Head Gasket problem!?
Moderator: RichardW
Head Gasket problem!?
Just bought a car off ebay, sold with a suspected knackered head gasket.It is pushing water out of the header and there are 'gases' coming out when the cap is taken off. Head gasket? Otherwise the engine runs fine and you couldn't really tell otherwise.
Bought the car for £150. Its a 95 1.9td vsx in Excellent condition, full s/h and all 8 spheres had been replaced in the last year.
Luckily I have a spare 1.9 td engine (127k) which I am going to stick in (when I get some spare time!!).
What I am eventually getting at is.. what to do with the old engine? Is it worth replacing the gasket and selling it? How much of a pain is putting a new gasket on (when the engine is out)? how much would you get for the engine as is?
Bought the car for £150. Its a 95 1.9td vsx in Excellent condition, full s/h and all 8 spheres had been replaced in the last year.
Luckily I have a spare 1.9 td engine (127k) which I am going to stick in (when I get some spare time!!).
What I am eventually getting at is.. what to do with the old engine? Is it worth replacing the gasket and selling it? How much of a pain is putting a new gasket on (when the engine is out)? how much would you get for the engine as is?
yeah I guess it would be easier to if the current engine could stay in the car and be fixed. I have never done a head gasket before and have absolutely no idea with whats involved.
Obviously the top of the engine has to come off; how straight forward is this? I know that in general no job on a Citroen is straight forward!;). And I guess some 'special' tools will be required. When i say special I mean something which doesn't come in a socket set, cause thats all I have got!! But I am fortunate enough to have a friend with a workshop and 50 yrs experience as a mechanic!
I just wanted to get a few pointers myself to see if I can do most of the donkey work.
Also what are the repercussions of driving the car at the mo with this problem? Is it ok to drive? I had to drive it back last night after I picked it up (150 miles). Can I cause any serious damage if the head gasket completely goes?
Cheers.
Obviously the top of the engine has to come off; how straight forward is this? I know that in general no job on a Citroen is straight forward!;). And I guess some 'special' tools will be required. When i say special I mean something which doesn't come in a socket set, cause thats all I have got!! But I am fortunate enough to have a friend with a workshop and 50 yrs experience as a mechanic!
I just wanted to get a few pointers myself to see if I can do most of the donkey work.
Also what are the repercussions of driving the car at the mo with this problem? Is it ok to drive? I had to drive it back last night after I picked it up (150 miles). Can I cause any serious damage if the head gasket completely goes?
Cheers.
Checked the haynes manual, I know it sometimes goes a bit OTT with its instructions sometimes, but it suggests checking the piston protusion height in order to get the right gasket etc. Is this strictly necessary?
Also how can you tell whether the cylinder head needs to be skimmed? And if it does require skimming do the valves and assc bits need to be removed?
I have removed the engine and trans out of my other xantia and done a swap. Although not that easy it didn't seem to be as complicated as this. What is the general opinion about either a head job or engine swap? Due to experience I would rather opt for the swap because I know what I am doing and have done it once already.
Also how can you tell whether the cylinder head needs to be skimmed? And if it does require skimming do the valves and assc bits need to be removed?
I have removed the engine and trans out of my other xantia and done a swap. Although not that easy it didn't seem to be as complicated as this. What is the general opinion about either a head job or engine swap? Due to experience I would rather opt for the swap because I know what I am doing and have done it once already.
HG
You need to check flatness of the cylinder head -s oem swear by passing ametal rule across any deviation means - has to be skimmed - otehrwise get it professionaly checked. Also look for cracks especially between valve ports - smalll ones can be "welded" otherwise throw it away.
If you skim, more than the tiniest amount off you will need to adjust size of HG to suit and re shim/adjust teh valves heights to suit.
Allow for a a big job in terms of time then if you have any lucky breaks you will feel good!
I had a spare XUD engine for my HG failed BX - it turned out the spare was in WORSE conition than the engine in the car!
PaulB
You need to check flatness of the cylinder head -s oem swear by passing ametal rule across any deviation means - has to be skimmed - otehrwise get it professionaly checked. Also look for cracks especially between valve ports - smalll ones can be "welded" otherwise throw it away.
If you skim, more than the tiniest amount off you will need to adjust size of HG to suit and re shim/adjust teh valves heights to suit.
Allow for a a big job in terms of time then if you have any lucky breaks you will feel good!
I had a spare XUD engine for my HG failed BX - it turned out the spare was in WORSE conition than the engine in the car!
PaulB
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sounds like its gone. good check to try never done it before but might help u
just up from the pump theres a bleed screw for the cooling stick a pressue gauge on it and rev engine see what happens also feel the top hose see if its starting to blow up like a balloon and get hard if it goes rock hard fair chance its the head gasket.
when i done my head i used a gasket called "metalflex" the guys at the engine shop sware by them and dont forget the new bolts as they strech. u could always try a nip on the bolts before u go in with big guns
just up from the pump theres a bleed screw for the cooling stick a pressue gauge on it and rev engine see what happens also feel the top hose see if its starting to blow up like a balloon and get hard if it goes rock hard fair chance its the head gasket.
when i done my head i used a gasket called "metalflex" the guys at the engine shop sware by them and dont forget the new bolts as they strech. u could always try a nip on the bolts before u go in with big guns
Before buying anything just make sure that the studs will remove from the engine block. On my Dads previous BX 16 when I removed the cyinder head studs to replace a cracked liner they actually sheared off (well three did) as they had been put in dry and had fused to the alloy block. Don't know if this is a common problem but it's a sure engine binner if it happens.
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No, Commy. Only the 16V has an alloy block. That's what drills and Helicoils are for. You wouldn't bin a Bugatti* Engine for this; You'd mend it.
Tools: T55 Torx bit. Elastoplast.
Sovereign check: Cold engine. Start and run for 30 seconds. Remove coolant filler cap.
Fountain? Blown HG for certain. No fountain? HG probably OK.
* For Bugatti read Ferrari. First anorak who knows why can beat Mike to the answer!
Tools: T55 Torx bit. Elastoplast.
Sovereign check: Cold engine. Start and run for 30 seconds. Remove coolant filler cap.
Fountain? Blown HG for certain. No fountain? HG probably OK.
* For Bugatti read Ferrari. First anorak who knows why can beat Mike to the answer!
Interesting Tom I stand corrected on the metal composition of the block.
I agree that snapped studs is not a truly terminal problem but in reality for a BX engine you have to admit it is. You must have a slightly Citro-centric view of the world to include Ciroen in the same sentence as Buggati and Ferrrari[;)]
But my point is still a valid one, make sure that the studs remove OK before proceeding or purchasing components. Especially if you find that on removal of one it has been put in dry and by dry I mean no oil on the threads.
I agree that snapped studs is not a truly terminal problem but in reality for a BX engine you have to admit it is. You must have a slightly Citro-centric view of the world to include Ciroen in the same sentence as Buggati and Ferrrari[;)]
But my point is still a valid one, make sure that the studs remove OK before proceeding or purchasing components. Especially if you find that on removal of one it has been put in dry and by dry I mean no oil on the threads.
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Nope. Each of them made cars that were either A: beautiful, or B: cleverly engineered.
Bugattis can of course be mentioned here; this is after all a French car forum!
Sixteen valvers being rare, I'd never scrap a block. I'd never use oil on the threads either. Copper grease is mandatory when fitting steel threads to Alloy blocks or you'll
run into real corrosion problems. Iron blocks don't suffer so badly from snapped studs because they don't have the dissimilar metal problem. To strip an alloy block without snapping threads, just dump the whole engine in diesel and wait. Three months. It will then come apart with no fuss whatsoever. Aviation archaeologists use this technique to dismantle engines that have lain buried underground for nearly sixty years.
Bugattis can of course be mentioned here; this is after all a French car forum!
Sixteen valvers being rare, I'd never scrap a block. I'd never use oil on the threads either. Copper grease is mandatory when fitting steel threads to Alloy blocks or you'll
run into real corrosion problems. Iron blocks don't suffer so badly from snapped studs because they don't have the dissimilar metal problem. To strip an alloy block without snapping threads, just dump the whole engine in diesel and wait. Three months. It will then come apart with no fuss whatsoever. Aviation archaeologists use this technique to dismantle engines that have lain buried underground for nearly sixty years.
I thought all BV petrol engines except 1.4's were alloy blocked wet liner engines. I think the later 1.4's are alloy blocked as well as the 1.4 diesel engine as used in AX but don't now if they are linered and if so, dry or wet. Later petrol engines are iron blocked.
I too endorse the greasing of studs before fitting but am surprised that the introduction of another metal is recommended! I would use plain LM or something and hope that the lithium component of the soap part was stable.
jeremy
I too endorse the greasing of studs before fitting but am surprised that the introduction of another metal is recommended! I would use plain LM or something and hope that the lithium component of the soap part was stable.
jeremy