1998 xantia indicator issue

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foeism
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1998 xantia indicator issue

Post by foeism » 28 Sep 2014, 13:44

hi

My indicator to turn right, is fine, all four of my hazard lights work great, but when I want to turn left the indcator light flashes on the console and the front indicator bulb dose not work (tried it at night) and checked the bulb.

Before I buy a second hand indicator stalk, is this a quick fix? Tried to search, bit nothing for my indicator stalk problem.

Thanks
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Re: 1998 xantia indicator issue

Post by Hell Razor5543 » 28 Sep 2014, 14:14

When you indicate left is there rapid clicking from the dashboard? If you firmly hold down the stalk does it indicate normally? There is a known issue with the stalk, in that (over time) the grease gets dirty, and allows some shorting to occur. I have this happening on Gracie (but when she indicates right), but I have a replacement stalk.
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Re: 1998 xantia indicator issue

Post by foeism » 28 Sep 2014, 15:22

Hi

Yes there is a rapid clicking, just like when the indicator bulb blows, sometines there's no clicking and none of the n/s indicators work.

is it worth taking out the stalk and cleaning it, before heading to the scrappies to get a second hand one?

Thanks
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Re: 1998 xantia indicator issue

Post by Hell Razor5543 » 28 Sep 2014, 17:42

It is repairable, provided you are careful. There are a couple of potential pitfalls (one of which caught me out), so be careful. I am sorry that I didn't take any pictures.

You will need the following;

Brasso (or similar metal polish),
Vaseline,
T20 and T10 screwdrivers,
Small blade screwdriver (watchmaker size),
Paper towel and toothbrush (depending on the contacts),
Proper contact cleaner (NOT WD40!),
A clear area to work on the stalk,
Patience!

Turn the steering wheel so that the largest opening in it is in line with the indicator stalk (this is to allow easy access to the stalk retaining screws). Lower the steering wheel to its lowest position. On the underside of the steering wheel cowling are two screws holding the halves together. Using the T20 screwdriver, undo these. Now prise off the top cowling (there are also two clips, one on either side, roughly behind the stalks). You should now see the two stalk retaining screws (you might need to hold down the lower cowling to see the bottom screw). Undo these (using a T10 screwdriver), and then slide the stalk directly away from the steering wheel. Once it is clear, unlatch the two cables. Be careful here, the grey bit at the head can slide down the body of the plug onto the wrong side of the latch (this is what caused me problems, as now the smaller plug wouldn't seat properly, and I lost all lights. When I found what the problem was, and slid it back into its' correct position the lights started working again).

Now take the stalk to the clear working area. Take a good look at it before you take it apart, as you must make sure to get it back together properly (the tricky one is the return lever, on the other side of the mechanism from the stalk). Be aware that, as you open it up, there are five springs inside, two for the latching function, two for the return lever, and one for the indicator contacts, and if you are not careful they might make a bid for freedom! Rotate the main light barrel to the middle position (it makes it easier when putting things back together). The top face is held in place by four clips. Using a very small blade screwdriver, open the body away from these (you cannot push the clips in, they are part of the top face. Once the top face is unclipped, very carefully lift it off (the return lever and springs should come with it). Carefully dismantle the lever parts you can see, making sure you know how to put them back together. There is a black moulding, which has, on the upper surface, two white cams (with brass wheels) that are sprung. These cams engage into mouldings on the inside of the top face, and are what hold the indicator stalk in the relevant positions. On the underside of that black moulding is a hole, which has a sprung copper cone. This cone is what is the problem (as well as the grease in the contacts area). Take the cone out, and polish the heck out of it (mine originally looked like an old copper coin, more brown than pink!). Then clean out the old grease (it will also be brown). If the contacts in the body look dirty, clean them using the contact cleaner and toothbrush. Replace the grease with the Vaseline, smearing it around the contacts and the sliding surfaces. Put some into the hole the copper contact cone came out of, and some on the cone spring (to keep it in the cone should you drop them). You can now start to re-assemble the stalk.

Before doing so, check you haven't rotated the light barrel (because if you have, and you re-assemble it with that barrel in the wrong position, you will have to take it apart again!). Look into the body of the switch, on the end away from the indicator contacts, and you will see a sliding item. This needs to be in the middle position (and shouldn't have moved unless something moved it). This is part of the light switch, and is moved by the rotating arm of the light barrel. Assuming these are in the correct position, you can continue (if not, move them to the correct positions). This next bit is fiddly, hence the need for patience! Return the sprung copper cone to its hole. Refit the inner moulding to the lever arm. Line the arm assembly to the top face piece, making sure the cams line up properly and the return lever is fully pushed in, so all that is protruding is the rectangular bit (if the triangular bit is protruding it won't return the indicator stalk to the rest position). Now refit the main body. All being well, everything should work. Check the mechanicals (rotate the light switches); when you move the indicator arm the return arm pops out a bit. Push it back into place, and then move it up and down. This should cause the indicator stalk to return to its rest position. All being well, you can return the stalk to the car.

It is fiddly. It took me longer to clean up the stalk than to get it out and back in (barring the latch issue described).

Good luck, and happy spannering!

EDIT; I used Vaseline as I have it available, and (AFAIK) it does not have any electrical conductivity issues. However, if I am wrong, I would then suggest using a silicone grease, as it definitely is safe electrically.
Last edited by Hell Razor5543 on 29 Sep 2014, 10:20, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: 1998 xantia indicator issue

Post by foeism » 28 Sep 2014, 17:54

Excellent write up, surley worthy of a sticky?

Thank you for taking the time to write this up.

I shall report back in the next few days, when my patience returns!
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Re: 1998 xantia indicator issue

Post by CitroJim » 29 Sep 2014, 05:45

James, an excellent write-up. Well done sir :-D =D>
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Hell Razor5543
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Re: 1998 xantia indicator issue

Post by Hell Razor5543 » 29 Sep 2014, 09:38

Right, here we go with the photos. I didn't take any of the assembly process, as I needed both hands to hold things together, and didn't have an assistant to take the pictures.

First, a top view of the stalk assembly, with the return lever in its default position;

http://s1033.photobucket.com/user/james ... ort=3&o=60

Now a side view of the assembly. Just below the slide groove are 2 of the 4 clips holding the top cover in place (there are another 2 on the other side). Using a very small blade screwdriver, carefully lever the body off the clips, and gently push the top cover off the body;

http://s1033.photobucket.com/user/james ... ort=3&o=59

Now a shot of the inner face of the top cover. You can see the retaining detents for the lever latch, just to the left of the white component. You can also see the return lever, with both springs. On the upper side is a large peg (which engages a groove in the white component on the top cover), while on the lower side is a shorter peg that engages in the inner moulding (which will be shown later);

http://s1033.photobucket.com/user/james ... ort=3&o=58

This is the inner moulding, which engages with the indicator lever. This is the top side, showing both cams (the sprung white parts with brass wheels), and the 'V' shaped moulding the peg mentioned earlier meshes with (it works around the lower outside space of the V, not the inner space);

http://s1033.photobucket.com/user/james ... ort=3&o=57

This is the lower side of the inner moulding, with the copper cone in position. You may see that the nose of the cone is tarnished;

http://s1033.photobucket.com/user/james ... ort=3&o=56

Inside the body of the assembly. You can see the grease is discoloured (at the top of the body, around the contacts), and at the bottom of the body is the slide for the light barrel;

http://s1033.photobucket.com/user/james ... ort=3&o=55

This shows the small black lever (at the end of the silver section) that engages with the light slide, and a white cam that engages the inner moulding;

http://s1033.photobucket.com/user/james ... ort=3&o=54

Copper cone, before;

http://s1033.photobucket.com/user/james ... ort=3&o=53

and after cleaning;

http://s1033.photobucket.com/user/james ... ort=3&o=52

You must get this clean, especially the nose (that is what touches the contacts shown). You don't need to clean its' copper spring, as all this does is to hold the cone to the contacts. I then removed all the grease using paper towel, and replaced it with Vaseline (also greasing the places where parts slide against each other). At this point I cannot take photos, as both hands are required to re-assemble the unit. Make sure that the slide is in the middle position, and the light barrel is in its middle position as well.

Fit the sprung copper cone to its place in the inner moulding. Re-fit the inner moulding to the indicator stalk, making sure the white cam is properly engaged the inner moulding. Now fit the top cover to the stalk assembly, making sure the return lever is engaged with the V of the inner moulding, and the cams are in the detents. Once you have done this, carefully line up the main body and press it home. This is fiddly, and can take a couple of goes to get it right.

Happy spannering (again!).
Last edited by Hell Razor5543 on 14 Mar 2017, 10:23, edited 6 times in total.
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James
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Re: 1998 xantia indicator issue

Post by foeism » 29 Sep 2014, 21:22

Outstanding!

Pictures make it so much more easier!

Thanks
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Hell Razor5543
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Re: 1998 xantia indicator issue

Post by Hell Razor5543 » 29 Sep 2014, 23:20

Thanks, gents.
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James
ex BX 1.9
ex Xantia 2.0HDi SX
ex Xantia 2.0HDi LX

C5 VTR HDi estate, 76518762
Out amongst the stars, looking for a world of my own!

foeism
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Re: 1998 xantia indicator issue

Post by foeism » 04 Oct 2014, 13:32

Well spent the morning doing this cleaned the contacts, re greased with vaseline.....and still the same, fast flaher on dashboard like the front near side indicator bulb blown, but works fine on hazards?!
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Re: 1998 xantia indicator issue

Post by myglaren » 04 Oct 2014, 13:41

They often do work OK on hazards, possible three bulbs + repeaters present sufficient load to have it ignore one bulb U/S.

Have you checked the connections to the one that doesn't work?
I had a similar problem on this C5. It was a new headlamp unit (car has clearly been crashed at some point) but the flasher bulb was intermittently failing.
Had to remove the headlamp unit and the contacts in it were burning out.
Replaced the contact points a couple of times with solder but the the dipped beam went the same way, bought a pair of replacement headlamps and all has been fine since.

Pull the problem unit out and check it is actually receiving a signal.
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Re: 1998 xantia indicator issue

Post by foeism » 04 Oct 2014, 13:52

Thanks

Will start with the front nearside indicator, and see whta I can find.
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Re: 1998 xantia indicator issue

Post by Hell Razor5543 » 05 Oct 2014, 07:31

I would put the hazards on and then take a walk around the car. You will soon see the blown light bulb. By the way, there are a total of 6 indicator bulbs; 2 front, 2 side, and 2 rear. If any of these are blown you will get the symptoms you are experiencing.
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James
ex BX 1.9
ex Xantia 2.0HDi SX
ex Xantia 2.0HDi LX

C5 VTR HDi estate, 76518762
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Re: 1998 xantia indicator issue

Post by foeism » 05 Oct 2014, 19:30

Hell Razor

Thanks to your guide, I had the confidence to take apart my indicator stalk, and at least now it's clean and been re greased.

Myglaren
I started at the front nearside indicator and found on taking the holder out there was some corrosion where the buld sits a quick rub down and indicator working!!

Thanks for your help :-D
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Re: 1998 xantia indicator issue

Post by myglaren » 05 Oct 2014, 19:43

Pleased you got it fixed without further problems.

At least you have a nice clean and freshly greased stalk into the bargain.
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