C5x7 3rd time steering leaking

[xantia_v6]

The sleeve should be a tight fit on the shaft, they require pressing or hammering on , but if correctly sized, with a correct mandrel, it should slide on with moderate force.

[MattBLancs]

Depending on what I find, I'm hoping to clean up the shaft surface on a lathe and hopefully it will leave it in a state that's kind to the sleeve. I still think I'll use the metal resin though.

I think that is a good plan. In theory you could ignore any worries about getting the current shaft nice and round (as the lathe would do) and just hack the rust off with angle grinder flap disk. On the premise the Belzona will plug an uneven gap just as well as a nice round one.

Looking at the SKF site the sleeve fitting instructions talk about bad surfaces being transferred to the sleeve outer.

Interesting, that sort of reinforces my worries about it being a closer fit but not very round.

I they talk about the sleeve design having a surface finish that is optimised for single direction shaft rotation and rpm but since this is only a steering shaft I think that's not a concern.

Anyway, I won't know a thing about the sleeve until i can get an accurate set of measurements off the cleaned up shaft.

I agree, a shaft turning at high speed (and reversing too) would be much more challenging than our barely rotating steering shaft.


Found the thread with the juicy pictures (and speedi / speedy / speedie sleeve details)
viewtopic.php?p=748419&hilit=Speedi#p748419

[MattBLancs]

The sleeve should be a tight fit on the shaft, they require pressing or hammering on , but if correctly sized, with a correct mandrel, it should slide on with moderate force.

Interested in your thoughts on my musings above as we seem to have a difference in opinion.

My reply and yours landed at nearly the same moment

[aerodynamica]

Depending on what I find, I'm hoping to clean up the shaft surface on a lathe and hopefully it will leave it in a state that's kind to the sleeve. I still think I'll use the metal resin though.

I think that is a good plan. In theory you could ignore any worries about getting the current shaft nice and round (as the lathe would do) and just hack the rust off with angle grinder flap disk. On the premise the Belzona will plug an uneven gap just as well as a nice round one.

Looking at the SKF site the sleeve fitting instructions talk about bad surfaces being transferred to the sleeve outer.

Interesting, that sort of reinforces my worries about it being a closer fit but not very round.

I they talk about the sleeve design having a surface finish that is optimised for single direction shaft rotation and rpm but since this is only a steering shaft I think that's not a concern.

Anyway, I won't know a thing about the sleeve until i can get an accurate set of measurements off the cleaned up shaft.

I agree, a shaft turning at high speed (and reversing too) would be much more challenging than our barely rotating steering shaft.


Found the thread with the juicy pictures (and speedi / speedy / speedie sleeve details)
viewtopic.php?p=748419&hilit=Speedi#p748419

Ha, I also fount that thread separately with the pictures etc and it's now bookmarked for quick reference.

Also found a YT video of a chap I used to know as DocChevron who went through this whole sage and recorded it all including lots of quite justified swearing. Complete with terrible refurb steering rack and awful pipes. I am kind of hoping since my rack has only been in 2 years that the pipes might not be as bad.... I've just jinxed it haven't I.

In the vid in around 2023 he's talking about doing his own pipes and pile unions to replace the awful Citroen design. Not quite got to that stage yet.

[MattBLancs]

Ah interesting, had a quick search on YouTube for Doc Chevron but not immediately obvious - no rush, but if you have a link I'll have a watch when I get chance

[myglaren]

Elusive but perhaps refers to this:-

https://bxclub.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=15432

[aerodynamica]

Elusive but perhaps refers to this:-

https://bxclub.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=15432

That's him

[myglaren]

Couldn't get any closer as I seem to have lost my log in details for the bxclub.

[aerodynamica]

Oh and this was the first of his films I watched.



Going through some orne of his C5 vids, he's had every single same thing I've had go on mine

[Sloppysod]

.......... SKF site the sleeve fitting instructions talk about bad surfaces being transferred to the sleeve outer........ but since this is only a steering shaft I think that's not a concern.

A speedysleeve is only 0.010"(0.28mm) thick so it will deform to the surface underneath. And it would be a concern, you need the under surface smooth.

[KennyW]

Graeme,

Never took C5 x 7 rack and pinion apart,did so with Xantia mk2 1.9 TD so can't confirm the insides. I also recall a thread on this site talking about speedysleeves

[aerodynamica]

Graeme,

Never took C5 x 7 rack and pinion apart,did so with Xantia mk2 1.9 TD so can't confirm the insides. I also recall a thread on this site talking about speedysleeves

Well Kenny, I looked at a video and I think the pinion can be removed without doing much to the rack etc. At least the pinion housing itself where all the trouble happens. I have the viton O rings already for the possible trouble with the pipes, have the chemical metal on order and hope to have another rack by the end of the week to look at. Also have a spare pressure pipe that goes from the steering pump to the pinion valve. The alloy return pipe is the one that was modified last time by Wakefield power steering services and I hope their modified pipe doesn't cause any untoward problem when it finally comes to the actual job but remains to be seen! I'm likely going down the speedisleeve route after I can confirm the size needed. I am a little concerned on how short speedisleeves appear to be. I think that even with it in place and the oil seal running on the nice smooth sleeve, there will be a considerable amount of still exposed steering shaft. I am also going to carry out the rubber boot cover idea too. Although a full CV boot covering it the first time in 2022 didn't prevent it failing within a year but that might have been a poorly manufactured refurb rack like the one in docchevron's 2nd. video. I'll do the CV boot cover anyway so hope we have a double protected set up. Marine grease to cap it all as well. None of this does anything to protect the alloy low pressure return pipe connection but I might try some thing to strengthen that too. But at this stage it's all dreaming.

[MattBLancs]

.......... SKF site the sleeve fitting instructions talk about bad surfaces being transferred to the sleeve outer........ but since this is only a steering shaft I think that's not a concern.

A speedysleeve is only 0.010"(0.28mm) thick so it will deform to the surface underneath. And it would be a concern, you need the under surface smooth.

Apologies, just to be clear as a couple of points have been brought together in the quoting above:

Speedy sleeve marketed for rotation in one direction only, but steering rack pinion turns both ways = Don't think that is a concern.

Lumpy bumpy shaft + speedy sleeve = lumpy bumpy speedy sleeve = bad. Think we are all in collective agreement.


Thanks for the YouTube link above. His channel name ( Adventures in rust ) is familiar but don't recall the rack video, surprised Id not seen it

[PATaMAT]

the spindle is machined to a smooth surface, the gasket is then 19x30x7
https://www.rajce.idnes.cz/citroxa/album/servo-c5-x7

[aerodynamica]

the spindle is machined to a smooth surface, the gasket is then 19x30x7
https://www.rajce.idnes.cz/citroxa/album/servo-c5-x7

Thank you. And thank you for your photos. I see you opted to remove the block on the outside to allow a rubber gaiter to fit on.

Question: are the oil seals easy to remove? Picture 7.

Thanks,
Graeme