happened. Her husband came out to get it towed to a local mechanic and when it was being towed, he said that the dash came up "Oil Pressure Low" warning when he turned the key. I left the car to the mechanic as the engine would no longer turn over. He stripped the engine and said that it was completely gone. There was massive damage to it. He thinks that the oil pump failed on the car and there was no oil pressure in the engine causing substantial damage to the pistons as there was no oil. He noted that the car was one of the C5 models that was supposed to be recalled to have it's oil pump replaced by Citroen, and he contacted the local dealer to confirm this. It turns out that I should have been contacted by Citroen for this, however, they sent the letters to the previous owner and not to me to get this work done.
The car was towed to the local dealer (at their request) and it has been there for two weeks as Citroen have been arguing that they have done all they had to do regarding the recall and that the problem was my fault and not theirs. They have now agreed to inspect the vehicle to determine the fault (after a lot of argument and persuasion by me) and quelle surprise! they 'do not believe it to be the oil pump'. They think that the car has an issue with the engine timing as there is damage to the pistons et al. The car has only 60,000 miles and the timing belt is in good condition according to the Citroen mechanic (after I pushed him to answer me about it).
As you all know, the timing belt change interval is recommended at 160,000 miles on these cars. Regardless of the risk of letting it go that long, I was nowhere near the interval for checking it. Further, the previous services had all been done by Citroen dealers and I have done everything in accordance with the Citroen handbook.
I would appreciate any advice on this, especially if anyone can shed any light on the timing issue and what to ask of Citroen when I deal with them again. They could well turn out to be right about the timing, however any input on this would be appreciated as it is an issue that surely should have been a while off in the car's lifetime before it came to light. Thanks.

[Hell Razor5543]

I am somewhat surprised that Citroen didn't check their database when the car came in for servicing. I would expect that if there is a recall, as each car comes in to have the problem resolved the dealership would then update the database to show that the work had been done. Well, that is what I would do.

If they are saying it is due to the timing belt then that would still be down to them. On my Xantia the interval for the belt is either 80,000 miles or 8 years (whichever happens first). On your C5 it is greater, but I cannot believe that either interval has occurred (certainly not the mileage, and highly unlikely the date).

If Citroen have done all the servicing since you took ownership of the C5 then their argument that they did everything they could to deal with the recall doesn't wash. If they have yet to see the vehicle since you took ownership of it (barring the current issue) then they might have a point, but surely if it were a major known fault they could have been able to contact the DVLA to get current owner details.

[RichardW]

Sorry to hear of your woes....

However, I think you are on a hiding to nothing with Citroen. The car is 4 years old and out of warranty. They appear to have made effort to contact the owner (it doesn't sound like a VOSA safety recall where they would have used the DVLA database?). If it has been fully serviced by Citroen, then you may have a case that they should have informed you about the recall, but if it's been serviced outside of the network, then you don't I'm afraid... if that's the case, then I would thank them for their time, remove it from their workshop, source a second hand engine from a scrapper and get your indy to fit it. Ok you're going to be down £1.5 - £2k, but you'll probably end up there anyway with Citroen - and a load of stress to boot! If there is an issue with the oil pump (a quick google didn't seem to suggest so, but it can be wrong fit a new one on the replacement engine before it goes in!

[Gibbo2286]

you should be able to check if any recalls have been made for your car Here: http://www.citroenrecalls.co.uk/one-off-search.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
You'll need to have your reg or vin numbers ready.

[Lighty]

Piston and valve damage can occur when the main bearings fail, due to the pistons going higher in the bores than normal.
The failure will have been oil pressure, but you will get nothing from Citroen, you would similarly get nothing from any manufacturer I am sure.
Best bet would be to find a salvage engine, and get it fitted by an Indy, it will cost more than the value of the car if. Citroen dealers repair it.

[citroencurran]

Lighty, cheers and thanks very much for your help. It is really appreciated. I was wondering, just one more quick question on the matter, the garage told me yesterday that the turbo would have been immediately damaged if there was an oil problem. Is it possible for the turbo not to have been damaged if the oil pressure failed. That is, could the damage that occurred happen and stop the engine before there was any possiblity of damage to the turbo. I am a layman, but its just so that I have a simple understanding of anything they say to me, or at the least, so that I can put it to them if they cannot conclude what caused the problem.

[Lighty]

To be fair, if the engine suffered terminal oil pressure failure the turbo would normally be the first to suffer, due to its Huge running speed, heat and dependency on fresh oil. If the turbo was ok still, I would suspect another fault to be the culprit.
You could pay an I dependant engineer to carry out an autopsy, but this would likely waste more money, that would better be spent repairing it

[Gibbo2286]

It's possible that the turbo failed first and debris from the turbo vanes blocked the oil passages causing the bearing failure, big ends and mains, this is exactly what happened on mine last December. Mine is back on the road after fitting a new (second hand from an engineering works but as new) crankshaft. No piston or valve damage on mine and it's now done some 1500 miles since I fixed it without a hint of any further problem.