XANTIA BLOWER WORKING INTERMITTENTLY

Our most popular forum is for Citroën problems, discussions and chat.
Specialising in AX, BX, ZX, Xantia,C5, Xsara, Saxo and XM. CX, 2cv & Berlingo, all are welcome.NOT for selling cars/parts!

Moderator: RichardW

infidel
Posts: 7
Joined: 03 Sep 2012, 16:32
Location:
My Cars:

XANTIA BLOWER WORKING INTERMITTENTLY

Post by infidel » 28 Sep 2012, 15:37

HI, I have a year 2000 Xantia HDi with what I believe to be a common but rather complex problem: the heater blower works intermittently, shutting off for days at a time, and then coming back on. I know little about auto electrics, and don't understand a lot of what's on other threads. I would be most grateful for any advice!
Thanks,
Stewart
0x

User avatar
CitroJim
A very naughty boy
Posts: 39340
Joined: 30 Apr 2005, 23:33
Location: North Bucks
My Cars: An orange Skoda 120, a pretty blue Pug 207, Sally the white Saxo, a Giant TCR Bike and a Giant TCR Pro Bike.
x 734

Re: XANTIA BLOWER WORKING INTERMITTENTLY

Post by CitroJim » 28 Sep 2012, 16:24

Stewart, being a late S2, most of the common problems suffered by S1 Xantias in this respect do not apply :)

A quick test. Does the blower start up if you 'jiggle' the blower speed control slider around the @AUTO' position? Sometimes it's just bad contacts on the blower slider.

Another very likely one is a bad connection where the 4-way brown plug plugs into the blower unit. The high current flow can cause the contacts to heat up and loose temper. Try disconnecting the plug and re-connecting it.

Do you have access to a multi-meter to assist in measuring voltages around the blower?
0x
Jim

Please note I do not accept PMs...

infidel
Posts: 7
Joined: 03 Sep 2012, 16:32
Location:
My Cars:

Re: XANTIA BLOWER WORKING INTERMITTENTLY

Post by infidel » 28 Sep 2012, 17:51

Jim,
Many thanks for these tips. I'll try what you suggest, and get back to you if they don't work. And if you don't mind, of course!
Stewart
0x

User avatar
CitroJim
A very naughty boy
Posts: 39340
Joined: 30 Apr 2005, 23:33
Location: North Bucks
My Cars: An orange Skoda 120, a pretty blue Pug 207, Sally the white Saxo, a Giant TCR Bike and a Giant TCR Pro Bike.
x 734

Re: XANTIA BLOWER WORKING INTERMITTENTLY

Post by CitroJim » 28 Sep 2012, 18:10

infidel wrote:Jim,
And if you don't mind, of course!


Not at all Stewart :-D
0x
Jim

Please note I do not accept PMs...

citronut
Posts: 10974
Joined: 29 Apr 2005, 00:46
Location: United Kingdom east sussex
My Cars:
x 3

Re: XANTIA BLOWER WORKING INTERMITTENTLY

Post by citronut » 28 Sep 2012, 18:47

so Jim dont the MK2's suffer with ignition switch contacts burning out,

if they do i found on my late MK1 by turning the key in the ignition slightly each way can make it start up again
0x
Regards, malcolm.

current ride a BX 1.7 TZD estate
1986 MK1 BX 1.9na D Auto(in Mothman Andy's stable )
layed up roppy 1.9TD XANT estate, now gone to meet her maker
purple and lilac metalic 2CV(VIOLET)registered to her in doors
1972 DS special been layed up aprox 31 years

User avatar
CitroJim
A very naughty boy
Posts: 39340
Joined: 30 Apr 2005, 23:33
Location: North Bucks
My Cars: An orange Skoda 120, a pretty blue Pug 207, Sally the white Saxo, a Giant TCR Bike and a Giant TCR Pro Bike.
x 734

Re: XANTIA BLOWER WORKING INTERMITTENTLY

Post by CitroJim » 28 Sep 2012, 18:49

citronut wrote:so Jim dont the MK2's suffer with ignition switch contacts burning out,


Not nearly so much Malcolm as most MK2s used a relay to supply the blower as per the mod done to many an S1.

Mind you, you can never totally discount the ignition switch on any Xantia displaying this fault although it is fairly rare.
0x
Jim

Please note I do not accept PMs...

rory_perrett
Posts: 723
Joined: 05 Nov 2001, 20:18
Location: Leeds, Yorkshire
My Cars: Xantia Exclusive 110Hdi Estate 1999

Re: XANTIA BLOWER WORKING INTERMITTENTLY

Post by rory_perrett » 29 Sep 2012, 15:03

(Sorry this post got a bit out of hand, and in hindsight should probably have been done as a flow chart but hopefully it might be useful. As I am not an auto electrician, it is only based on my experience of doing battle with my fan there may be bits missing and bits that are wrong,. In the best wiki tradition, I won’t be offended if others want to add corrections, more bits/ information, etc)

So far faults on my blower have been caused by:
- Bad connection at the brown connector plug at the blower
- Worn out brushes on the blower motor
- Bad connection/broken wire between fuse and blower relay.

The blower motor is located behind the carpet above the passenger’s (feet) footwell. A quick and easy thing to try is to thump the bottom of the motor (engine running and fan control on full speed). This can get it working again and indicates a bad connection, sticking motor, or worn out/ sticking motor brushes.

To investigate you really need a multimeter or at least a way of testing where you have power and continuity (12v bulb and a couple of wires would be a start).
Starting at the blower, with the engine running, check that there is a 12v supply at the motor by putting your meter (or bulb) across the thick red and black wires. If there is power then it is either a problem with the control circuit or in the motor itself.

Motor Check.
The motor speed control module is within the motor housing. To check the motor, apply 12v direct to the motor, if it runs (at full speed) then it is ok and you need to look at the control circuit. If it does not work then the motor needs taking out and looking at starting with the brushes. If they are ok you need to check the continuity across the motor, no continuity indicates that is the problem, if there is continuity then try the direct 12v test again as it should work.
Motor Power Supply.

The main power supply for the blower motor comes from Fuse 21. If there was not 12v supply at the motor check that there is 12v at Fuse 21. (In car fuse box by steering column) and check that the Fuse is not blown.

If there is not 12v at Fuse 21 it is supplied from the main Power Fuse B, which is located in the engine bay. Check this there is no power at Fuse 21.
The power feed from Fuse 21 goes to terminal 3 on the blower supply relay which is located under the dashboard just above the accelerator pedal. Remove the relay and check that there is 12v at the relay plug terminal 3.

If there is 12v power at the relay plug terminal 3, put a jumper cable across from rely plug terminal 3 and terminal 5 and check once again if there is now 12v power supply at the motor brown plug.

If jumping terminals 3 and 5 restores power to the motor (although with the relay removed the motor won’t run) then you need to look at the relay. Check that the relay is operating by applying 12v across terminals 1 and 2 and listen for the click. If it is clicking, check that there is continuity between terminals 3 and 5 of the relay.

If the relay is operating correctly the next stage is to look at the power supply to the relay. The blower relay switched using a power supply from Fuse 5. Check that there is a 12 v supply at Fuse 5. This fuse is fed from the ignition switch. If there is 12v at Fuse 5 then check that there is also 12v at terminal 1 of the blower motor relay plug.

After all the above, if no fault has been identified then you are left with,a problem with the blower motor speed control module, heater controls or the heating/air conditioning ECU.

This copied from CitroJim’s post here (and there is useful link to a Series 2 Wiring Diagram)
viewtopic.php?t=25122
and gives the voltage outputs expected at the motor control wire.

“With reference to the diagram, Item 8045 is the blower speed regulator and Item 8080 is the Climate ECU. Item 8025 is the heater control panel which includes the fan speed slider. It's not a switch, it's a pot.

Looking at Item 8045, Pin 3 (wire 16, orange) is the speed control input from the ECU. There will be a voltage here and this varies with fan speed.

Typical voltages are as follows:

Note the engine must be running. Outside temp about 18 degrees, car parked in full sun. Measured on a MK1 2.1TD.

Slider set to off: 12V (actually full battery voltage)
Slider at speed 1: 9.8V
Slider at speed 2: 8.4V
Slider at speed 3: 5.6V
Slider at full speed: 0.9V (almost earth)
Slider on Auto: 7.5V approx.

As can be seen, an earth on this wire will give full speed whereas full battery voltage will stop it.”

If the control wire is operating as indicated above this would suggest that the problem lies with the motor speed control module. If there is a problem with the control wire voltages (ie 12 volts all the time, therefore fan off) the problem is with the heater controls or ECU.
0x

User avatar
CitroJim
A very naughty boy
Posts: 39340
Joined: 30 Apr 2005, 23:33
Location: North Bucks
My Cars: An orange Skoda 120, a pretty blue Pug 207, Sally the white Saxo, a Giant TCR Bike and a Giant TCR Pro Bike.
x 734

Re: XANTIA BLOWER WORKING INTERMITTENTLY

Post by CitroJim » 29 Sep 2012, 16:29

Rory, what an excellent Post. That needs to be a sticky :-D
0x
Jim

Please note I do not accept PMs...

User avatar
myglaren
Forum Admin Team
Posts: 13723
Joined: 02 Mar 2008, 14:30
Location: Washington
My Cars: 2003 C5 2.0 HDi 110 SX 220,400
x 210

Re: XANTIA BLOWER WORKING INTERMITTENTLY

Post by myglaren » 29 Sep 2012, 18:02

Stickied it but I think that post should be a stand-alone item in HowTo or Hints & Tips.
0x
________________________________
Steve

Jackie Evancho

User avatar
CitroJim
A very naughty boy
Posts: 39340
Joined: 30 Apr 2005, 23:33
Location: North Bucks
My Cars: An orange Skoda 120, a pretty blue Pug 207, Sally the white Saxo, a Giant TCR Bike and a Giant TCR Pro Bike.
x 734

Re: XANTIA BLOWER WORKING INTERMITTENTLY

Post by CitroJim » 29 Sep 2012, 18:50

myglaren wrote:Stickied it but I think that post should be a stand-alone item in HowTo or Hints & Tips.


Absolutely right Steve :wink:
0x
Jim

Please note I do not accept PMs...

citronut
Posts: 10974
Joined: 29 Apr 2005, 00:46
Location: United Kingdom east sussex
My Cars:
x 3

Re: XANTIA BLOWER WORKING INTERMITTENTLY

Post by citronut » 30 Sep 2012, 11:36

who'z nicked your avitar Jim :shock: :wink:
0x
Regards, malcolm.

current ride a BX 1.7 TZD estate
1986 MK1 BX 1.9na D Auto(in Mothman Andy's stable )
layed up roppy 1.9TD XANT estate, now gone to meet her maker
purple and lilac metalic 2CV(VIOLET)registered to her in doors
1972 DS special been layed up aprox 31 years

User avatar
myglaren
Forum Admin Team
Posts: 13723
Joined: 02 Mar 2008, 14:30
Location: Washington
My Cars: 2003 C5 2.0 HDi 110 SX 220,400
x 210

Re: XANTIA BLOWER WORKING INTERMITTENTLY

Post by myglaren » 30 Sep 2012, 12:37

citronut wrote:who'z nicked your avitar Jim :shock: :wink:

:?:
0x
________________________________
Steve

Jackie Evancho

User avatar
CitroJim
A very naughty boy
Posts: 39340
Joined: 30 Apr 2005, 23:33
Location: North Bucks
My Cars: An orange Skoda 120, a pretty blue Pug 207, Sally the white Saxo, a Giant TCR Bike and a Giant TCR Pro Bike.
x 734

Re: XANTIA BLOWER WORKING INTERMITTENTLY

Post by CitroJim » 01 Oct 2012, 07:39

myglaren wrote:
citronut wrote:who'z nicked your avitar Jim :shock: :wink:

:?:


My Internet went down yesterday and I didn't notice for a long time because I was busy doing absolutely nothing at all :oops:
0x
Jim

Please note I do not accept PMs...

infidel
Posts: 7
Joined: 03 Sep 2012, 16:32
Location:
My Cars:

Re: XANTIA BLOWER WORKING INTERMITTENTLY

Post by infidel » 02 Oct 2012, 10:47

Thanks, Rory, for that extraordinarily comprehensive reply: and Jim, for your extremely helpful advice. Much appreciated..................
Stewart
0x

User avatar
gadgetgricey
Posts: 323
Joined: 29 Jun 2006, 22:21
Location:
My Cars:

Re: XANTIA BLOWER WORKING INTERMITTENTLY

Post by gadgetgricey » 05 Oct 2012, 18:43

I just wanted to add my Thanks for the post, as finally going to try and sort the blower on my Xantia tomorrow.

Time has been difficult at weekends, and also had the luxury of a second car on cold mornings, so not been essential to fix straight away. Also as it went through its MOT on Wednesday not needing any work, I feel its only fair on the car :lol:

Hopefull some of you lot will be around at the weekend for advice and guidance when it all goes horribly wrong.....

Cheers

- Dave -
0x
Xantia Hdi Exclusive Estate , Xantia Hdi SX Estate (spares car)